Athletes and Guns: STUCK ON STUPID

BY Bernard Fernandez ON April 01, 2013
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robert guerrero, gun, JFK, flotyd mayweatherAfter his final bid for a berth on the American boxing team that would compete in the 2012 London Olympics had ended with an upset, double-tiebreaker computer loss to Terrell Gausha in the U.S. National Championships, Jesse Hart angrily suggested he just might quit the sport altogether.

Asked if his talented son might actually walk away from the ring forever because of the bitter disappointment he had just experienced, Hart’s father, former middleweight contender Eugene “Cyclone” Hart, shrugged and said, “We ain’t going to stay stuck on stupid.” And Jesse Hart, who definitely is not stupid, did the right thing after he took some time to calm down and think things through. He turned pro, signed with Top Rank and is now 5-0, with four knockout victories, as a promising super middleweight.

When it comes to athletes and guns, however, staying stuck on stupid seems to be a persistent condition that shows little signs of abating. The most recent example – and one of the more egregious – of a world-class athlete who put himself in danger of being shot down, in a legal sense, is Robert “The Ghost” Guerrero (31-1-1, 18 KOs), who is scheduled to challenge WBC welterweight champion and pound-for-pound king Floyd Mayweather Jr. (43-0, 26 KOs) on May 4 at Las Vegas’ MGM Grand. The fight, the first for Mayweather in his multimillion-dollar deal with CBS/Showtime, will be televised via Showtime Pay-Per-View and in theaters nationwide.

But although there appears to be little chance the bout won’t go off as scheduled, less certain is the possible damage done to Guerrero’s career in the long term as the result of his March 28 arrest for attempting to bring a handgun onto a flight from New York to Las Vegas. Airport security personnel were summoned and Guerrero (seen above in Tom Casino-Showtime photo) was taken into custody at John F. Kennedy International Airport. Guerrero’s next court appearance in New York isn’t scheduled until May 14, 10 days after he and Mayweather duke it out.

Unlike some athletes who treat firearms the way a certain fraternity’s lothario did during his produce-section come-on to Mrs. Wormer – who can forget Otter telling the cougarish wife of the Faber College dean that “Mine’s bigger than yours,” as he brandished his XL-sized cucumber – Guerrero isn’t stupid, particularly self-absorbed or in need of more and bigger toys that go bang. He is a devout Christian and an inspiration to many for his steadfast support of his wife, Casey, during her ordeal with leukemia (the dread disease is in remission after a successful bone-marrow transplant). Oh, yeah, he’s also a very good boxer who was named co-Fighter of the Year for 2012 (with Nonito Donaire) by Thesweetscience.com after impressive points triumphs over Selcuk Aydin and Andre Berto.

But, although his intentions appeared to be pure, Guerrero – or his advisers – should have known that New York has the strictest gun-control laws in the nation and that trying to bring a handgun unlicensed in that state (it is legally licensed in Guerrero’s home state of California) into an airport, even if it was unloaded and in a lock box, was bound to carry potentially severe consequences. In addition to the firearm, Guerrero, who voluntarily told a Delta Airlines official what was in the lock box, was in possession of two empty 15-round ammunition magazines.

“He was trying to do the right thing, the poor guy,” a law enforcement source, who asked not to be identified, told the New York Daily News when asked about Guerrero’s unwise decision. “The cop had to arrest him. He had no choice. Now it’s up to the DA.”

And the district attorney who has jurisdiction in the matter, Queens Borough’s Richard A. Brown, might not be so inclined to dismiss the incident simply because it involves a squeaky-clean celebrity who believed he wasn’t doing anything wrong. Ignorance of the law is seldom a legitimate excuse for breaking one, and that excuse almost never flies (pun intended) when the violation involves a lethal weapon .

“I hope that Mr. Guerrero fights better than he thinks,” Brown said. “For anyone who hasn’t gotten the message, let me be crystal clear: You cannot bring an unlicensed weapon – loaded or unloaded – into this county or this city. And if you do you will be arrested and face felony charges.”

Guerrero is charged with one count of criminal possession of a firearm and three counts of third-degree possession of a weapon. If convicted, he faces up to four years in prison, although some form of probation and a stern admonishment from a judge seems a more likely outcome.

There always will be debate among lawmakers and the pubic involving the rights of gun-owners as accorded by the Second Amendment to the Constitution, and it says here that those rights are inviolable and should not be abridged without a compelling reason. But there is a time and a place for everything, and there are common-sense solutions to matters that too often result in inflamed emotions. Guns and airports simply do not go together. Can we all agree on that?

I am not some anti-gun zealot. I served in the Marine Corps and can generally hit what I aim at. My late father was a cop, as are both my sons and their wives. They left or do leave for work each day armed with service weapons and in the knowledge that bad stuff can and does happen out on the street.

Some of that bad stuff involves highly paid boxers and ballplayers who often feel they can’t step out the door unless they have more concealed firepower than Dirty Harry. But feeling a need to carry a gun, in places where it isn’t really necessary to do so and highly improper in any case, isn’t restricted to athletes pulling down big bucks. College kids do it, too, and more often that you might imagine.

When I worked down South a lot of years ago, there was, somewhat ironically, a 5-9 shooting guard at Mississippi State University named Kent Looney. One day, during a pickup game on campus, he got into it with a teammate, left the court and returned with pistol in hand, to show that he was not someone to be messed with. Looney played for three colleges in all, displaying a nice perimeter jump shot and, at times, a hair-trigger temper.

A former colleague of mine asked Looney about the gun incident and he replied, “If you travel in the circles I do, you better be packing.” This from a guy who grew up on the famously mean streets of Guntersville, Ala.

Looney now heads the Guntersville Parks and Recreation Department, and last July he coached the Alabama Southern Starz girls to the AAU 11th-grade Division 2 national championship. He would prefer that his youthful indiscretions not be brought up, but maybe the turnaround in his life can serve as a cautionary tale. Where would he be now had that gun gone off, accidentally or on purpose, and left the teammate lying in a pool of blood?

But there is a sense of entitlement with some athletes who equate guns with virility and strength. NFL wide receiver Plaxico Burress brought a handgun with him to a New York night club a few years ago and inadvertently wound up shooting himself in the leg. Not only that, but he served two years in prison for even having the thing on his person.

Former NBA guard Delonte West was pulled over for a routine traffic stop in 2009 and was found to have two handguns (one a .357 Magnum) and a shotgun in his car. He claims he “needed” the arsenal for self-defense, but he still is looking at a possible three years behind bars. But even West was topped by NFL defensive tackle Tank Johnson, who was found to be in possession of a handgun while leaving a club in Chicago. Thirteen months later, he was arrested for possession of six guns, including two assault rifles, all loaded, in violation of his probation. Another huge defensive tackle, Shaun Rogers, has a legal carry permit for a concealed weapon yet was arrested for bringing a loaded gun into an airport.

No one is saying Robert Guerrero, with a chance to make history by becoming the first man to put a smudge on the pristine record of Mayweather, the self-proclaimed greatest fighter of all time, is an offender on a par with some of the aforementioned. But consider why Guerrero, who is training for the Mayweather fight in Vegas, was on the East Coast to begin with. He was doing a media tour to hype both the fight and himself, and there were no gossip-page reports of him being seen in the wee hours at strip clubs. He appeared on Good Morning America in New York and the 700 Club with Pat Robertson in Norfolk, Va. Neither of those engagements should have concerned him to the point where he felt he needed to be packing heat.

In the weeks ahead, Guerrero – who turned 30 the day before his arrest --will be asked, and frequently, about his strategy for the Mayweather bout. But one question some inquiring minds would like to have answered is why he thought it was a good idea to bring a gun, unloaded or not, onto a commercial airplane when some travelers have been detained in the past for trying to go through the security checkpoint with such seemingly innocuous items as tweezers and metal nail files.

It might not have been a case of getting stuck on stupid, but it was at least a stopover.

Comment on this article

deepwater says:

"Where would he be now had that gun gone off, accidentally or on purpose, and left the teammate lying in a pool of blood? " it didnt. where would he be now if home invaders got into his home and he didnt have the gun? silly questions! how bout how many unicorns can dance on the head of a pin? please all histerical idiots. guns are defensive weapons to legal gunholders. guns give granny a chance against a a pack of home invaders or a 300 lb drunk. crazy evil people will always try and kill the innocent. innocent people have a right to defend themselves! why do these nuts want innocent people to be killed? legal gunholders save lives or at least give the old and weak a god damn chance! but what if this and that?! get over it you mofos! you dont want a gun to defend yourself then dont get one! go put a sign on your front door that says gun free zone and see what happens, after that shut up and leave people alone. robert g is stupid for thinking he lives in a free world. he doesnt and should know better.

deepwater says:

He appeared on Good Morning America in New York and the 700 Club with Pat Robertson in Norfolk, Va. Neither of those engagements should have concerned him to the point where he felt he needed to be packing heat.
" why dont you think back to: school shootings ;nursery school,high school, college,church shootings,movie houses. bet you didnt think you would need a gun there either? remember appalacian law school when the evil studant came to the law school and started shooting? you dont remember it. because the professor took out the gun from his briefcase and shot the kid the chest. massacre ended.no big story there. its the evil people not the tools.

amayseng says:

there was a shooting in ohio yesterday during easter service, in a CHURCH,

the crazy persons shouting something about alah, killed his own father...

i would die for my father.

this psycho killed his own dad..

im starting to think i need to load up for a trip to the grocery store


what a sad, pathetic and terrible society we live in today...

if i could find a job in Italy, and a farm, and be left alone, i would be out....

SouthPaul says:

If you can't get away with the gun to the grocery store....take a bat with a glove .... A letter opener in the door compartment .. Metal pipe under the seat ... Mace in your front pocket . Survival ! Don't let these crazy muthafuckas' catch the brethren slipping.

deepwater says:

there was a shooting in ohio yesterday during easter service, in a CHURCH,

the crazy persons shouting something about alah, killed his own father...

i would die for my father.

this psycho killed his own dad..

im starting to think i need to load up for a trip to the grocery store


what a sad, pathetic and terrible society we live in today...

if i could find a job in Italy, and a farm, and be left alone, i would be out....[ the state is trying to disarm legal people so only the state and criminals have the weapons. j leons brother got shot in the head last week. by a criminal with an illegal gun. all my friends are cops and they say protect yourself ,the cops wont. even the suprereme court agrees the police do not have to save you. this writer should stick to boxing and leave the communist teachings alone. yes i called this writer a communist because he is. if you disagree arm yourself with knowledge and lets hear it.

deepwater says:

If you can't get away with the gun to the grocery store....take a bat with a glove .... A letter opener in the door compartment .. Metal pipe under the seat ... Mace in your front pocket . Survival ! Don't let these crazy muthafuckas' catch the brethren slipping. Times are definitely crazier than ever.


a heavy belt buckle is good to. take of your belt and you got a 3 foot weapon. guy has a knife you whip him in the face and eye with belt. bottles,hot coffee, dog lease help out too.

amayseng says:

I carry a machete behind the passenger seat in my car.

Always have a baseball bat in the trunk,

I would love brass knuckles but am afraid I'd use them more for fun.

Ha.
Kidding

ali says:

Deepwater the problem is how do we know who should have a gun and who shouldn't

brownsugar says:

Bad things happen everywhere,... NY gets it's fair share too... millions of people stacked on top of each other,.. compressed and congested,... stressed and tensed up... ready to snap or fall off into a deep depression. ....I once dated a chick from NY and she was even negative when she said "I love you".

The NY gun laws are in place for a reason.

Folks talk about carrying various objects for safety,.... good advice...

but what can you carry to protect yourself from the cops?
I've been victimized more by Cops than any criminal...

Criminals I can prepare for.
But Cops have green light to invade your space and get in your business... for no reason...... having said that,.. I salute the decent Cops out there.


All you who are tired and weary,.. pissed off and frustrated,...from all over the country... Come see our beautiful rows upon rows of genetically modified cornfields in Ohio and breathe our fresh air.

Guerrero comes from a town that's only one law away from allowing it's citizens from wearing holsters stocked with pistols and live ammunition. The gun hungry state would revolt and attempt another civil war if you tried to take their guns away.
Guerrero was obviously going by the false assumption that if you stored a gun, remove the amunition, and inform the officials your carrying one.... Then by Texas Standards you have absolutely nothing to worry about. You have gone above and beyond what's needed to be in compliance with the gun laws of any state...... Wrong!!!... Next time come to Ohio son,.. where our gun laws are more relaxed.... and the Crazy folk are more likely to be taking their medication.

Better yet,.. just leave the gun at home and spend a couple of thousand on a bodyguard liscensed to carry the gun for you.

ali says:

Another good post B-sug

deepwater says:

Loaded question. Gun laws originated in the country to keep guns and self defense illegal to feed slaves, which then extended to poor minorities . Gun laws are Inacted to disarm the people do not promote safety . More crimes and murders happen in gun free zones. Schools, detroit and Chicago examples. The Jews in Germany were disarmed, the catholics in Russia were disarmed by the bolshiviks, Mao ,Chavez, pol pot, and all brutal dictators outlaw firearms. Does the drunk driver deserve a car? Does a lady texting while driving deserve a car? Homeowner with a pool lets a kid jump in and isn't paying attention ,kid dies, does he deserve a pool? Guns are tools. Evil people are evil people. stupid people are stupid people. Look to Sweden for the solution.

leon30001 says:

Careful Deepwater there's no room for reasoned argument or, perish the thought, facts (like how violent cirme tends to be worse in states with the most draconian gun laws), in today's knee-jerk, emotive, "liberal" world! I'm sure Michael Woods will be along shortly to stick the boot in to the 2nd amendment.

admin says:

States with more gun laws have fewer gun related deaths. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-57572971/50-state-study-more-gun-laws-fewer-deaths/ I like the tougher gun laws in NY, because I don't live in fear of the boogeyman, don't fall for the tricks of the fear industrial complex. They've told you that Obama was coming for your guns for five years, and there has been a MASSIVE spike in gun and ammo sales. They are peddlers, and too many suckers fall for it, carry the water for them, and as a result, well...you see the result. if you think the answer to this state is MORE GUNS then yes, I think you are a fool.

Careful Deepwater there's no room for reasoned argument or, perish the thought, facts (like how violent cirme tends to be worse in states with the most draconian gun laws), in today's knee-jerk, emotive, "liberal" world! I'm sure Michael Woods will be along shortly to stick the boot in to the 2nd amendment.

deepwater says:

Hey bs you are right . According to the supreme court cops do not have to help anyone period. Cops can be bad or good. Cops = the state. The state= power over you. Cops of any race commit brute force on any race. It's the state vs you . Power currupts.The main idea from my police officer friends is protect yourself at all times and when seconds count the police are minutes away. The gun grabbers out there hate the People. The criminals are not following the existing laws already why wold they follow any new laws? How bout this? Racism still exists in the country. I want the minority to be able to protect themselves from the majority. I want the single mom to be able to protect her kids from home invaders or rapists. I want the little ole granny to protect herself from the burglar . I want the young gay couple to be able to protect themselves from drunken bigots. Why would anyone deny these people the right to life? Who really hates the People? Gun control is racist and sexist at the core.

deepwater says:

States with more gun laws have fewer gun related deaths. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-57572971/50-state-study-more-gun-laws-fewer-deaths/ I like the tougher gun laws in NY, because I don't live in fear of the boogeyman, don't fall for the tricks of the fear industrial complex. They've told you that Obama was coming for your guns for five years, and there has been a MASSIVE spike in gun and ammo sales. They are peddlers, and too many suckers fall for it, carry the water for them, and as a result, well...you see the result. if you think the answer to this state is MORE GUNS then yes, I think you are a fool.
Detroit and Chicago have the strictest gun laws in country. These cities are murder Capitol of USA. Swedan gun laws are every household must own a gun, look at all the crime in Swedan . Obamas private army the department of homeland security is responsible for the spike in ammo. Here is a link.DHS ammunition and weapons stockpiling challenged by Rep. Timothy Huelscamp, Department of Homeland Security stonewalling, 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition, thousands of armored*vehicles

DHS ammunition and weapons stockpiling challenged by Rep. Timothy Huelscamp, Department of Homeland Security stonewalling, 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition, thousands of armored vehicles

“One more thing: Why is the federal government buying so much hollow point ammunition, purchasing light armored vehicles, spying with drones and claiming the right to kill Americans with drones, and trying to pass legislation to disarm citizens? Does any of this make sense? How about two words: National Socialism.”…Dean M., Citizen Wells commenter

“The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a*sine qua non*for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let’s not have any native militia or native police. German troops alone will bear the sole responsibility for the maintenance of law and order throughout the occupied Russian territories, and a system of military strong-points must be evolved to cover the entire occupied country.”…Adolf Hitler,*dinner talk April 11, 1942

“Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA – ordinary citizens don’t need guns, as their having guns doesn’t serve the State.”…Heinrich Himmler

admin says:

Yes, Leon, how silly of "liberals" to ask for a comprehensive plan to reduce the number of gun deaths, of which the US has the most among advanced nation. Anyone that isn't demanding an exhaustive effort so that we do as much as possible to never again have a nut enter a grade school and slaughter children lacks some portion of heart

States with more gun laws have fewer gun related deaths. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-57572971/50-state-study-more-gun-laws-fewer-deaths/ I like the tougher gun laws in NY, because I don't live in fear of the boogeyman, don't fall for the tricks of the fear industrial complex. They've told you that Obama was coming for your guns for five years, and there has been a MASSIVE spike in gun and ammo sales. They are peddlers, and too many suckers fall for it, carry the water for them, and as a result, well...you see the result. if you think the answer to this state is MORE GUNS then yes, I think you are a fool.

deepwater says:

Yes, Leon, how silly of "liberals" to ask for a comprehensive plan to reduce the number of gun deaths, of which the US has the most among advanced nation. Anyone that isn't demanding an exhaustive effort so that we do as much as possible to never again have a nut enter a grade school and slaughter children lacks some portion of heart


That shooter stole the guns and broke existing laws. The whole event was unlawful. More laws to be ignored? Don't just stand there ! Do something ! Anything! Kenneshaw Georgia has a good idea

amayseng says:

People kill people

If that psycho couldn't get a gun to shot those poor children

then he could have just run them down with a car when they got off of the bus.


You can't stop crazy.

deepwater says:

Yes, Leon, how silly of "liberals" to ask for a comprehensive plan to reduce the number of gun deaths, of which the US has the most among advanced nation. Anyone that isn't demanding an exhaustive effort so that we do as much as possible to never again have a nut enter a grade school and slaughter children lacks some portion of heart


If the writer actually cared so much about dead kids he would of said something last year . 500 kids killed by illegal guns in Chicago last year. Why does the writer care now and not then.? Rich kids in Connecticut vs poor kids in Chicago. A lot of stats prove his stats from CBS wrong. Lack of heart and fools are terms used to distract from facts. Arrest the criminals .enforce the laws. Protect yourself

leon30001 says:

Yes, Woods, I "lack some portion of heart." Obviously that must be it. There's no other explanation!

deepwater says:

Yes, Woods, I "lack some portion of heart." Obviously that must be it. There's no other explanation!


its all your fault!

leon30001 says:

its all your fault!


Absolutely. I accept the blame. I've seen the light. Obama will take care of us all. Hope and change! Hope and change!

amayseng says:

There will always be guns in the criminals hands.

Even if guns were out lawed criminals will still get them.


Last week a retired police chief got arrested for stealing and selling

2 emergency military fully automatic m16's.

deepwater says:

There will always be guns in the criminals hands.

Even if guns were out lawed criminals will still get them.


Last week a retired police chief got arrested for stealing and selling

2 emergency military fully automatic m16's.

all you hear from the this crowd is what about the children?! you must be a fool!? what are you stupid?! we hear about all the gun crimes but what about all the times guns kept people safe? sure are a lot of stories like that and a thinking person might be able to see that without being emo. if you declare guns evil or senseless and you do not want one that is your right. put a sign in front of your house and declare it a gun free zone. the home invaders will see that sign and say" you know what,lets kill and rob the next house because this homeowner sure seems like a swell guy. do not force your viewpoints on other people.

ali says:

Bottom line is what Amayseng u can't stop crazy. Crazy people will find another way to do crazy sh!t period.

Bernie Campbell says:

First of all I want to say that Bernard Fernandez is a North Philly fool! Probabably couldnt take the penny ante sh. and took off to Brigantine or some "Nirvana"! This is a friggun publicity stunt devised by Gueriero's promoter and handelers, not unless Gueriero is a punk! Bro, When you have conquered your deamons, you dont fear the world! Guys like Tony Thompson, James Kirkland, and others have been called up on weapons violations! In my mind they were punks! And couldnt handle the mundane sh about life! What shocks me about Gueriero is that hes walking around with license in 100% that hes gonna beat Floyd! He says God told him that! God dont work that way man! Im leaving this sinking ship called Boxing, there all a bunch of Fucn Friscoes!

dino da vinci says:

People kill people

If that psycho couldn't get a gun to shot those poor children

then he could have just run them down with a car when they got off of the bus.


You can't stop crazy.


You're 1,000,000% correct. Bullseye post. Heartbreakingly sad but true.

amayseng says:

You're 1,000,000% correct. Bullseye post. Heartbreakingly sad but true.


Exactly. SAD and TRUE.

brownsugar says:

I haven't owned a gun in over 20 years. sharp contrast from what I used to carry in my youth. Only one time during those twenty years did I really need one, that was when some guy tried to rob me after I made an exit from the local carry out.
the guy said someone robbed him, so he had to get his moneyback.

I had the landlords money in my back pocket... how do you tell your landlord you lost got robbed on rent day?
Luckily I could see in the youngsters face he hadn't done this too many times.
I slowly inched my way into the middle of the street. where I got a little protection from the oncoming traffic.

Trust me, If I had seen in his face that he was a hard-core killer,.. he would have got the wallet on the spot.
Wasn't gonna be no hero.

But I plan on getting one soon,.. miss going to the range... a great way to relax.

The United Kingdom has one of the lowest death by firearm ratio's in the world. around .07 per 100,000
Anybody over 17 can own a shotgun (from what I've read) but you have to be some kind of gun-sports specialist to own a hand gun.
...(even if it's an antique front muzzle loader). Tighter gun laws appear to have been more effective in Europe. I don't see why they wouldn't be just as effective over here.

amayseng says:

That's the thing.

Hand guns have one use only.

To kill. People.

No one ever hunted a Moose with a hand gun.

deepwater says:

I haven't owned a gun in over 20 years. sharp contrast from what I used to carry in my youth. Only one time during those twenty years did I really need one, that was when some guy tried to rob me after I made an exit from the local carry out.
the guy said someone robbed him, so he had to get his moneyback.

I had the landlords money in my back pocket... how do you tell your landlord you lost got robbed on rent day?
Luckily I could see in the youngsters face he hadn't done this too many times.
I slowly inched my way into the middle of the street. where I got a little protection from the oncoming traffic.

Trust me, If I had seen in his face that he was a hard-core killer,.. he would have got the wallet on the spot.
Wasn't gonna be no hero.

But I plan on getting one soon,.. miss going to the range... a great way to relax.

The United Kingdom has one of the lowest death by firearm ratio's in the world. around .07 per 100,000
Anybody over 17 can own a shotgun (from what I've read) but you have to be some kind of gun-sports specialist to own a hand gun.
...(even if it's an antique front muzzle loader). Tighter gun laws appear to have been more effective in Europe. I don't see why they wouldn't be just as effective over here.


uk has many many more knife deaths and club deaths now that legal people can not defend themselves. also home invasions went right up after gun ban in uk. look at australia for more proof.

brownsugar says:

uk has many many more knife deaths and club deaths now that legal people can not defend themselves. also home invasions went right up after gun ban in uk. look at australia for more proof.


I will check it out..interesting statistic

brownsugar says:

It look's like this debate is going to rage on for a while,.. as per the statistics the effectiveness of tighter gun laws is still up in the air...
Amazingly the statistics show that for the U.K. and Austrailia, the murder rate dropped slightly but still fluctuated and peaked occassionally during some years because people found alternative ways to kill.

not in devious ways like what was portrayed in the movie "SAW",.. but just bloody violent murder with sharp objects and heavy blunt objects..

Also the violent crime rate rose,... the number of rapes per 100,000 in the UK rose substantially as criminals used knives to assault women on a larger scale than when guns were on the streets.

Mass killings dropped significantly since it's more difficult for nutjobs to spray a class room with semi-automatic machine guns. and the suicide rate dropped, since self murder by handgun seems to be the preferred way of taking the one-way train to the afterlife.

The results are still murky and officials agree that it's harder to keep statistics on knife violence because it's not reported (or detected) as frequently, Personally I'd still like to see stricter gun laws if nothing other than to see the statistical results.

and if they do ban guns... make sure to get in a few kung-fu classes because it may get a little rough out there.

deepwater says:

It look's like this debate is going to rage on for a while,.. as per the statistics the effectiveness of tighter gun laws is still up in the air...
Amazingly the statistics show that for the U.K. and Austrailia, the murder rate dropped slightly but still fluctuated and peaked occassionally during some years because people found alternative ways to kill.

not in devious ways like what was portrayed in the movie "SAW",.. but just bloody violent murder with sharp objects and heavy blunt objects..

Also the violent crime rate rose,... the number of rapes per 100,000 in the UK rose substantially as criminals used knives to assault women on a larger scale than when guns were on the streets.

Mass killings dropped significantly since it's more difficult for nutjobs to spray a class room with semi-automatic machine guns. and the suicide rate dropped, since self murder by handgun seems to be the preferred way of taking the one-way train to the afterlife.

The results are still murky and officials agree that it's harder to keep statistics on knife violence because it's not reported (or detected) as frequently, Personally I'd still like to see stricter gun laws if nothing other than to see the statistical results.

and if they do ban guns... make sure to get in a few kung-fu classes because it may get a little rough out there.


This is why you are número UNO . You actually researched what I said and came back with stats that prove my point but yet you make a well reasoned argument .

amayseng says:

I'm for stricter gun laws as well.

With guns still bein legal for ones who can pass very strict laws and checks.

deepwater says:

I'm for stricter gun laws as well.

With guns still bein legal for ones who can pass very strict laws and checks.


How come they don't already enforce the current laws? Felons,nuts on meds, people on domestic orders of protection are not allowed to own firearms . Enforce the current laws, do not add more laws. Criminals do not obey the laws. Think it out.

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