Boxing vs. PEDs

BY Michael Woods ON November 19, 2012
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anabolic-steroids-and-sports-share-a-relationship-despite-all-odds As with seemingly all pro sports--maybe bowling is exempt, for now--it seems as though the PED issue will loom larger, and will have to be hashed through for a spell more before we reach a point of clarity, let alone cleanliness.

Thomas Hauser released a story today on Maxboxing.com which set off shockwaves in the industry. The biggest boom came in the form of Hauser's reporting on word which had filtered through the PED testing community which indicates that Floyd Mayweather, who has cast himself as the top sheriff in cleaning up PED usage in the sport, tested positive on three occasions for PED usage.

Hauser wrote:

"On May 20, 2012, a rumor filtered through the drug-testing community that Mayweather had tested positive on three occasions for an illegal performance-enhancing drug. More specifically, it was rumored that Mayweather’s “A” sample had tested positive on three occasions and, after each positive test, USADA had found exceptional circumstances in the form of inadvertent use and gave Floyd a waiver. This waiver, according to the rumor, negated the need for a test of Floyd’s “B” sample. And because the “B” sample was never tested, a loophole in USADA’s contract with Mayweather and Golden Boy allowed the testing to proceed without the positive “A” sample results being reported to Mayweather’s opponent or the Nevada State Athletic Commission (which had jurisdiction over the fights)."

Hauser was referencing a May flap between Golden Boy and his Maxboxing.com colleague, Gabriel Montoya. Golden Boy tried to lay a hammer down on Montoya for "spreading false information regarding Golden Boy's alleged involvement with the drug testing of boxers for prohibited substances." Montoya received on May 23 a letter from an attorney representing Golden Boy which said that Montoya claimed to the Nevada State Athletic Commission "that Mr. Mayweather had tested positive on three occasions which were excused under the inadvertent use provision." The attorney, in that letter, said Montoya should stop repeating the assertions and if not, legal action, including the pursuing of damages, against him might be forthcoming.

In the bombshell story, Hauser went on to say that Manny Pacquiao's people heard the "Floyd tested positive" rumor and basically, that led the Mayweather folks to settle, on Sept. 25, the lawsuit Pacquiao had filed against Mayweather and company for defamation, for alleging the Filipino used PEDS. (A source informed me that the settlement was in the low seven figure range, though terms of the deal were to be kept confidential.)

Hauser, who clerked for a federal judge and spent five years as a practicing litigator on Wall St. and beyond that is exceedingly judicious in the realm of reporting only what he knows to be fact, in my view, did make sure to acknowledge that he doesn't know with certainty whether Mayweather or Pacquiao has used illegal performance enhancing drugs. "I don’t know if Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs or not," Hauser wrote.

The writer also referenced the PED cases involving Lamont Peterson, Andre Berto, Antonio Tarver and Erik Morales. He noted that he tried to get promoter Richard Schaefer, of Golden Boy, on the record to respond to some of the material he collected, but Schaefer declined to go on record with him. Hauser inserted a portion of an email Schaefer sent him regarding the story. “We are trying to do something positive and yet it seems that media and others are attacking us," Schaefer wrote Hauser. "It would be easy for us to do nothing just like all other promoters. But by trying to support the fighters’ desire for additional testing, we are getting criticized.” (On Monday, I sent an email to Golden Boy asking if Schaefer would care to discuss the Hauser story and will publish his response if he chooses to do so. I also texted Mayweather's advisor Leonard Ellerbe to see if he wanted to weigh in, and hadn't heard back from him as yet.)

Hauser particularly scrutinized Peterson's excuse that he suffered from low testosterone, and that's why he resorted to testosterone boosters, and Berto's public dismay that the case was handled unfairly, because it played out in the media, without explanations being offered why samples showed presence of a steroid. The writer noted Berto's plea that, "Nothing was really explained to the public" rings hollow, because Berto's own lawyer wouldn't allow the testing agency to release pertinent information. (I have found it strange, to say the least, that Berto hasn't publicly tracked the supplement which tainted his test, and shared with the press what that supplement was, if only to prevent other unfortunates from ingesting a banned substance unknowingly. If he has done so, I missed that move. Maybe there is a reason I can't summon why he hasn't outed that tainted supplement.)

I reached out to a member of the Mayweather camp, David Levi. He told me, after I asked for a chat with Mayweather to get his take on the Hauser piece, "I don't think Floyd would bother commenting on a made up story. He's been testing for years and is the forefront of cleaning up the sport. The article makes it seem like the settlement was made because of some drug testing involving Floyd which is not the case at all."

My take: the PED black cloud is depressing to me, and so many sports fans. Most of us hope that the magic we see these athletes perform comes from their superior skills, their talent, hard work and dedication, not sneaky chemists, and a flexible or nonexistent moral compass. This year's spate of positive tests has led me to wonder if the number of top boxers using is greater than the ones using. Is everyone dirty? Of course, some fans have already fallen into a zone of cynicism, assuming that they all cheat, and if they all cheat, then the playing field is even. Peterson, who demanded PED testing from Amir Khan, and Berto, who insinuated that Victor Ortiz was using after Ortiz beat him, if those guys tested positive, I wondered, who can be trusted? Could it be possible that people are so slick and cynical to on the one hand demand that the sport clean up its act, while on the other hand, are feeding themselves banned chemicals in order to build up their strength and/or stamina? That's the sort of odious and devious scheming I'd hope would be left to those in the upper reaches of politics...

Say it ain't so. And if you don't mind, leave us a sample, just to be sure. Because it is hard to know who to believe in a saga that gets more sordid.

Hauser promises Part II of the PED story tomorrow.

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Comment on this article

deepwater says:

a lot of hearsay and nonsense. victor conte is a crook and a liar.

SouthPaul says:

All information is usually incomplete in life but if there's one man in boxing who can get to the bottom of the hearsay and nonsense..it's none other than Thomas Hauser. He's got top notch access to the behind the scenes shenanigans. He details it like no other author in the sport. Anyhow, read this earlier this morning. Fascinating stuff. I think GBP's has been putting up some good fight cards lately but they're also very good at putting up a front like they been on the up and up and somehow we are to believe TOp Rank and Bod Arum are the only problematic promotional company. One has to be a fool and severallyl ill-informed to buy into such thoughts. Boy oh boy, I love this dysfunctional sport! Lmao

amayseng says:

wow, floyd failed on three occasions, but especially not having a B test is the true concern....that just looks suspicious....
i didnt ever suspect him of cheating and still dont but just the fact there was no B test is odd...

berto is a cheater for sure...


peterson is a cheater, if he had a medical condition which was legit he would have notified the commission ahead of time...

tarver, well i think anyone over 40 is entitled to trt due to the bodys natural decline in testosterone at that age......with proper commission licensed doctors and supervision of course...

deepwater says:

no one is pure and thats the way it has always been with boxing. whether its drinking in camp, smoking cigarettes like shane mosley does, weed after the gym. ive sparred a top pro and a piece of weed fell out of his damn hair. camacho used to do blow in camp. ever see what duran was doing at the after parties? chavez sr tsk tsk. the fighters from decades ago were even worse. now the new thing to be upset about is steroids or high testosterone. if you go to gnc and take testo boost powder do you get a fail test? vargas knocked out delahoya because of the roids, yeah right. show me a fighter on steroids and ill show you a fighter that is too bulky and slow . if ali was fighting a steroid cheat he would tell him to take more steroids! if that fool peterson couldnt get it up he should just drink a guiness with a raw egg and bamn.

Radam G says:

All RIGHTY!!! FINALLY, FINALLY, FINALLY! Right UP in the faces of Money May's nuthuggers. I've been posting in this Universe for going on three years that Lil' Floyd was juicin,' sippin,' and injectin' PEDs and roids, and getting that USADA crusader Travis Tygart -- the biggest fraud on the planet, and a big time nuthugger and fanboy of Money May -- to not see and to not report it for a large sum of moola from Team May, Money May and Fam May and company.

Bytches were taking the heat off themselves by straight-up using optical illusions on Money May's flunkies, fanboys, fanfaronades, fudgeheads and __ ___ ___! And the naive, Pachaters, Asian haters and know nothings will be going into depression and mass madness. Another one of their zeroes -- I mean heroes -- will bite da dust. "AND another one -- ANOTHER one BITES DA dust!" This is what goes down when jivebytches lust. The truth coming out about 'em MUST! Now who can you Yanks TRUST?

It's honesty time! It's Pinoy Time! It's PacTime!

Too LEGIT! Too legit to QUIT! Ha! Huh! Money May, ____ _____ and _____ ____ are "on dat sh*t," as Pops Joy May calls PEDs and roids. Holla!

Radam G says:

BTW! It doesn't matter. That syet does not give you talent and/or skills. In da game of whupa$$, it is simply a placebo effect. A weak mind needs something to believe in. I've seen fighters turn into monsters who thought syet was in 'em when dey @$$es were clean as whistles.

Boxing is full of con men selling sugar pills, sugar power, sugar water and ___ ___ __ to help get da win for a man of tin. Than again, you have trainers like the one who is in Juan Manuel Marquez's camp feeding Marquez PEDs and roids. And it will be to no avail. JMM's boat still won't be able to sail. On dat muthacrybaby, Da Manny's punches are going to rain like hail. Getting a win -- even with PEDs and roids -- JMM for the fourth time will fail. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Lmao at that classic rant.


Truthfully, the most shocking part of that Hauser piece is the absurd 100,000 fee to test two fighters. Unfuckingbelievable!Im thinking something else was paid for in that amount.

Radam G says:

Nope, Editor Mike! The muthasuckas aren't exempt in bowling either. Since back in da day when bowling was a regular sport on ABC's Wide World of Sports, PEDs using was going on. Just holla at some of the oldtimers of that game. I won't snitch out anybody. But the rugrat Radam G recall a tennis superstar player, roller derby players and bowling stars juicing on coke and roids in green rooms before the start of televised competitons.

Just knowing where to dig, you will find a goldmine of cheats laaaaiiiiiddd baaacccck! Cheatin' on roids and PEDs. Maybe pool players are exempt. Hehehe! Holla!

brownsugar says:

So the story is still in the Rumor stage... same place it was when Hauser released it a year ago. Get a life dude.

Radam G says:

Da muthasucka may have a tumor, but his using roids and PEDs ain't no rumor. It all depends on USADA rotten, corrupted, crusader Travis Tygart. Dude is the master of cleaning up dirt for Money May's usage.

The best way to take attention off your dirty syet is to claim that an innocent Asian is the culprit. Money May and Tygart were good at playing funky music. But dey @$$es are stinkin' up da joint. Now! Whad dey gon' do? Karma is a muthafudger. The baseballer Barry Bonds. The bicycler Lance Armstrong. Now the boxer Floyd "Money May" Mayweather. Fudging Yanky panky -- I mean hanky panky. Hehehe! No matter what. Dey (sic) all is (sic) stanky. Hahaha!

Da Manny will still kick Money May's roid-and-PEDs-using arse. Make the fight for after Da Manny finishes off roid-using crybaby Marquez. YUP! His arse is on roids too. He stop sippin' his **** and started roid juicin.' Holla!

tlig says:

Geez. I read through that entire article on Max and the whole time I was thinking it was written by Steve Kim! I suppose I should have done a double take at the point where he mentioned he was friends with Margaret Goodman and had given her advice on some personal issues (I mean Steve Kim and Dr Goodman sharing personal views?). Anyway to the issue. If Floyd really did test positive then he should be exposed. But this is boxing and nothing will come out of this I'm sure.

SouthPaul says:

So the story is still in the Rumor stage... same place it was when Hauser released it a year ago. Get a life dude.


Huge amount of interesting and factual content in that two piece article to go letting an insy tinsy bit of MAyweather speculation/rumor distract you. This is coming from a highly respected journalist not some bozo say like Pedro Fernanez who'd sell out his own mother if it meant boosting his ego.

tlig says:

Unfortunately PEDs have been in the sport of boxing for yonks. Lax testing and a general disregard for the impact they have on boxers' performances has led to fighters taking the stuff almost without fear of getting caught. Evander Holyfield was on them for much of his career and even got caught ordering them to his now-foreclosed Atlanta mansion (in the guise of Evan Fields) a few years ago. Nothing came of it. I have read- well it was insinuated by Michael Katz- that Mike Tyson and Lennox Lewis also took the stuff. Funny thing is I believe him. At the top level of most professional sports (and even at the lowest level at times) people do everything the feel they can get away with to win. And that includes steroid usage.

I've never for instance believed Floyd was clean despite his rhetoric. You watch guys, nothing will come of this either.

Radam G says:

Of course jack won't come of this. PEDs and roids can be in yo' dokey or p!$$. It's all about money. Ain't d@mn thang funny! Boksing will stay sunny. I get my strength from smacking on Pinoy pandesal and ant honey. Now dat is da syets. Hahaha! Jive dat chemical stuff. It will make yo' cranium and arse puff. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Floyd's juicing and Leornard Ellerbe is Just For Men'ing . The Counterfit Team!

Radam G says:

Wher e ya' at, SCLA Ali? Comment on diz thread. Don't pretend like it you haven't read. You're thinking what to say. Huh! You are finding it hard to find the spit to defend yo' bytch boy Money May. Not for juicin' to be mention about, he always got on his corrupted payoffs PAY! BRING IT! SOUTH CENTRAL LA drinkin' yo juice. Let's have some goose. Cut it LOOSE! Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Lmao at your guy's forum rivalry. Hilarious.

One truly has to admit that it makes more sense or the conclusion is easier to draw Floyd is juicing moreso than Manny. The magical shoulder roll defense... Hand speed that moves faster than a speeding bullet.. Hasn't ever been cut... Hardly has lost half a round let alone an entire 12. Just truly fits a lot easier, that is if you were trying to drawn the juice conclusion.

zdrx says:

floyd was caught on video snorting something (probably cocaine) before coming out of his dug out...yet USADA declared him clean. youtube it...and see for yourself how they do it. just be quick with your eyes.

zdrx says:

that's the reason why when pacman's lawyer, atty petrocelli...subpoenaed in court floyd's medical and drug test records........ USADA refused, and instead filed a motion to quash. it's either they have records that floyd tested positive...or they did not test floyd at all. either way...it would have caused the collapse of USADA.

USADA's refusal to submit in court, all of floyd's drug test record...damaged USADA's credibility. to repair the damage, and regain credibility...USADA destroyed lance armstrong's honor...to make it appear they are a serious crusader against "cheats". now with thomas hauser's report...it will be USADA's turn to be destroyed.

zdrx says:

it appears that it is floyd who's on drugs. to deflect the image away from him...he accused pacman as a drug cheat...and cloaked himself as sports moral crusader. clever move...but his deception is catching up on him.

zdrx says:

winky wright said that USADA took urine and blood samples from him...but was informed they threw it out and never tested in laboratory. his opponent peter quillin happens to be under al haymon who is connected with GBP...and GBP has working relationship with USADA. aside from having a working relationship with tygart and USADA...floyd is also under al haymon and GBP. therefore, it is not far fetched that floyd's drug tests also gone the route of winky wright's...or had not been taken sample at all.

aside from $100,000 they receive for their "services" per professional fights...USADA also receives millions of funds from the US government. and all they do in sports is a farce...and turn the sports into a joke, and endangering lives. they even have the taste to destroy lance armstrong for which they have no hard evidence...but "testimonies" from bums and "failers". what USADA is doing...is CRIMINAL...and must be investigated and sued for the fraud that they are.

zdrx says:

when petrocelli subpoenaed floyd's drug test records...USADA refused and filed motion to quash. WHOA! they are hiding something!!!
it is also interesting to note that before the judge could review the motion...floyd opted for out of court settlement with pacman. floyd's move seems an effort to preempt the judge from acting on a hot issue that can uncover their nefarious secrets...that can destroy them (floyd and USADA) completely. but as they say...THE INEVITABLE IS BOUND TO HAPPEN...they will be destroyed.

zdrx says:

a lot of hearsay and nonsense. victor conte is a crook and a liar.


now you know...that floyd's accusation against pacman is a lot of nonsense.
now you know...that USADA's main weapon against lance armstrong is not hard evidence...but "testimonies" from bums and "failers"...therefore hearsay.
now you know...that floyd is a crook and has no capacity to tell the truth.

deepwater says:

now you know...that floyd's accusation against pacman is a lot of nonsense.
now you know...that USADA's main weapon against lance armstrong is not hard evidence...but "testimonies" from bums and "failers"...therefore hearsay.
now you know...that floyd is a crook and has no capacity to tell the truth.


I knew all of the above before this article.

Radam G says:

zdrx, deepwater is in DA KNOW! He's not one of the know nothings or cyberspace con men or fakes. Deepwater takes da phonies and cons into deep waters and let the sharks eat their no-swimming, fronting, sorry @sses up.

It nothing new about the seediness that goes on in da beat-arse/trick-arse/fool-arse game. Syet always comes into the light, and burns seedy muthasuckas like cannot-stay-away-from-the-fire moths flying into da flame. Holla!

ali says:

Nobody was even talking about roids in boxing until Mayweather brought it up. If he was using he would have kept his mouth shut period. This article is just trying to discredit Mayweather accomplishments 43-0 yall suckas hate it hahaha lol lmao!!!!

Radam G says:

You are naive and misinformed, SCLA Ali. Talks about roids have gone on for years. Where in da double fudge have you been? Don't let your keyboading tapping go before you know. LEARN, dude, LEARN! How many of your hoodbros are on drugs and syet, but dey bring up the usage of others.

Money May is a multi-trick pony and is now on his last ride. His groupies and nuthuggers will always be on his side. And no one should expect anything less. These SOBs would willingly lick up his mess.

Money May's fanboys and fanfaronades will be the last to know, 'cause dey is (sic) gettin' on dey blow. Muthasuckas on da downlow. Up! Dey will never GROW!

Pops Joy May musta' be so shock. His seed is on dat sh*t. And defending him, SCLA Ali, you oughta quit. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Speaking of fan boys, groupies, and nut huggers ... Go check out the fan rioting on the BOxingscene message board. It's pure mayhem, makes the Rodney King/la riots look tame. They've got over a hundred pages devoted to this very topic, In less than 24 hours since the article broke.


One of the writers from here need to interview those in charge of setting the prices for the testing. I need to know why it cost $100,000 to test only 2 fighters over a couple months. And, does that include a complimentary hand job from one of the pretty female lab workers???

Radam G says:

Hehehe! You are wildin,' SouthPaul. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Telling you, bro, the 100,000 fee was the most compelling part of that article in my opinion. It needs to be further explained. You're going to tell me the test will cost more than some fighters are being paid on some of those undercards? C'mon now, someone is price gouging. Something shady going on but at this exact moment I ain't caring too much about PED. Both Manny and Floyd could come trotting into the ring with Iv PED canisters attached to their arms and I wouldn't give a rusty effin' penny about it. I'm over the entire scandal. At least until after Thanksgiving. Lmao. Unforgivable turkey and gravy time! Holla!!!!!!

brownsugar says:

Huge amount of interesting and factual content in that two piece article to go letting an insy tinsy bit of MAyweather speculation/rumor distract you. And its info coming from a highly respected journalist not some bozo say like Pedro Fernandez (ring talk dot com aka National Enquirer of boxing news) who'd sell out his own mother if it meant boosting his ego.


Hauser's a big boy... he can take it like a man and he can dish it out. No writer can be as successful as him if he can't appreciate opposite views.

there are rumors of designs to build a time machine. but there's proof it would ever work.
being able to spin a story and connect the dots is what good writers do.

But when they preface there work with states like "I have no proof of..." or "It's been rumored"... it transforms the whole story from being "news" to being speculation at best.

For the record I never believed Pac was using for the same reason.... not one shred of proof.

And why bring Berto and Peterson into the mix... they were caught... temporarily exiled,.. and villified by the press and the boxing community already... it'll take years for them to regain respect and clear their names..

Berto was KO'd by Ortiz and barely made it past a mediocre Jan Zavec..
Peterson hasn't been seen since he scraped by with a gift decision against Khan. Whatever they had in their bodies for whatever reason didn't work.

All I know is that HBO,.. the Boxing press and the drug testing agency announced Mayweather and Cotto were clean when there tests came back post fight.

Radam G says:

Money May has been within the limit. Not clean. The roids, that he takes, are powerful and mean. The Money Man is not only a boksing superstar, he is a star of bull$hitology and timing of his fights when he can get maximum effect of roids and PEDs usage without 'em showing him to be dirty. That is a fact, JACK! And he loves a steroid snack.

If Money May did legit O-style testing -- 7/24/365 -- all types of syet would show up in him. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Good feed back, BrownSugar. I won't advocate too hard for any one certain writer but I think mentioning all those names were very relevant to his overall story. Berto himself is rebounding pretty damn well for someone supposedly being vilified. Mega event coming up this weekend. Not too shabby, IMO.


Truth be told this is a very forgiving sport. One can bite ears off (Tyson) one can beat his wife to a pulp (Corrales) one can spend years in prison and come back and make a million dollar payday (Clifford Etienne) . I betcha' if JAmes Butler (murderer of Sam Kellerman) got paroled ...he'd be able to resume his boxing career if he chose to do so. He'd even get a spot on Hbo if it meant big ratings and making a buck for him and the higher ups.

That's boxin', baby (in my best Smoke Gainer voice)...

Radam G says:

Don't forget the promoter, SouthPaul. Don King killed two men, spent time in the slammer for that. Come to the game, rip off the GOAT Ali, promote the richest heavyweight fight -- Rumble in the Jungle -- ever, rip off three-forth of the fighter he promoted, get a pardon from Prez Bush 43 and is a c-hair from becoming a billionaire. Oh, yes! I'd say that boksing is very forgiving. Holla!

SouthPaul says:

Yuuuuuuuup! The print was so small in the Terry Norris contract that jurors requested a magna find glass so they could attempt to make out exact wording. When Don King heard that..he immediately advised his attorneys to settle the case. Lmao.

ali says:

Yuuuuuuuup! The print was so small in the Terry Norris contract that jurors requested a magna find glass so they could attempt to make out exact wording. When Don King heard that..he immediately advised his attorneys to settle the case. Lmao.

Terrible Terry is in my top 3 favorite fighters of all time I'm glad that he won his case against Don the snake.com King.

ali says:

SouthPaul is on fire enjoying readingyour post.

amayseng says:

fantastic posts all around...

pics of JMM came out today, he has more muscle and definition at near 40 then he did at mid or late 20s...

he is definitely juicing....

berto had pics come out a few days ago, he is trim but NO LONGER has those biceps and shoulders like before....

peds are very much involved in all sports..

brownsugar says:

Good feed back, BrownSugar. I won't advocate too hard for any one certain writer but I think mentioning all those names were very relevant to his overall story. Berto himself is rebounding pretty damn well for someone supposedly being vilified. Mega event coming up this weekend. Not too shabby, IMO.


Truth be told this is a very forgiving sport. One can bite ears off (Tyson) one can beat his wife to a pulp (Corrales) one can spend years in prison and come back and make a million dollar payday (Clifford Etienne) . I betcha' if JAmes Butler (murderer of Sam Kellerman) got paroled ...he'd be able to resume his boxing career if he chose to do so. He'd even get a spot on Hbo if it meant big ratings and making a buck for him and the higher ups. Hell, this sport even forgave two sex offenders and allowed them to resume their careers (Eric Morel, Tony Ayala JR).

That's boxin', baby (in my best Smoke Gainer voice)...


Intresting comment SP,.. Likewise I can't advocate for Berto or Peterson.
But they have already been caught, and everytime they fight there will be those *asterkists in the article that states they tested positive for PED's(even now) . Everytime they appear on a face/off or 24/7, or interviewed (if they are so fortunate) the question will be asked.... and every time they fight... They won't be the ones asking for extensive drug testing,... it will be there opponents.

By Casting Berto and Peterson in the article, Hauser has stacked the deck in a way presents a strong insinuation that Mayweather has also done something wrong by association. And that goes beyond the limitations of merely reporting the news.
Fighters have been known to get and inadvertent use exemption for using nasal decongestant spray or taking asprin.
If that's even the case.

The same witch hunt could gain traction against the Wild Card Gym (if anybody wanted to waste the effort). Several high profile boxers who trained under Freddy Roach have been exposed for using PED's.
But there's no mention of that in the article.
If your going to use innuendo as if it were fact,.. at least be an equal opportunist.

Berto and Peterson will have to carry the taint of testing positive for the rest of there careers like sexual offenders who have to register with the local Police department. I'm sure gaining that type of infamy is not a pleasant experience.

Radam G says:

Money May, in his very idiotic way, will one day loudly and proudly admit to beating the system with PEDs and roids. Holla!

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leon30001 says:

hello Deepwater,

I respect your posts so i am not trying to split hairs, but cigarettes and weed aren't strictly "enhancing", which is the problem with these steroids. Also I know what you're saying re roids = bulky and slow, but then again, Lance Armstrong was a lithe fella, and he had his own pharmacy on the go it would seem.

ps four more years...how do you feel about that?! it's good enough for old Woodsy apparently!

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