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Memo To Marquez: Fight Manny Pacquiao Again, Change Strategy, Tactics

BY Michael Woods ON November 14, 2011
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Pacquiao Marquez 111112 004aI am no technical wizard. I do not possess the acumen or the authority to dispense advice and expect it to be followed to a T. I am merely a pundit, a man with a keyboard, some passwords to post stuff myself and a level of interest that has left me having watched a boatload of boxing matches.

But please allow me to furnish some advice to Juan Manuel Marquez, and his trainer Nacho Beristain, or whoever trains him in the future.

Sir, you have fought Manny Pacquiao three times. You have been "awarded" a draw, and two losses. You are not doing something right.

You can dispute this, you can argue this till you and I are both blue in the face, you can dismiss me as a dope. But the record book says I am not wrong. The record book says that Pacquiao hasn't lost to you. The record book is speaking to you, and telling you that if you want to turn that around, if you two do fight again, you must do something different.

In my inexpert opinion, I'd recommend you changing your tactics and strategy, and go from being a guy who capitalizes when the other guy makes mistakes, to being a guy who relies more on volume, more on being first. I'd recommend you being less of a counterpuncher, and more of a puncher, period. I'm not recommending you switch your style wholesale, Juan Manuel. You should still do what it is that makes you a Hall of Fame talent. But in all three fights, which you maintain you won, you threw fewer punches than Pacquiao. Next time, make damned sure you throw more than him. Or at least, try to do so. If you get all offensive minded on Manny, and come at him, you are fighting the sort of style he prefers. So it might not work. You'd be wise to throw more punches than Pacquiao to increase the likelihood that judges who're unwilling or incapable of rewarding a style such as yours against the icon that is Pacquiao smile upon you, instead of screw you.

It might not work. But what you've been doing hasn't been working either. That's not me talking, that's the record book. That's Boxrec talkin. And you know what they say about those who do the same thing over and over and expect a different result? They say they're crazy. I'd argue that maybe crazy isn't the right word. But stubborn is. Stick to stubborn and you're likely to lose again. You will hold your principles intact but you will be 0-3-1 against the Filipino in the place that matters most, right or wrong, the official record books.

Juan Manuel, unless you get the terms of fight four to your liking, and the clash takes place in Mexico, the same darn thing will quite likely happen again. You will fight a smart fight, the rounds will be hard to score and subject to debate, and the guy who generates more money printing than the Fed, Pacquaio, will have his hand raised. If and when you fight again, tweak your strategy and tactics, or accept another loss as a foregone conclusion.

Comment on this article

jacubi50 says:

That will never happen. Marquez will knocked out if he ever becomes aggressive. That's Manny's game. Also, Marquez was able to land the shots he landed on Manny because he stepped on Manny's foot many times throughout the fight. Watch for yourselve. Manny won close decision, 115-113. Marquez needs to stop crying, as well as the so called boxing experts, writers, pundits, and boxers who claimed Manny lost.

Radam G says:

Marquez fought like a slick, scary b*tchan warrior. I thought that he calls himself a Mexican Warrior. Well, he didn't live up to it. And lost deservingly for not trying to take the belt. He wants to be given sh*t. Who in da fudge appointed him to be entitled? Fudge him! There is no need for a fourth whuppin' of his sorry arse by Da Manny. Holla!

OneTonMan says:

Absolutely right, Mr. Woods!
Fighting like a scared animal is a negative in the eyes of many. Some may prefer your footsteps or movement, but boxing is a blood sport, the more of it, the more it is appreciated. Boxing is a sport of aggression. Know the secret of Pacquiao? It's his devil-may-care attitude. That's what catapulted him to the top. Those who choose not to engage and only defend when attacked are only appreciated in a court of law. Marquez performance was good in that he landed the more effective punches, but he did it backing up all throughout the fight, and did it only in spurts when Pacquiao only attacks. Try as he might, Pacquiao chased Marquez to no avail, Marquez was able to counter Pacquiao's imbalances.That spelled Marquez's demise in the eyes of the judges, and in the eyes of many who paid to see bloodbath and grit.

brownsugar says:

Popularity contests rarely go the the more skilled boxer, the Majority of fans have always loved "Rocky" more than "Apollo Creed",......... While Pac was stumbling around the ring eating straight rights and being finessed out of position with a look on his face like he can't believe he just missed the subway........Marquez was putting on a boxing clinic. It's no surprise a majority of websites and boxing fans (including many professional world champions believe that JMM got the better of the worlds highest rated fighter (at least according to the popular vote). Although Might doesn't always mean Right,.. it does kindle the debate as to who is really the worlds best fighter..
Strong words are being bandied about like "Robbery, Fix,...... Another TopRank Hometown decision, and so forth. But it's not quite as bad as Froch vs Dirrell, Williams vs Lara, or Cintron vs Sergio Martinez,.. it's more like Williams vs Martinez #1,.. or Berto vs Collazo. Either side could be right and wrong..... It's clear the outcome has Roach, Arum, and Top Rank SHOOK to the core about facing Mayweather next. And I dont blame them.

TerryI says:

I agree...Since it is Marquez who wants to wrest the title from Pacquiao, the burden of proof is on him to demonstrate that he's the better fighter.
Pacquiao: 176 connects of 578 punches
Marquez: 138 connects of 436 punches

Being the more offensive fighter may not work (it didn't against Mayweather). But at least there is still the possibility of success, while counter-punching did not work the last three times.

TerryI says:

Marquez contemplating retirement after "robbery." He may yet change his mind, as he has i believe a ten million dollar guarantee should a rematch take place. In that case, he can employ a new strategy. I for one would want to see this fight.

FighterforJC says:

The other thing is, Marquez was playing the role of matador but he failed to do what is expected of a matador, which is to finish the bull. At times marquez looked a lot more like a rodeo clown than a matdor whenever Manny would get in a mini-rally.

ultimoshogun says:

Nice post, brownsugar. I felt of their three fights this one was the clearest win for Marquez. I felt the judges got it right the first two fights, but not this time. This fight was much more tactical than the first two which benefitted Marquez, who landed the solid cleaner punches through out the fight. I had Marquez winning by one or two rounds.

mortcola says:

re-post from another article: styles definitely make fights. Marquez has the absolute scientific blueprint for making Pac look ordinary. Just not for punching often or decisively enough to actually win. But there is another consideration. I don't think Pac is slipping physically. His reflexes were fine, he was in great shape. But, writing as a professional observer of motivation and mentality, I think Pac is not only distracted by his quadruple life of saviour, celebrity-singer, politician, and fighter, I think he is no longer comfortable with the persona of "attacker". There was something half-hearted and not particularly hungry in his demeanor in the ring the other night, apart from the frustration that Marquez' intelligent countering caused him. I think Manny is not a hungry fighter anymore, and wants no more than to give a good show, without undue violence. He showed mercy to Mosley and Margarito, and hesitated a great deal against JMM even when not particularly troubled by JMM's responses. I think Manny has transcended the poor hungry fighter, and as a result will not be as effective any more unless it gets through to him in a desperate, motivating way, that his legacy has been built on both his viciousness and his decent humility. Without the viciousness, he'd better just focus on politics. Against Mayweather, he better have every bit of slum-child hunger he can find, cause tearing chunks of meat like the skilled Tasmanian devil he is at his best is the way he wins that fight.

FighterforJC says:

I don't think Pacquiao has lost his hunger, and I don't completely agree that he is no longer comfortable with the "attacker" persona. I think that over the last 3 years, Pacquiao has focused on refining his style and has been working hard to shed his reputation of being a one-dimensional slugger. He has become more of a finesse fighter, tightening up his defense, improving his balance and picking his shots better. Against bigger, less flexible welterweights, Pacquiao is a shining example of "power boxing." Pacquiao and Roach may have fooled themselves into believing that Pacquiao is a pure technical boxer. It's hard to blame them considering how decisively he beat technically solid fighters like Miguel Cotto and De La Hoya. Against slower-footed fighters Pacquiao's been able to box circles and he should continue to utilize the same style against bigger foes who are stronger but slower. Pacquiao should've reverted to his more aggressive style against JMM rather than trying to prove he has become JMM's equal in terms of technical skill. Pacquiao gave JMM too much room to operate. Pacquiao should've been more aggressive and more reckless. One thing that was not in doubt in the 3rd fight was how much stronger Pacquiao was than JMM. JMM didn't even bother trying to hurt Pacquiao. Pacquiao could've afforded to take more chances against JMM. He would've been better off trying to stink out the fight by running away from JMM or he could've been as reckless as he wanted, but the middle of the road approach was definitely not the way to go for Pacquiao. Against Mayweather he needs to be a pure aggressor rather than trying to be technical.

Radam G says:

WOW! In the first place, Marquez was cheating his arse off by using an illegal optical illusion of stepping on Da Manny's foot. No doubt this is why the crybaby looked like he was landing effective punches to the already bias haters, faders and know nothings of the game of pugilism. [One can trick 'em any day of the week, because they already have a fixed-mind of extreme hatred that they will clearly and loudly deny having.] IMHO these suckas are just blinded from their own self-denying Pinoy hating like in the days of Irish/Black GOAT Cassius Clay/Muhammad Ali, they were blinded from Muslim hating.

In the day of the first black world heavyweight champion Jack Johnson, they were blinded from black-man hating.

And just like they cannot admitted to how the great Marvelous One [Marvelous Hagler] was because of southpaw-switching-to-conventional style hating. And these suckas cannot and will not dare say that the Italian Dragon Joe Calzaghe was one of the greatest fighter in the history of the game because of their southpaw slap-boxing hating.

Oh, YUP! These suckas have a subliminal bias against Da Manny that they don't have the cojones to admit to. But that it all right! Because that wacko thinking and believing is a weakness which cannot CHANGE REALITY! Holla!

riverside says:

Change strategy tactics ? the first two fight he could of won if it wasn't for the knockdowns! The third fight he didn't go down, strategy changed! The fight was close, Marquez lost another close decision, the fight could of been a draw,possible. Jmm was exposing the human beater as an ordinary boxer, Looked like Pac was chasing a better skilled fighter. Jmm counter punching will always give pacman trouble. Roach must feel really dumbass, with his " we gonna F**k knock him out 'nnnn shutting up for good, I wanna see Marquez on his back". The fight reminds a bit of chavez -whitaker,Chavez chased sweet pee for 12 rounds, Yes sweet pea was moving back, but his was put hurt on the agressor, besides making him look bad. Roach/ koncs better think twice about putting pac in with counterpunching tech. Money may or Bradley, Bradley style has made his previous opponets look bad. Mike Jones might be next, if he decides not to fight Bailey, he could get huge paycheck being a stationary target for pac-man.

Mickylove says:

any boxing fan would know that when an orthodox fighter meets a southpaw, there is going to be a lot of issues with stepping on feet....there seems to be some fascination with a few Pac fans that this was solely down to Marquez trying to cheat his way to victory, as a neutral i saw both fighters do it repeatedly.

Marquez does not need to become the agressor to beat Pac in a 4th fight, he simply has to throw the counter and follow it up with another meaningful shot or flurry....why change a style that has won more rounds out of 36 arguably? This was no robbery and to me due to the nature of the close rounds there can be an argument made for 8 rounds to 4 for either fighter... I prefer Marquez' work more myself, but understand the american boxing fraternity (judges) like a more aggressive style so it will always be hard for Marquez to get the win.

Radam G says:

Toe stepping and knee bumping are parts of the tricks of the trades. It has the least to do with one fighter being orthodox and one being southpaw. "Any boxing fan" would not know _____ about true boksing. Most boxing fans just mimic likes monkeys what talking heads broadcast.

Orthodox fighters step on each others toes tons of times more than an orthodox fighter would step on a southpaw's toes.

Once again, for those not in da know, stepping on toes, knee bumping and ankle-clipping and/or tripping are known CLEARLY as some of the tricks of the trade. Holla!

TerryIgnacio says:

Toe stepping and knee bumping are parts of the tricks of the trade. It has the least to do with one fighter being orthodox and one being southpaw. "Any boxing fan" would not know _____ about true boksing. Most boxing fans just mimic likes monkeys what talking heads broadcast.

Orthodox fighters step on each others' toes tons of times more than an orthodox fighter would step on a southpaw's toes.

Once again, for those not in da know, stepping on toes, knee bumping and ankle-clipping and/or tripping are known CLEARLY as some of the tricks of the trade. That IS -- to those know da game, have played da game or are in da game.

Fans, fanfaronades and faders see just about any thing that a talking head spits about. Holla!



I agree that it happens a lot when those two types of fighters face each other. Even if it were intentional (and I am not saying Marquez did so), it should be looked at one way of gaining advantage. The term "tricks of the trade" is the perfect one for it. Maybe not exactly legal, but somebody would have called the attention of the referee if he himself did not see it being used to an unfair advantage.

Even though I'm a Pacquiao fan, I would not be part of those who proclaim that Marquez is a cheater, as if there would be an effect on the outcome had those tactics not been employed.

Radam G says:

Danggit! Who has "PROCLAIM[ed] that Marquez is a cheater?" Da DUDE is great, intelligent boxer, who is a fudging crybaby, because he cannot get da win over Da Manny.

Every boxer and dey momma use tricks of the trade, including Da Manny. Da Manny slick kicked the heebeejeez outta Marquez a few times for that toe-stepping action jive. If fanfaronades and fans don't know something, they don't see it until it is pointed out. Now Everyone and his cousin will probably go and look for Da Manny kicks. Also Da Manny used a few thumbs [rubbing them for those who will be clueless] on dat sucka too.

OMFG! Da game is called "The Sweet Science" for a reason. I guess if you are just a fan, groupie or fanfaronade of the discipline, instead of a part of it, you will miss a whole lot of sh*t. And see what you believe. And every _____ and dey sistah [sic] oughta know that is how brains recieve. It is all about the neurons shooting off. Holla!

TerryIgnacio says:

Marquez really did make Pacquiao look like an oridnary fighter. Yet he failed to get the win. I guess the judges wanted to see more aggression from Marquez. I wonder if he would change his tactics a bit if and when they meet for installment number 4. I hope he does so to increase his chances to get a decision.

Radam G says:

If Marquez changes his arch-survivial tactics, he'll get KTFO! [He fought to survive from getting knock down and out, not to win. In his mind, he won because he didn't get dropped or put to sleep.] There is no need for a fourth bout IMO! Marquez is confused and thinks that he is entitled. He's already calling for a fouth fighting in Mexico, and saying that he wants his latest lost to Da Manny declared a "No contest." Naku! Buang-na-buang siya, gayod!

Dude should act like an adult and move on. Or just maybe, if he can beat the WBO's number one contender, he can argue for a third shot. He got this last shot because the WBO waived its next-in-line-top-contender-fight-for-the-crown rule. Holla!

TerryIgnacio says:

If Marquez changes his arch-survivial tactics, he'll get KTFO! [He fought to survive from getting knock down and out, not to win. In his mind, he won because he didn't get dropped or put to sleep.] There is no need for a fourth bout IMO! Marquez is confused and thinks that he is entitled. He's already calling for a fouth fighting in Mexico, and saying that he wants his latest lost to Da Manny declared a "No contest." ......


Marquez had the perfect game plan for not being knocked down. If he tried to risk more, maybe he could have gotten the win. Or he could have had his butt on the canvas.

Cuervo says:

Lol. What a clueless boxing "fan" you are.

analyzinfightin says:

Popularity contests rarely go the the more skilled boxer, the Majority of fans have always loved "Rocky" more than "Apollo Creed",......... While Pac was stumbling around the ring eating straight rights and being finessed out of position with a look on his face like he can't believe he just missed the subway........Marquez was putting on a boxing clinic. It's no surprise a majority of websites and boxing fans (including many professional world champions believe that JMM got the better of the worlds highest rated fighter (at least according to the popular vote). Although Might doesn't always mean Right,.. it does kindle the debate as to who is really the worlds best fighter..
Strong words are being bandied about like "Robbery, Fix,...... Another TopRank Hometown decision, and so forth. But it's not quite as bad as Froch vs Dirrell, Williams vs Lara, or Cintron vs Sergio Martinez,.. it's more like Williams vs Martinez #1,.. or Berto vs Collazo. Either side could be right and wrong..... It's clear the outcome has Roach, Arum, and Top Rank SHOOK to the core about facing Mayweather next. And I dont blame them.


Totally agree.

jacubi50 says:

First, to all the boxing "experts", writers, pundits, boxers, and people in general who claimed Marquez won are complete morons. It was a close fight but Manny won nevertheless. Everyone needs to rewatch the fight and learn how to score and be objective. As for Marquez changing strategies, it's never gonna happen becuase he'll get knocked out if becomes aggressive--that's Manny's game. Marquez knows it and that's why he relegated to counterpunching and stepping back the entire fight. What happened to his promise that he's going to try to win every round convincingly. It did not happen so stop crying robbery. Also, during the fight Marquez stepped on Manny's foot multiple times deliberately to land his punches. Tony Weeks didn't call foul, what a dork. Manny won 115-113, period. At the worst it was a draw, but Manny won it clearly. Also, why did Manny walk back to his corner with slumped shoulders and head down. He was so disappointed that he didn't win in a knockout because the bar was set so high for him. Everyone took advantage of that lasting impression and claimed it was a gesture of "defeat". Plain BS.

jacubi50 says:

Marquez said he was going to try to win every round convincingly, but what did he do. He moved back 97% of the time and counter punched. If he tried to move forward and punch with Manny he will get knocked out.

gpike says:

Actually, JMM should probably skip another fight with Manny and just retire. Most writers think he won the 3rd clash. I thought he was winning thru the 10th and maybe gave up one of the last 2 rnds. Manny got the decision because he's a cash cow not because he won. Manny looked bad, exposed and not as explosive as he once was. JMM knows he won; every Mexican in the world knows he won and every writer with a pair of working eyes knows he won, so why fight him again? It will probably look the same as the last one and the judges in Vegas will never give him the decision. He's 38 years old, he fought the fight of his life, he suffered the only kind of "loss" worth savoring and ultimately retiring on--the one where you actually win and the other guy and everybody watching knows it. No rematch.

TerryI says:

All this arguing is getting tedious. This comedic take on Pacquiao's ring entrance was the highlight of the night for me by far. Pure comedy gold =)

http://www*.youtube.c*om/watch?v*=TaPBcwl8d*TM

Cuervo says:

I said it many years ago since the Morales fight....Pacquiao is nothing more than overrated, protected under Arum's wing fighter who just lost for the second time to a 38 year old by the name of Juan Manuel Marquez. Starting with Morales who was coming from three losses and couldn't make weight before facing Pacquiao, to JMM who is 38, way past his prime days, way past his weight and at the end of his career, Arum has carefully faced Pacquiao against opponents (some with great names) just at the right time. De La Hoya was a 36 year old promoter who like mosley should've hung the gloves after facing Mayweather. I mean come on, do you people really believe that had DLH been in his prime or even just a few years younger, Arum would have ever allowed Pacquiao to face him!? Ha! Of course not! Arum is a business man. The same DLH that faced the old Chavez, would have trashed and finish Pacquiao in 3 rounds. Hatton was nothing more than an average boxer who had never faced anyone, yet HBO made the naive believe he was a top class contender. Clottey has always been a mummy as a fighter. Marquez had been calling out Pacquiao for a third fight for three years, and had been ignored time and time again by Arum because he knew his fighter would lose AGAIN. After the 2nd fight, I posted a comment on HBO.com and said that Pacquaio would never face JMM until Marquez would engr138 2be older and slower...and that's exactly what happened. Arum just informed Golden Boy and Floyd's promoter, that right now he's not interested in a fight with Floyd. Lol He knows Mayweather would trash, embarrass and retire Pacquiao. I said many years ago and I'll say again...Pacquiao has always been nothing more than an overrated, overprotected "fighter", whose fights have been cherry picked very carefully by Arum to make some serious money. I've been watching boxing since the mid 80's when Chavez defeated Mayweather (floyd's uncle)...and sad to see that the the once beautiful sport has turns into nothing more than a big fat business and a bad joke. Do you people know that the two judges who gave Pacquiao the victory last Saturday had judged the last 5 of Pacquiao's fights? Lol. F%$k Arum and his judges and f%$ a fourth fight.....boxing is dead. I've been watching boxing since I was 8 years old when Chavez defeated Mayweather in the mid 80's, when boxing was a real sport, when boxers would fight for pride, when each of the four divisions would classify from 1-10 and you had to be #1 to fight the champion, when fighting for a championship was once in a lifetime opportunity, when the champion would fight the contender when the contender was at his prime and not an old washed up and/or coming from a loss. Those times are long gone. Now at days anyone can fight anyone at any weight division, and the beautiful sport of boxing is nothing more than a big fat business.

analyzinfightin says:

[QUOTE=Editor Mike;10505][br] alt="Pacquiao Marquez 111112 004a"[/br]I am no technical wizard. I do not possess the acumen or the authority to dispense advice and expect it to be followed to a T. I am merely a pundit, a man with a keyboard, some passwords to post stuff myself and a level of interest that has left me having watched a boatload of boxing matches.
But please allow me to furnish some advice to Juan Manuel Marquez, and his trainer Nacho Beristain, or whoever trains him in the future.
Sir, you have fought Manny Pacquiao three times. You have been "awarded" a draw, and two losses. You are not doing something right.
You can dispute this, you can argue this till you and I are both blue in the face, you can dismiss me as a dope. But the record book says I am not wrong. The record book says that Pacquiao hasn't lost to you. The record book is speaking to you, and telling you that if you want to turn that around, if you two do fight again, you must do something different.
In my inexpert opinion, I'd recommend you changing your tactics and strategy, and go from being a guy who capitalizes when the other guy makes mistakes, to being a guy who relies more on volume, more on being first. I'd recommend you being less of a counterpuncher, and more of a puncher, period. I'm not recommending you switch your style wholesale, Juan Manuel. You should still do what it is that makes you a Hall of Fame talent. But in all three fights, which you maintain you won, you threw fewer punches than Pacquiao. Next time, make damned sure you throw more than him. Or at least, try to do so. If you get all offensive minded on Manny, and come at him, you are fighting the sort of style he prefers. So it might not work. You'd be wise to throw more punches than Pacquiao to increase the likelihood that judges who're unwilling or incapable of rewarding a style such as yours against the icon that is Pacquiao smile upon you, instead of screw you.
It might not work. But what you've been doing hasn't been working either. That's not me talking, that's the record book. That's Boxrec talkin. And you know what they say about those who do the same thing over and over and expect a different result? They say they're crazy. I'd argue that maybe crazy isn't the right word. But stubborn is. Stick to stubborn and you're likely to lose again. You will hold your principles intact but you will be 0-3-1 against the Filipino in the place that matters most, right or wrong, the official record books.
Juan Manuel, unless you get the terms of fight four to your liking, and the clash takes place in Mexico, the same darn thing will quite likely happen again. You will fight a smart fight, the rounds will be hard to score and subject to debate, and the guy who generates more money printing than the Fed, Pacquaio, will have his hand raised. If and when you fight again, tweak your strategy and tactics, or accept another loss as a foregone conclusion.[/QUOTE]

Marquez didn't do anything wrong in any of those fights. It just so happens to be that Pacquiao is much younger and has arguably the most powerful promoter in Vegas, which counts for a lot.

analyzinfightin says:

[QUOTE=TerryI;10535]I agree...Since it is Marquez who wants to wrest the title from Pacquiao, the burden of proof is on him to demonstrate that he's the better fighter.
Pacquiao: 176 connects of 578 punches
Marquez: 138 connects of 436 punches

Being the more offensive fighter may not work (it didn't against Mayweather). But at least there is still the possibility of success, while counter-punching did not work the last three times.[/QUOTE]

The CompuBox argument is stupid. Pacquiao was credited for glancing blows landed on Marquez's gloves and arms. On the other hand, Marquez never got credit for his body-punching. Anyone with decent vision saw Marquez landing the more telling blows on that night.

The company that operates CompuBox stats is in cahoots with Top Rank, one of their main clients. The individuals who monitor punches missed/landed are not immune to bias.

There's your CompuBox.

amilesqmarleya7103 says:

And it has analogue?

amilesqmarleya7103 says:

And it has analogue?

Radam G says:

Blame every darn thing on "Top Rank!" It is not in "cahoots" with anybody! Holla!

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