If Only Mormeck Would Back His Words Up When He Fights Wladimir Klitschko...LOTIERZO |
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| Written by Frank Lotierzo | |||
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Thursday, 27 October 2011 09:25
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FighterforJC says: I agree with most of the article except for, "Klitschko is a nightmare for short swarmers." I think it's the opposite. Short swarmers are a nightmare to Wlad. He's never fought one. Most of his opponents were not short, they were just shorter. These guys fought like big men and didn't have the low center of gravity of Tyson r Frazier. The only big man who would be able to swarm Wlad would be Riddick Bowe. Frazier would've been too slow of feet to get to Wlad, but I think a prime Tyson would've been a nightmare for Klitschko. Robert Curtis says: Yo, FighterforJC. Did you just say Frazier would have too slow to get to Wlad? He got to the GOAT Ali for 44 rounds! Whoa! What are you drinking and where can I buy some? Robert Curtis says: I'll agree though that it seems a prime Tyson would chop down both Klits pretty quick. Wlad's chin would probably break just looking at a 20 year old Iron Mike. But Vitali is stronger and no coward or quitter. What I want to know is why neither Klitschko would fight Gary Coleman while he was still around? "What-ch-you talkin' 'bout, Wlad?" Robert Curtis says: I'm amazed that the British newspaper The Guardian has Mayweather's acquittal as front page news: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/oct/27/floyd-mayweather-jr-acquitted-harassment They obviously take their boxing much more seriously over there than we do here. Radam G says: Smokin' Joe had blazin' feet. IMHO he'd woulda done to the K-bros/docs what he did to the late Buster Mathis. Smokin' Joe was the only heavyweight to match da GOAT Ali in foot speed. Though a different style of movin' those doggs. Holla! FighterforJC says: Yo, FighterforJC. Did you just say Frazier would have too slow to get to Wlad? He got to the GOAT Ali for 44 rounds! Whoa! What are you drinking and where can I buy some? His feet are too slow. The Ali that Frazier fought wasn't the dancing Ali. The Klitschkos are several inches taller than Ali, 35 pounds heavier, and comparable in speed, and about twice the power. The Klitchkos have PHENOMENAL footwork, which is their main defense. Vitali's awkward looking but you know he moves EXTREMELY well around the ring. So does Wlad. The Klitschkos as I've described before, are the real world version of a computer glitch (Has anyone called them the "Glitchkos" yet?). They are off the charts and they throw off all the code. They're the equivalent of a cheap boss in a fighting game. Robert Curtis says: That was an EXTREMELY PHENOMENAL comment, Fighterfor JC. (Anyone know what he said?) First you say Ali was no longer a runner. Then you say Wlad's not a runner either. Are you seriously saying that Wlad's a better mover than Ali was during his first two title reigns? And you've got to go back and take a serious look at some Joe Frazier fights. Joe moved like the cartoon Tasmanian devil and ripped people over and over with that nasty hook. He had a huge gas tank and punched constantly in 15 round fights. Granted, size might make the difference against today's Russian monsters. Big George beat Joe down in Jamaica, no doubt. But the referee had to stop it. If the referee hadn't stopped it, Foreman would have had to kill Frazier. That's how much heart Frazier had. It's should be a crime to mention Klitschkos in the same breath with Ali and Frazier. They are far too careful and cautious. The Klits never put it all on the line. I won't say that the Klits are cowards, but they will never ever be in knock-down drag out fight, and if they ever found themselves in one, I doubt they'd find the heart to survive. To paraphrase Mark Twain, the difference between Ali/Frazier and the Klitschkos is like the difference between lightning and a lightning bug. Radam G says: Hehehehehe! Leave it to Bobby C to brings the laughs. "Lightning and a lightning bug!" The power of both would scorch the K bros/docs TWISI! One brother needs peepee for his bad bones and the other hope that nobody lucks up and crack him on that china chin. Holla! Robert Curtis says: Radam knows better than I do what the Ali/Frazier fights meant to the generation who witnessed them in their youth. Some brilliant guy (whose name I can't remember after 10 hours of work and 3 hours of classes), no wait, it was Jerry Izenberg. Izenberg said it best: "Ali and Frazier were both Ahabs and also each other's white whales". What those two men did in the ring will never be forgotten! They gave the whole world a FIGHT, not just once, but 3 times. They brought it all and left it all in the ring. Hey, this has got to be something new on TSS. Two literary references in one thread. Twain and Melville. Twain and Melville were to American writing what Ali and Frazier were to American(and world) boxing. Robert Curtis says: Fe'Roz is 100% right. But I'm starting to feel like we've been scolding and not schooling FighterforJC. He's a more loyal TSS fan than I am. I disappear for months at a time. He did diss ATG Frazier, but maybe he didn't know any better yesterday. Am I wimping? Maybe this means I never had the killer instinct to be a champion? LOL! I wanted to box so bad when I was a kid. My Dad let me hang a bag in my backyard and whack it, and he backed me when parents complained about me knocking down neighborhood bullies. But when I mentioned the real thing, actually boxing in The Ring, Dad talked me out of it every time. I suppose I should be grateful because I still have a nice pointy nose, attached retinas and all my marbles. If I had really wanted to fight, I would have done it. No matter what, right? That's what warrior Joe did every time. Joe and Muhammad were like Gods on mountaintops to me as a kid. I wanted to join that pantheon on high. But my dad convinced me that I had a brain and that it was better to use it than to get it abused. Still not sure who was right. Too late now. OK, enough with the confessions and being my own shrink. Anybody who doesn't think Joe was the ATG who defined Ali's career needs to find a Frazier fight collection and watch it all the way through. mortcola says: Fe'Roz - Great to see ya! You too, Bobby C. Quick question....why wouldn't the Klitschko's, Vitali, at least, do pretty much to Frazier what Foreman did? All worship of GOATs aside, do you really think that's what would have gone down in the ring? FighterforJC says: That was an EXTREMELY PHENOMENAL comment, FighterforJC. (Anyone know what he said?) First you say Ali was no longer a runner. Then you say Wlad's not a runner either. Are you seriously saying that Wlad's a better mover than Ali was during his first two title reigns? And you've got to go back and take a serious look at some Joe Frazier fights. Joe moved like the cartoon Tasmanian devil and ripped people over and over with that nasty hook. He had a huge gas tank and punched constantly in 15 round fights. Granted, size might make the difference against today's Russian monsters. Big George beat Joe down in Jamaica, no doubt. But the referee had to stop it. If the referee hadn't stopped it, Foreman would have had to kill Frazier. That's how much heart Frazier had. It should be a crime to mention Klitschkos in the same breath with Ali and Frazier. They are far too careful and cautious. The Klits never put it all on the line. I won't say that the Klits are cowards, but they will never ever be in knock-down drag out fight, and if they ever found themselves in one, I doubt they'd find the heart to survive. To paraphrase Mark Twain, the difference between Ali/Frazier and the Klitschkos is like the difference between lightning and a lightning bug. First off, read my comment. The Ali that Frazier fought was not the same Ali that was known for his dancing. Second, I don't know what you mean by "mover," if you're talking about smoothness or grace then Ali's got that over Wlad. In terms of EFFECTIVENESS, Wlad's as good a mover as Ali if not better. Wlad's not dazzling the audience with his movement, but he sure is doing anumber on his foes, who all end up looking like deer caught in headlights. Ali made his opponents look foolish, cuaing them to swing and miss by centimeters. Wlad does better than that. He takes the will out of his opopnents from even winging punches anymore after a few rounds. Say what you want about this era of heavyweights, but Wlad is immeasurably more dominant over his opponents than Ali ever was over his. FighterforJC says: Damn, My Google Alert just went off with the mentioning of Joe Frazier's name. Shame on you, FighterForJC. You should know better than to use a Boxing God's name in vain. Joe Frazier in his prime would have finished off both Klitschko's as appetizers. Their names should never be mentioned with that of the man that took the unbeaten GOAT fifteen rounds and put him on his ass. With a smile on his face, he would have walked the K Boyz down, snorted and grinned and unleashed a hell the likes of which both of them together in the combined careers have never experienced. He would get inside them so fast, his head would be resting on their colarbone and he did his deadly business, chopping them into prime cuts like the slabs of meat he beat on at work. In a slaughterhouse. I know better than to engage in pointless, hypothetical and unverifiable "would've" arguments, but the simple fact is that the Klitschkos are GENETICALLY superior to Ali. Look at Wlad's performance at 35 and compare that with Ali's. Better yet, take a look at Vitali, who hasn't slowed down one bit at the age of 40. Not to mention he was out of the ring for just as long as Ali was and came back even older than Ali was. That's SUPREMACY over there. Radam G says: The K-Bros/docs benefit from weak -- very weak competition, not GENETICS. People were scare to challenge old-a$$ Jack Johnson when the dude was in his 40s and 50s. Dude fought until he was in his mid 60s. And Ron Lyle made a comeback in his 50s and was still whackin' head. FighterforJC says: @Radam G: Vitali has no movement? He's untouchable. For such a stationary target that's a remarkable feat. Ali part 2 was a human punching bag, which is what made him great. Radam G says: Doc Vitali has great leg movement. He is just not adroitness with those long, bad legs. Holla! Radam G says: By the way Jess Willard had "movement." So did Bonecrusher Smith, fat-a$$ Tony Tubbs and Tony Tuckers. Movement is not what makes a fight GREAT. There is a whole lot of other variables that are involved. Too bad for the K-bros/docs that they lack the competition to bring those other variables out of them. One knows what that they are when he sees them. It is like the "It Factor." The K-bros/docs just done have that IMHO. Holla! mortcola says: The irony, Radam, is that even without the "It" factor, their skills, power, and intelligence, just might neutralize and dominate nearly any fighter you could put in front of them. Joe Frazier had "it", but I envision him being toyed with and brutalized by Vitali, and skewered by Wlad, with the possibility that Wlad would be hurt by a hook - although he is seldom touched by hooks, or much of anything. It is all woulda-coulda - but I don't mistake the epic nature of an historical battle for criteria by which one historical demigod beats todays current champs. Foreman mangled a tiny Frazier; a slow and easy to hit Lyle nearly took out Foreman; a Norton who couldn't get out two rounds with Foreman and Shavers shut down Ali. No one has ever won more than a couple of rounds against the "dull", "it-less" Klitschkos. "It" is a psychological thing in the mind of the beholder, and the writers of history; what happens in the ring is another thing. Condor says: Nostalgia is a very powerful thing. I love Joe Frazier too, but either Klitschko would have brutalized him. The size, skill, and power would have been insurmountable (much like in Kingston). Radam G says: The K-bros/docs have fought nothing but stiffs and corpses. Sad for them. Even chump heavyweights of long-ago yesterdays -- say 1900 through 1995 would easily kayoed them. Holla! Radam G says: D@mortcola, you and I will never meet with a conclusion on the K-bros/docs. I suggest we just do a contusion. Say we meet at your favorite gym. Hehehehehe! NOPE! Just jokin!' Ain't got time to be in dat squared jungle in the Big Apple City getting on my smokin!' Smokin' Joe would be proud of me, since I fight/fought more like da GOAT Ali. But I could/can smoke. It is all good that you see the K-bros/docs as great. There is no need to debate. mortcola says: D@mortcola, you and I will never meet with a conclusion on the K-bros/docs. I suggest we just do a contusion. Say we meet at your favorite gym. Hehehehehe! NOPE! Just jokin!' Ain't got time to be in dat squared jungle in the Big Apple City getting on my smokin!' Smokin' Joe would be proud of me, since I fight/fought more like da GOAT Ali. But I could/can smoke. It is all good that you see the K-bros/docs as great. There is no need to debate. To each his own. It's DOUBLE GOOD! But I would not scribble about those suckas one time if I were Editor Mikey Wood. I just had to get on my rhyme. Neither K-bro/doc is a dime. Hehehehehe! Holla! Hey Rad - All them chump heavyweights might have had more "it"; but they would have been served up as Ukrainian shishkebabs - it-kebabs - by the good, dull doctors. But of all the people who disagree with me, this week you are my favorite. That's because my wife is very happy with me this week. But, ya know, a little sparring would be fun - surprised there haven't been more TSS F2F occurrences. I need to increase my Pinoy quotient. Been benefiting weekly from the advice of the great Dom Marino, who had Cooney before Jones and Rappaport handed him to Victor Valle. Anytime you wanna hit Huntington, lemme know! We're a fun little gym. Late Great Al Gavin's old gym; Wildcat Collins; Wayne Kelly; Bobby Cassidy; Randy Gordon; Owen Beck. Regilio Tuur just came down for a workout. Peace. Radam G says: Whatever you conceive, your brains will believe. It doesn't matter about the chit chatter. It is all about da brain, because in the end, all of our lives go down da dirt drain. While you are alive, constructive thinking may be a lot of pain. So just make up any jive, so up on somebodeee and dey food, ya' can gain. Hehehehehehe! Holla! Radam G says: Naku! You are talking about Regilio "Benito" Tuur. The dude knocked out Amerkano Kelcie Banks in the 1988 Olympic Games in South Korea. I was there. I sparred with Benito a few times during his early pro career. If he remembers me, you will know who I am. But I'm not a Korean from Cali. Da sucka was fond of calling me a Koreano, but I'm a straight-up Pinoy with a second home in Cali. You could say that Cali is my adopted state. Holla! mortcola says: Benito looks not a day older. 137 pounds. Sharp dressed man. Demonstrated some unconventional duck-slide-pivot defensive moves using dem feet 'n hips I'd never been taught. Fine fighter! Robert Curtis says: Great to see your post too, Mortcola! I believe I said somewhere in this thread that "size would be a factor" not in Joe's favor against VK or WK, although I still don't count Joe out in this kind of fantasy boxing. Foreman wasn't just strong, he was a pretty fantastic, once-in-TWO-generations kind of champion. Both of George Foreman's significant eras were more rich with talent than today's current heavyweight division. But I know better than to argue with TSS's preeminent Klitschko scholar. Or do I? Has anyone heard about this new documentary film about the Klitschkos that's coming out? I heard about it on NPR. Robert Curtis says: Hi again, Mortcola. Where's your gym? I'd love to visit. I'm out in LA and usually only head back east for Boston. Robert Curtis says: Super-great thread that involves Radam and Mortcola, and yet still, no one copped to my question: How come neither of the Klits fought Gary Coleman when they had the chance? "What you talkin' 'bout, Vitali?" Radam G says: Hey, Bobby C! Da suckas knew what time it was. The same as they knew when they ducked Jimmy "Lights out" Toney. JT woulda put it on 'em. But they followed the advice of GBG Manny Steward: "Stay away from TONEY!" "Whachu talkin' 'bout Arnard [misspelled]!" Holla! FighterforJC says: Hey, Bobby C! Da suckas knew what time it was. The same as they knew when they ducked Jimmy "Lights out" Toney. JT woulda put it on 'em. But they followed the advice of GBG Manny Steward: "Stay away from TONEY!" "Whachu talkin' 'bout Arnard [misspelled]!" Holla! I know you're not talking about the same Toney that got soundly outboxed by Sam Peter, because that Toney is in for a life-ending beating at the hands of either Klitschko. Condor says: Agreed. James Toney would be driven away from the arena in a hearse if he fought either K. Radam G says: Yup! I'm "not talking about the same Toney that got soundly outboxed [twice] by the Sam Peter that got KO'd by both (Docs/bros) Klitschkos. I'm talking about the prime, good-fighting, in-shape Toney, who beat the Russian at the trumped-up, made-up weight of cruiserweight, and the Toney who beat E Holy. This is the same Toney that GBG Manny Steward is speaking of. FighterforJC says: Keep dreaming. The Klitschko brothers are the SUPREMEST (is that a word?) heavyweights in the history of the sport and would've obliterated Ali and all of them. Radam G says: Hehehehehe! Wow! Reality deception is always amongst us. Holla! the Roast says: Are we really doing this again? Really?? Robert Curtis says:
Yep. Toney was gem 5 or so years ago? Or was it ten? He made Holyfield look awful. After that, Toney only made himself look awful.
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This past Monday former cruiserweight title holder Jean-Marc Mormeck 36-4 (22) said something on the order of, one hard blow will be enough to beat multiple heavyweight title belt holder Wladimir Klitschko 56-3 (49) this coming December 10th. Keep in mind this is coming from a fighter who wasn't a terrifically big punching cruiserweight, and is worse as a heavyweight. 
Lil bro doc WK will smash up another tomato-can heavy CHUMP! Enough said! Holla!