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  • Lomachenko and Garcia: Lightning and Thunder

    Click image for larger version  Name:	lomachenko-garcia.jpg Views:	1 Size:	128.1 KB ID:	8711

    BY TED SARES

    Irish legend and former featherweight king Barry McGuigan takes it as far as you can go: “Lomachenko is one of the greatest fighters we have seen or ever will see,” he wrote in his regular weekly column in the (London) Mirror.

    He adds, “There is a kind of machine-like quality that stands in marked contrast to the American tradition of great showmen. You look at Sugar Rays Robinson and Leonard, Muhammad Ali, Roy Jones and Floyd Mayweather – all different, yet connected by a flashy brilliance and sound technique. This glitzy element is completely absent in Lomachenko and Golovkin, who simply go after opponents with clinical savagery.”

    Vasyl Lomachenko 11-1 (8) compiled a 396-1 record as an amateur and won two Olympic gold medals. After just seven professional fights, he was a two-weight division titlist. With his thrilling win over Jorge Linares on May 12 at Madison Square Garden, he has now won a third title in a third different division!

    The Style

    Perhaps the 30-year-old really doesn't have a style we have seen before though Hector Camacho (pre-Edwin Rosario) resonates. Lomachenko’s uncanny ability to fight from changing angles and circle his opponent delivering volleys of punishing punches and then continue the assault without letup is amazing. His ability to pivot and get his opponent confused is remarkable and he seldom gets hit though he can get marked up when he does. As for power, Roman Martinez and Jorge Linares were victimized differently but still victimized.

    Also, the symbiosis between Loma and his father (a legendary coach in the Ukraine) is scary. At times, they seem to communicate by subtle facial expressions such as raised eyebrows. The results speak for themselves and, remember, we may be talking about the greatest amateur boxer who ever lived. Enjoy him while you can.

    TSS writer Frank Lotierzo nails it: "What makes him [Loma] special is he has a fighting style along with great athleticism and a high boxing IQ that allows him to match up with most styles. He also has the best footwork in boxing and can pivot on a dime while standing in front of his opponents and make them miss, forcing them to punch from their blind side, leaving them open to his counters and flurries. And unlike most flashy boxers with great speed, instead of making you have to look for him, he comes to you and presents a target that appears to be right there - and most fighters will let their hands go when the target is that inviting…”

    Garcia

    If Loma is lightning, Garcia is thunder.

    At 38-0, Mikey Garcia fights differently than Loma, but is just as effective. Garcia is a living, breathing boxing clinic and his fights should be shown in boxing gyms throughout the world as an example of how to blend fundamentals and execution. Whether it’s finding the right separation, timing, using his jab to set up combos, footwork, a solid defense, high ring IQ, and enough power to render opponents unconscious (e.g., Dejan Zlaticanin), he is as close to perfect as you can get. And like Loma, he breaks his opponents down with the same clinical savagery mentioned by Barry McGuigan. This humble 30-year-old Californian and WBC world Lightweight champion does just about everything right in the ring. Boxing is in his blood and it shows.

    What’s Next?

    Bob Arum says Lomachenko vs. Garcia would be a blockbuster on par with Mayweather-Pacquiao. But Arum has no interest in making the fight happen anytime soon.

    Garcia will reportedly risk his belt against IBF world lightweight champion Robert Easter Jr. (21-0) on July 28 at the Staples Center in Los Angeles on Showtime. Lomachenko will reportedly fight Raymundo Beltran (35-7-1), the current WBO world lightweight champion, on Aug. 25 at the Inglewood Forum on ESPN. But these matches aren’t cast in concrete who knows how they will play out (although the outcome of the Loma-Beltran fight looks pretty clear)? A Linares vs. Garcia fight should not be ruled out and even Manny Pacquiao might find his way into the mix if he survives Lucas Matthysse.

    One curious thing is now that the Ukrainian was exposed as being human by being knocked down by a visibly bigger Linares, many fickle fans are saying that Garcia will do the same and keep him down.

    Don’t bet on it.

    Ted Sares is one of the oldest active full power lifters in the world and is a four-time winner of the EPF’s Grand Master championship. A member of Ring 4’s Boxing Hall of Fame, he was recently cited by Hannibal Boxing as one of three “Must-Read” boxing writers.

    Check out more boxing news on video at The Boxing Channel

  • #2
    I like Loma (who doesn't -- he's exciting), but Id have to take Garcia over him if the two ever fight. The match would be a boxer's fantasy match-up. Nice breakdown, Ted, on an what will be an interesting fight.

    Comment


    • #3
      It would be a fascinating contrast! I can see a path for both guys to win.

      Comment


      • #4
        Mikey may be a bridge too far for Lomo. Garcia walks around at 175 and it doesn't seem like Lomo is bringing power up in weight.

        Anyway why doesn't Lomo or his father man up and tell Arum to make the fight happen? It would be Lomo`s biggest purse by far.

        Comment


        • #5
          Not sure Mikey walks around as a light heavyweight; 175.

          Probably as a light middleweight; ~154.



          Loma is a special talent but there’s not much he’s doing that has not been done before.

          Public “ready, aim, fire” objectors please think before responding to that last comment.



          James Toney (for one) walked around opponents and had a skill set that was, if not better, then as good as Loma’s.

          His training methods are all pretty standard for top level Eastern Bloc amateur fighters too.



          None of that means Loma is not brilliant.

          He moved up and beat Linares which, to some extent, validates his win over Rigondeaux.

          However, in moving up (and facing an average opponent) we saw some of the special effects drop off.



          As such, Mikey is probably too much for him though.

          And, that’s OK too.



          As there’s probably no-one in Loma’s natural weight division that beats him.

          He’s that good.



          It’s taken a while, but finally USA promoters are meaningfully seeing the value in Eastern Bloc fighters and that is why some of their skills seem new, unique, and otherworldly to some boxing fans.

          For those that have always been in touch with the Eastern Bloc amateur program, there is nothing new here in what Loma, Triple, Usyk, Beterbiev, and others from that part of the world do.

          Still, none of means they’re not great boxers and fighters.




          My God Teddy Atlas was a pain and woefully incorrect with much that he said in Beterbiev’s last fight; whereby Artur toyed with his opponent for 12 rounds - to get the work in - then stopped him in round 12.

          Beterbiev, is probably the most ruthlessly efficient of all the new breed of Eastern Bloc fighters out there.

          He is - in my opinion - one of the primary reasons Ward retired.




          Cheers,

          Storm.


           

          Comment


          • #6
            Good analysis of what would be a terrific fight. Very difficult to call, but I give the edge to Garcia.

            Comment


            • #7
              Can't say I've watched much of Garcia, which I should probably rectify.

              Lomachenko certainly is something special. There's a lot of people who weren't around to see Pernell Whitaker, Dmitry Pirog, or other fighters who were dazzling and/or unconventional. So I understand how the kids these days are all going OMG goat sorcery and matrix about him.

              I don't think many of us would consider Lomachenko untouchable. I was impressed, and happy for Linares, he managed to read Loma's shift to the outside. Timing him, pivoting anti-clockwise, leaning in and/or countering, was all nicely done, but not too surprising someone finally managed it. I will say Lomachenko will probably learn from the experience pretty fast.

              I was more surprised at the number Vasily did on Guillermo Rigondeaux. I read the theory Rigo was used to having his way with orthodox fighters, relying on the lead hand for dominance, range, et c. Even if he never faced a southpaw of Loma's calibre, I find it hard to believe he would under-prepare for his opponent's stance, let alone his movement patterns. One of the few holes I had seen in Rigo's game was the famous low duck and pivot, but it had worked well for him to that point.

              On a side note I hope the stereotype of the stiff, clinical stand-up fighter from Eastern Europe is starting to burst. Yes, it's convenient to use labels, but "Mexican style" is mostly a gimmick for Golovkin, just as Pirog was as Bloc as he was American in style. Just as the Cubans my coach told me to watch years ago, Rigo, Gamboa and Lara, are not exactly carbon copies of each other.

              The Russians and Ukrainians really know their "holistic" training and conditioning. Kostya was the first one I saw playing Bloc ball with a baseball cap. I dare say he would've shown John Lewis a few tricks.

              The agility work and puzzles Lomachenko gets from Kolosov and Flores no doubt push him as much as they round him out, much as the poor sods in Sandhurst Academy ard subjected to logic puzzles after a few days' trench digging.

              Storm mentioned Beterbiev. I don't know what Atlas was saying but he is big and damned good.

              Now I'll be off to watch some of Mikey's fights. And Beterbiev, and Pirog, and Tszyu... 😁

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by JohnnyTango View Post
                I like Loma (who doesn't -- he's exciting), but Id have to take Garcia over him if the two ever fight. The match would be a boxer's fantasy match-up. Nice breakdown, Ted, on an what will be an interesting fight.
                I'd take Loma but it's kind of a "pick 'em" thing. Clash of opposite styles if you can call what Loma does a style. Orlando Canizales and Camacho came close, especially Canizales.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Alan Swyer says via email , "This is a fight that should happen soon. However, like most fights that should take place, there will be stalling and interim bouts that will likely make it anticlimactic."

                  Larry Merchant adds,"well done. it's on everyone's mind right now."

                  Joe Bruno says,"Yes. I like LOMO over Garcia.."
                  Last edited by Kid Blast; 05-19-2018, 12:26 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by New York Tony View Post
                    Good analysis of what would be a terrific fight. Very difficult to call, but I give the edge to Garcia.
                    Thanks Tony. Appreciated.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by SuperLight View Post
                      Can't say I've watched much of Garcia, which I should probably rectify.

                      Lomachenko certainly is something special. There's a lot of people who weren't around to see Pernell Whitaker, Dmitry Pirog, or other fighters who were dazzling and/or unconventional. So I understand how the kids these days are all going OMG goat sorcery and matrix about him.

                      I don't think many of us would consider Lomachenko untouchable. I was impressed, and happy for Linares, he managed to read Loma's shift to the outside. Timing him, pivoting anti-clockwise, leaning in and/or countering, was all nicely done, but not too surprising someone finally managed it. I will say Lomachenko will probably learn from the experience pretty fast.

                      I was more surprised at the number Vasily did on Guillermo Rigondeaux. I read the theory Rigo was used to having his way with orthodox fighters, relying on the lead hand for dominance, range, et c. Even if he never faced a southpaw of Loma's calibre, I find it hard to believe he would under-prepare for his opponent's stance, let alone his movement patterns. One of the few holes I had seen in Rigo's game was the famous low duck and pivot, but it had worked well for him to that point.

                      On a side note I hope the stereotype of the stiff, clinical stand-up fighter from Eastern Europe is starting to burst. Yes, it's convenient to use labels, but "Mexican style" is mostly a gimmick for Golovkin, just as Pirog was as Bloc as he was American in style. Just as the Cubans my coach told me to watch years ago, Rigo, Gamboa and Lara, are not exactly carbon copies of each other.

                      The Russians and Ukrainians really know their "holistic" training and conditioning. Kostya was the first one I saw playing Bloc ball with a baseball cap. I dare say he would've shown John Lewis a few tricks.

                      The agility work and puzzles Lomachenko gets from Kolosov and Flores no doubt push him as much as they round him out, much as the poor sods in Sandhurst Academy ard subjected to logic puzzles after a few days' trench digging.

                      Storm mentioned Beterbiev. I don't know what Atlas was saying but he is big and damned good.

                      Now I'll be off to watch some of Mikey's fights. And Beterbiev, and Pirog, and Tszyu... 😁
                      Good stuff. I've been a fan of Eastern Euros and have written about them way back. I love their "clinical savagery."

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by StormCentre View Post
                        Not sure Mikey walks around as a light heavyweight; 175.

                        Probably as a light middleweight; ~154.



                        Loma is a special talent but there’s not much he’s doing that has not been done before.

                        Public “ready, aim, fire” objectors please think before responding to that last comment.



                        James Toney (for one) walked around opponents and had a skill set that was, if not better, then as good as Loma’s.

                        His training methods are all pretty standard for top level Eastern Bloc amateur fighters too.



                        None of that means Loma is not brilliant.

                        He moved up and beat Linares which, to some extent, validates his win over Rigondeaux.

                        However, in moving up (and facing an average opponent) we saw some of the special effects drop off.



                        As such, Mikey is probably too much for him though.

                        And, that’s OK too.



                        As there’s probably no-one in Loma’s natural weight division that beats him.

                        He’s that good.



                        It’s taken a while, but finally USA promoters are meaningfully seeing the value in Eastern Bloc fighters and that is why some of their skills seem new, unique, and otherworldly to some boxing fans.

                        For those that have always been in touch with the Eastern Bloc amateur program, there is nothing new here in what Loma, Triple, Usyk, Beterbiev, and others from that part of the world do.

                        Still, none of means they’re not great boxers and fighters.




                        My God Teddy Atlas was a pain and woefully incorrect with much that he said in Beterbiev’s last fight; whereby Artur toyed with his opponent for 12 rounds - to get the work in - then stopped him in round 12.

                        Beterbiev, is probably the most ruthlessly efficient of all the new breed of Eastern Bloc fighters out there.

                        He is - in my opinion - one of the primary reasons Ward retired.




                        Cheers,

                        Storm.


                        Not so sure I agree with you on Toney. He would fight off the ropes and use superb counters and not too many can do that off the ropes. The closest I have seen is Orlando Canizales.I'll try to post some links. Beterbiev has a very good corner including my great buddy Russ Anber who also is in Loma's corner.

                        The Klit's and Kostya opened the door and the rest came flooding in. But before them, there were good Russian fighters fighting in Japan under a special agreement.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Here is a link to highlights of Orlando Canizales:
                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ogsB0zxKDI

                          You probably will have to copy and paste it, but you will see how close he and Loma are.


                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Kid Blast View Post


                            Not so sure I agree with you on Toney. He would fight off the ropes and use superb counters and not too many can do that off the ropes. The closest I have seen is Orlando Canizales.I'll try to post some links. Beterbiev has a very good corner including my great buddy Russ Anber who also is in Loma's corner.

                            The Klit's and Kostya opened the door and the rest came flooding in. But before them, there were good Russian fighters fighting in Japan under a special agreement.
                            Here is a link to highlights of Orlando Canizales:
                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ogsB0zxKDI

                            You probably will have to copy and paste it, but you will see how close he and Loma are.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Links of Toney walking around fighters below.





                              Unlike Loma and Pacquaio; Toney didn’t always need to rush in and/or use decoys to do it.

                              James could easily transition smoothly from in-fighting across to the side and vice-versa; without pronouncing it and using big telegraphing steps/movements.

                              He also mastered Floyd's slip/slide and shoulder roll style before Floyd.

                              Loma can't do any of the slip/slide and shoulder roll style in serious competition and that style has virtually served both Floyd and Toney their entire careers.


                              Sure it's not essential that Loma can perform these feats; but Toney destroyed Holyfield with them and we all know that no-one has managed to meaningfully undo Floyd's shoulder roll.

                              It is an advanced style that leads to other advanced styles.



                              Loma is very, very, good, but he is not doing anything that is breathtakingly new.

                              He just puts it all together very well.

                              Pacquaio was very similar when he first hit the scene; probably with faster hands/feet.

                              Pacquaio and Martinez too used to walk around fighters similar to Loma; it’s an old lefty trick and not new.


                              Floyd Mayweather was better skilled than Loma, particularly when he was "Pretty Boy" Floyd and the fact that some people are in awe of Loma (but choose not to be the same way about Floyd) sometimes reveals the inconsistency in approval and also how little some fans know about the sport.



                              Floyd also, was walking and/or slipping around to the side of opponents (in an orthodox stance) and then punishing them from there, years ago. Many of his Pretty Boy fights show him do it, and he also did it to Gatti in spectacular fashion.

                              Tszyu also had his own beautiful way of getting around to the side of southpaws, and it was probably the most ruthlessly efficient that I have seen.



                              There is nothing new in Loma's game, but he is exceptionally good at it, and he puts it all together well.

                              He is susceptible to a good jab though; but then many fighters are.

                              None of this (what I say) denigrates him; just a statement of observational facts.



                              Toney’s inside game was better than Loma’s.

                              Way better.

                              Toney’s toughness and/or punch resistance is better than Loma’s.

                              Toney’s ability to fight exhausted is better than anyone’s.

                              Many other aspects of Toney’s game is comparable to, if not better than, Loma’s.



                              In fact, for my money, Toney is every bit as good as Loma; although their styles differ.
                              .


                              Roman Karmazin and Kostya Tszyu were really the first Eastern Bloc fighter that hit USA and marked the time when promoters started to take notice of Eastern Bloc fighters.

                              Karmazin beat up a few Golden Boy fighters, and we all know what Kostya Tszyu did.

                              From there the Klitscko brothers followed and (save for Lennox Lewis) filled a gap in the heavyweight secene.

                              After that, we got the guys that have brought the current situation.



                              Cheers,

                              Storm.

                              Comment

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