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Thread: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

  1. #11
    Senior Member SuperLight's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    I say Kovalev had him the first time. On their respective best days, I think Ward has Kovalev.

    I largely agree with Sugar's assessment of Golovkin and Jacobs. However, I'd not write off anyone for any kind of loss to Pirog. I maintain that guy was something special.

  2. #12
    Advanced Users brownsugar's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoulder Roll Defense View Post
    Well said BrownSugar, your in depth break downs were missed. However, I think that GGG is between a rock and a hard place. If he stays at 160, the public demand will be for him to fight Jacobs again, whom I feel should have been awarded a close decision against him. If he goes up to 168; a quality naturally bigger fighter with skills such as DeGale would make him look even more ordinary than Jacobs did! Based off of sheer competition and who is the best available fighter for GGG in his division, I would ideally like to see him rematch Jacobs immediately, followed by a unification bout with Saunders if he wins, and conclude his middleweight tenure by giving the young bull Charlo a shot.
    The british commentators had Golovkin needing a knockdown in the final round to win the fight. If the fight was held in The Barclays i believe Jacobs would have gotten the nod. I read there was rampant piracy on face book, twitter and youtube. I saw the fight on youtube again IMMEDIATELY afterwards...the fight stayed up for the entire weekend. I dont feel either fighter got the credit they deserved.... Instead Golovkin got criticized for supposedly losing a step or being exposed and Jacobs found a dose of once in a lifetime inspiration....lol... My only criticism of Jacobs is that i wished Jacobs would have jumped right back on Golovkin instead of thumping his chest....my motto is ...
    Celebrate after the fight. Not during the fight.
    Jacobs may not be able to remain at 160 for long and team Golovkin said a rematch could be 3 or 4 fights down the road. Anyway SRD i cant argue with your perception of the fight.... Regarding Ward.... I hope he is able to sharpen up his tool set. Kovalev was able to stifle a good measure of his offense

    Enjoy the fights
    Last edited by brownsugar; 04-17-2017 at 01:04 PM.

  3. #13
    Advanced Users brownsugar's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by Shoulder Roll Defense View Post
    Well said BrownSugar, your in depth break downs were missed. However, I think that GGG is between a rock and a hard place. If he stays at 160, the public demand will be for him to fight Jacobs again, whom I feel should have been awarded a close decision against him. If he goes up to 168; a quality naturally bigger fighter with skills such as DeGale would make him look even more ordinary than Jacobs did! Based off of sheer competition and who is the best available fighter for GGG in his division, I would ideally like to see him rematch Jacobs immediately, followed by a unification bout with Saunders if he wins, and conclude his middleweight tenure by giving the young bull Charlo a shot.
    Quote Originally Posted by SuperLight View Post
    I say Kovalev had him the first time. On their respective best days, I think Ward has Kovalev.

    I largely agree with Sugar's assessment of Golovkin and Jacobs. However, I'd not write off anyone for any kind of loss to Pirog. I maintain that guy was something special.
    Absolutely. Superlight

  4. #14
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    It was brownsugar who first shed some light on GGG being a monster, or at least the first guy of opinions that matter to give G that type of seal of approval.

    First time I met GGG was when I pulled into Abel Sanchez's Summit Boxing in Big Bear. G3 was doing exercises in the parking lot and greeted me as I was exiting my vehicle. "Hello, I'm Gen na dee". I said "Of course you are, you crazy fella! I mean, what percentage of people would be going to Abel's and not be aware that he trains this all-time great. (That last part I believe true, but it is also for all the new found doubters). What I really wanted to say was "I think you're pronouncing your name wrong when I realized maybe there's an outside chance it doesn't rhyme with Kennedy).

    Last time I was at Station's Casino they had GGG a 4/1 favorite over Canelo. But that was before G's last fight. Hopefully the line drops to where it's bettable.

    As for Ward vs K, the fact that Andre is willing to face him again, and immediately, tells me that adjustments are forthcoming and we should see a more prepared SOG and larger margin of victory. while I attended the last bout and had a dollar or two on AW, I wasn't so sure that at fight's end, I was going to be rewarded for our my believe system. I respect both guys a ton and if anybody deserved telephone number type compensation, it's these two guys.

  5. #15
    Advanced Users brownsugar's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by dino da vinci View Post
    It was brownsugar who first shed some light on GGG being a monster, or at least the first guy of opinions that matter to give G that type of seal of approval.

    First time I met GGG was when I pulled into Abel Sanchez's Summit Boxing in Big Bear. G3 was doing exercises in the parking lot and greeted me as I was exiting my vehicle. "Hello, I'm Gen na dee". I said "Of course you are, you crazy fella! I mean, what percentage of people would be going to Abel's and not be aware that he trains this all-time great. (That last part I believe true, but it is also for all the new found doubters). What I really wanted to say was "I think you're pronouncing your name wrong when I realized maybe there's an outside chance it doesn't rhyme with Kennedy).

    Last time I was at Station's Casino they had GGG a 4/1 favorite over Canelo. But that was before G's last fight. Hopefully the line drops to where it's bettable.

    As for Ward vs K, the fact that Andre is willing to face him again, and immediately, tells me that adjustments are forthcoming and we should see a more prepared SOG and larger margin of victory. while I attended the last bout and had a dollar or two on AW, I wasn't so sure that at fight's end, I was going to be rewarded for our my believe system. I respect both guys a ton and if anybody deserved telephone number type compensation, it's these two guys.
    Dino ....I would bet that you had a smile as wide as Ward did after the winner was announced....nonetheless, it was a savvy bet. The tellers at the payout windows probably know you on a first name basis.

    Its been recently reported that Kovalev is doing 3 weeks of fitness training at Big Bear and will finish up at Oxnard.

    That sounds like a man on a mission to me.

    Contrary to Virgil who has tried to plant seeds of deception between JD Jackson and Kovalev. Kovalev said at the rematch press conference that he does his own fitness training while Jackson is strictly a boxing coach.

    This time Kovalev plans to have professional trainers monitor his cardio so he doesnt overtrain.
    As you said in your earlier comments, regardless of their pay scale and pay per view sales, these guys are bringing a billion dollars worth of integrity, experience, training and talent into the ring on fight night.

    Perhaps Ward is due a good performance this time.... He looked like crap against the unpredictable, awkward, and survivally motivated Alexander Brand.

    Oddly, Ward looked like his P4P self against the capable Sullivan Barrera, and whether Ward had a bad day or more likely it's probable that Kovalev possesses the capability of being the anti-thesis to Ward's tactfully effervescent ring generalship.

    Whether its true or not, Virgil said that Ward didn't get to do his road work for the Kovalev fight. Although that sounds like a bit of an exaggerated statement there could be a little truth in it.

    Similarly it may be true that Kovalev may drink vodka when he's in an appropriate venue with friends and family ....and maybe he's not the boozing lush who drinks vodka in copious quantities whenever he's out of the public eye,

    And who also has permenantly impaired his motor skills. (According to the outrageous trash talk of Virgil).

    Although I didnt see any motor-skills deficiencies in the first fight.

    We know that generally speaking Ward can usually back up his talk but these are unusual circumstances.. But His vows to defeat his opponents have almost rang of biblical prophesy in past fights. That's how confident Ward's mindset is.

    Personally I will be biting my nails all the way up to the fight.

    While Ward and Kovalev continue to ramp up the tension as they play their subtle and not so subtle mind games.

    We will see who really wants it the most.

    Enjoy the fights.
    Last edited by brownsugar; 04-19-2017 at 02:28 AM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member stormcentre's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by brownsugar View Post

    O Ye of too much faith....

    What does Kovalev do!

    O he can't change... They say. Kovalev is locked in a time loop .... Of course everyone knows that punchers are always trapped in a Einsteinian paradox and are doomed to repeat their mistakes for infinity.
    Hey . . .

    Who (would have) said that (about Kovalev)?



    Cheers,

    Storm.







  7. #17
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by brownsugar View Post
    ShoulderRoll My days are filled with temporal anomalies that eat my time like anti-matter pop corn. But I cant resist your qurstion about GGG vs Jacobs.

    I remember writing Jacobs off after watching him sliding off Pirog's forearm and onto the canvas like a hot slice of cheese sliding off a tilted ritz cracker.

    I thought Jacobs cancer recovery made a nice warm and fuzzy story as he received high visibility while dragging his cancer kids supporters from boxing show to boxing show.

    Jacobs was one of the good guys but I thought he was a train wreck waiting to happen..... Just as soon as he ran into another right hand.

    But i noticed something during his explosive KO of former olympian and top contender Giovanni Lorenzo.

    Jacobs ripped the consciousness away from Giovanni like a seasoned pickpocket. In only a few rounds.

    I started looking at Jacobs a lot more closely and posted here a year ago at least half a dozen times that Jacobs was poised and equipped to bring Golovkin his greatest challenge yet.

    Everybody kept bringing up Pirog and the flash knock down against The Latin Snake.

    But the sad thing is,... Spin doctoring promoters (like the forked tongue Oscar DeLa Hoya) took Golovkins' finest moment and attempted To turn it into a his worst day in the ring.

    Lets not forget that Golovkin accepted a fight against the most skilled middleweight in the division...
    Fans didnt know what Jacobs possessed but Team Golovkin did.

    And unlike the fearful contenders such as Canelo, Sanders, Lee, Eubanks and Karparov.... who gave Jacobs a wide berth while turning down opportunities to fight him as quietly as possible, Golovkin said "lets go".

    But the peanut gallery called GGG "old" "washed" and declining instead of giving Golovking the credit he is due for clinging onto a razor thin victory against one of the best.

    Jacobs is just that good. If Jacobs could have increases his output by 5%, the fight would have been his. He was so close.

    Golovkin is as good as he ever was.... There is not a better fighter at 160 on the planet....except potentially Jacobs ....if he can still make the weight safely in the near future.

    And now they got GGG waiting around like he's begging the coward Canelo for a fight... This coward who claims he could do better than Jacobs....but wont go near either fighter in the ring....but has the gall to hold a bumfight against a parttime fighter (Chavez)who doesnt have a prayer to make weight and be healthy at the same time....
    Makes me wanna holler..

    No sanity in the boxing business.
    Yet against Brook, GGG was taking some heavy shots and looked off until he broke the bloke's eye socket. He seemed to carry that "off business" into the ring against Jacobs. Maybe we have seen the best of GGG. I'm beginning to wonder for the first time and I have been following him for a looooong time. Ever since Ouma. No sanity in the boxing business for sure.

    Re Kovalev, his recent and shocking racist rants (as reported by BlackSports online) against Ward suggest he is carrying a lot of inner rage and anger. If so, that can only work in Ward's favor because if anyone can remain calm and focused, it's SOG. Though one must still be cautious of the old saw: "Never go one-on-one with a Russian. You will lose." I say Ward will capitalize on Kov's emotional shortcomings and pick Krussher apart.
    Last edited by Kid Blast; 04-19-2017 at 12:19 PM.

  8. #18
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Sugar, as best I can remember, I had been talking to Storm before the line was announced. For wagering purposes, we each made a line that was within a few cents of each other. Then the line opened lower that what we had made it. K money showed up and drove the line even lower. I was fortunate enough to get it when it bottomed. By fight night, the line was AW -200, creating a heckofa scalping opportunity. But since I loved Ward in this matchup, I decided to stay with my original wager and didn't take back any on the other side. (SK)

    By fight's end, I wasn't so sure that I had the right side. Nobody enjoys losing money, and I'm no different. I love being right, but I don't know if I was right in this particular fight. Smiling? No. I was relieved, but not joyous. My belief is that when an individual wins and doesn't get their hand raised, it's a sin against God, or at least a sin against humanity.

    This time around, Ward will win rounds by a wider margin, taking a bit of the spotlight off of the first go-around, much like Mayweather-Castillo II.


    Storm, do you recall what we opened the fight at?

  9. #19
    Senior Member stormcentre's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by dino da vinci View Post
    Sugar, as best I can remember, I had been talking to Storm before the line was announced. For wagering purposes, we each made a line that was within a few cents of each other. Then the line opened lower that what we had made it. K money showed up and drove the line even lower. I was fortunate enough to get it when it bottomed. By fight night, the line was AW -200, creating a heckofa scalping opportunity. But since I loved Ward in this matchup, I decided to stay with my original wager and didn't take back any on the other side. (SK)

    By fight's end, I wasn't so sure that I had the right side. Nobody enjoys losing money, and I'm no different. I love being right, but I don't know if I was right in this particular fight. Smiling? No. I was relieved, but not joyous. My belief is that when an individual wins and doesn't get their hand raised, it's a sin against God, or at least a sin against humanity.

    This time around, Ward will win rounds by a wider margin, taking a bit of the spotlight off of the first go-around, much like Mayweather-Castillo II.


    Storm, do you recall what we opened the fight at?

    If I recall correctly Dino . . .

    At the time of the Ward V1 Kovalev fight; (I think) Ward was occupying somewhere around, a . . .

    65% chance of him winning.



    Which . . .

    In your (old fashioned ) moneyline nomenclature; roughly equates to somewhere, around; - 189.



    Not quite sure what percentage the juice was though.

    And/or whether we need to adjust a few points for that.



    Anyway, none of it (in truly accurate and/or detailed form) prolly matters, now.




    Particularly based upon the expectations that I personally had of him before the Ward V1 Kovalev, and also based on the money I laid down on him to win; I don’t think it’s unfair to say that Ward underperformed a little in Ward V1 Kovalev.

    In some ways he was quite lucky to get the decision.

    Even though (after reversing my initial thoughts on the matter; that, at first, actually had Kovalev winning) I believe Andre actually did win.

    By the tiniest (and most debatable) of margins.



    Anyway . . . .

    Perhaps it is that, when he was in against Kovalev, Ward’s performance deficit (when compared to our perfectly rationale and reasonable expectations) is best explained by the fact that Ward (even now) still has not really been completely active over these last few years.

    Whereas Kovalev, by comparison, has been.



    No doubt though . . .

    Both, after and also with the Ward V1 Kovalev fight being pretty touch and go . .

    And, also with it involving Andre being decked and hitting the canvass . . . .



    Right now . . .

    I am pretty sure that Sergey has most likely both, woken and motivated Ward up (more than) a bit.



    Anyway, lets see what happens this time around; with the upcoming Ward V2 Kovalev fight.


    And in relation to that; one thing’s pretty sure . . .

    Sergey won’t be bringing too many new tricks to the table.


    Kovalev will work behind the heavy jab.

    Sometimes, he will lumbar forward and look to land the right hand and some of his other heavy/deceptive shots.

    The hooks . .

    Well, they will probably also loop and reign in, too.

    Especially once Krusher feels that the midrange distance has been reasonably tamed and/or mastered.


    And, you know what?


    Provided it all works and is not too predictable . . .

    There’s probably not too much wrong with that approach.


    Just ask Julio Cesar Chavez Sr.



    Cheers,

    Storm.







    Folks . . .

    Very deep house and brilliant choon; right (below) here . . .



  10. #20
    Senior Member deepwater2's Avatar
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    Re: Ward-Kovalev II Official for June 17

    Quote Originally Posted by stormcentre View Post
    If I recall correctly Dino . . .

    At the time of the Ward V1 Kovalev fight; (I think) Ward was occupying somewhere around, a . . .

    65% chance of him winning.



    Which . . .

    In your (old fashioned ) moneyline nomenclature; roughly equates to somewhere, around; - 189.



    Not quite sure what percentage the juice was though.

    And/or whether we need to adjust a few points for that.



    Anyway, none of it (in truly accurate and/or detailed form) prolly matters, now.




    Particularly based upon the expectations that I personally had of him before the Ward V1 Kovalev, and also based on the money I laid down on him to win; I don’t think it’s unfair to say that Ward underperformed a little in Ward V1 Kovalev.

    In some ways he was quite lucky to get the decision.

    Even though (after reversing my initial thoughts on the matter; that, at first, actually had Kovalev winning) I believe Andre actually did win.

    By the tiniest (and most debatable) of margins.



    Anyway . . . .

    Perhaps it is that, when he was in against Kovalev, Ward’s performance deficit (when compared to our perfectly rationale and reasonable expectations) is best explained by the fact that Ward (even now) still has not really been completely active over these last few years.

    Whereas Kovalev, by comparison, has been.



    No doubt though . . .

    Both, after and also with the Ward V1 Kovalev fight being pretty touch and go . .

    And, also with it involving Andre being decked and hitting the canvass . . . .



    Right now . . .

    I am pretty sure that Sergey has most likely both, woken and motivated Ward up (more than) a bit.



    Anyway, lets see what happens this time around; with the upcoming Ward V2 Kovalev fight.


    And in relation to that; one thing’s pretty sure . . .

    Sergey won’t be bringing too many new tricks to the table.


    Kovalev will work behind the heavy jab.

    Sometimes, he will lumbar forward and look to land the right hand and some of his other heavy/deceptive shots.

    The hooks . .

    Well, they will probably also loop and reign in, too.

    Especially once Krusher feels that the midrange distance has been reasonably tamed and/or mastered.


    And, you know what?


    Provided it all works and is not too predictable . . .

    There’s probably not too much wrong with that approach.


    Just ask Julio Cesar Chavez Sr.



    Cheers,

    Storm.







    Folks . . .

    Very deep house and brilliant choon; right (below) here . . .


    Come on now, Krusher won the first fight by a few points.

    The ref let Ward get away with wrestling and low blows but fair play to him, because refs let that stuff go sometimes.

    I don't see Kovalev adjusting much for the rematch.

    Kovalev also looks like a bloated 215lbs. at the press conference.

    Kovalev has the punchers chance for sure but if the ref lets Ward do the same tactics as last time, he should win another controversial decision.



    I haven't seen any betting lines yet but I reckon ward should be -200 maybe going up to -300 by fight time.

    https://youtu.be/Ybktxdj_4L8. Back in my day at the Limelight-NYC this was the jam.

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