Pacquiao Retirement Lasts Less Than 6 Months

Pacquiao Retirement Lasts Less Than 6 Months – Well, it is official, Manny Pacquiao is returning on November 5th. Yesterday, the news broke that Pacquiao had settled on WBO world welterweight champion Jessie Vargas as his opponent. While there’s been talk that the fight may go to Dubai,  the most likely venue is the Thomas and Mack Center on the campus of the University of Nevada, Las Vegas.

Pacquiao last fought on April 9th, when he won a unanimous decision over Timothy Bradley at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas. Though his promoter Bob Arum and his trainer Freddie Roach were both skeptical about Pac-man leaving the sport for good, Pacquiao did retire in the aftermath of that fight. His name was dutifully removed from the “active” boxing rankings and with his newly won Senate seat in the Philippines, Pac-man obviously had other things to keep him busy. But he never really shut the door on a return.

Last week, a short list emerged of potential opponents that Arum was offering. The  list included Terence Crawford, Danny Garcia and apparently Jessie Vargas. All three hold versions of a world title at either 140 or 147 pounds, and with Vargas finally being the opponent the Pac-man team settled on, the fight will be at 147 pounds. Crawford, recently a pay-per-view headliner for the company, appeared to be Arum’s first choice, but Pacquiao’s trainer Freddie Roach reportedly nixed the idea.

When November 5th rolls around, Pacquiao will be about a month shy of his 38th birthday. Now that he is back, the chances are good that he will fight at least once in 2017 as well.

A win over Vargas for Pacquiao will start the talk of a return match with Floyd Mayweather Jr. Mayweather has been constantly sending out feelers for a return, and he has made his asking price of $100 million clear and public. There isn’t a potential opponent out there who could earn Floyd that kind of money — unless he moved up in weight to challenge Gennady Golovkin — so it figures that he will fall back and look at Pacquiao, the dance partner he cleared the most money with in the past.

As for Jessie Vargas, we last saw him in March of this year on HBO when he defeated then undefeated Sadam Ali at the DC Armory in support of the Luis Ortiz versus Tony Thompson heavyweight main event. Vargas was ahead on all three judges cards when he stopped Ali in the ninth round to grab the vacant WBO title.

Vargas is 27-1 overall and he will walk into the fight with considerable height and reach advantages. At 27 years old he is ten years younger than Pacquiao and this fight represents the biggest payday of his career. A win for Vargas could potentially send Pac-man back to retirement and derail a potential Mayweather rematch. That fact alone should attract some fans to Vargas.

Check out more boxing news and videos at The Boxing Channel.

Though Vargas was not one of the choices of opponents in The Sweet Science’s poll on a potential next opponent for Pacquaio, it is important to know that 36% of the voters wanted to see Pacquiao “stay retired.” Crawford, the second choice, received about 30% of the votes.

COMMENTS

-Radam G :

Once again, height and reach ain't double-fudge-and-cherry-on-top syet in boksing to da real real. I can name umpteen pugs who were shorter than 99.9 percent of their opponents and whupped 99 percent of them. The late, great Rocky Marciano whupped a 100 percent of them. The late, great Willie Pep whupped 99 percent of them. The late, great Poppa Smoke, aka Smokin' Joe Frazier, whupped 97.4556 percent of them. The late, great "Homicide" Hank Armstrong put down 96 percent. Every single pug that was taller than Sugar Ray Leonard in the pros, he beat them. All his losses were against pugs two to four inches shorter than him. Height and reach are just talking psych points. For all the height and reach that so many pugs had -- I won't name them -- they didn't/don't do syet in da game. An old-arse Da Manny is gonna jab and stab a young Jesse Vargas as a young PacMan did an old Big Money Oscar de la Hoyas. Da Money will beat J V-gas easily. Holla!


-SuperLight :

It will be almost 2 years to the day since Vargas fought on Pac's undercard in Macau. I remember it well because there were no KOs the entire card - Lomachenko fought practically one-handed for much of his bout, Algieri was on his arse 6(?) times, and Vargas fought a guy called DeMarco, largely in the pocket and trading blows until the end. I for one am not fussed whether Manny stays retired, but see no point in a rematch with Floyd.


-Radam G :

It will be almost 2 years to the day since Vargas fought on Pac's undercard in Macau. I remember it well because there were no KOs the entire card - Lomachenko fought practically one-handed for much of his bout, Algieri was on his arse 6(?) times, and Vargas fought a guy called DeMarco, largely in the pocket and trading blows until the end. I for one am not fussed whether Manny stays retired, but see no point in a rematch with Floyd.
Hehehehe! The first point is another big purse. The second point is there will be two healthy pugs. Holla!


-Radam G :

I hope this scrap change to taking place in Dubai. J-V-gas is from Sin City. And the crookie-arse officials there will cheat without an ounce of pity. Da suckas are so shytty. They raised the roids/PEDS ratio to protect Money May. And in the MayPac Farce, they gave Lil Floyd a belated pass from taking a TUE IV of 700 ounces of saltwater fluid to hide Money May's cocktail of roids and PEDs. And then the c suckas restricted Da Manny from taking an approved painkiller shot and a drink of a can of REBOUND -- vitamin water -- taken in every sport by the top of the top of the cream of the crop. Holla!


-miguel1 :

I agree with you, I hope it is better than the Margarito beating at least....


-The Good Doctor :

I almost view this fight as a tuneup for Manny. Granted Vargas sports a nice record and a couple of names on his resume, he is not ready for a stage this large. I think Manny abuses this guy for twelve and then signs for a bigger money bout against one of the myriad of options out there. He could fight Crawford, Garcia, Khan, Canelo, Brook, Porter, Thurman, or dare I even say Floyd. We may end up seeing Manny for another 3 years possibly longer.


-miguel1 :

I almost view this fight as a tuneup for Manny. Granted Vargas sports a nice record and a couple of names on his resume, he is not ready for a stage this large. I think Manny abuses this guy for twelve and then signs for a bigger money bout against one of the myriad of options out there. He could fight Crawford, Garcia, Khan, Canelo, Brook, Porter, Thurman, or dare I even say Floyd. We may end up seeing Manny for another 3 years possibly longer.
Three more years!?! Please no!


-stormcentre :

I hope this scrap change to taking place in Dubai. J-V-gas is from Sin City. And the crookie-arse officials there will cheat without an ounce of pity. Da suckas are so shytty. They raised the roids/PEDS ratio to protect Money May. And in the MayPac Farce, they gave Lil Floyd a belated pass from taking a TUE IV of 700 ounces of saltwater fluid to hide Money May's cocktail of roids and PEDs. And then the c suckas restricted Da Manny from taking an approved painkiller shot and a drink of a can of REBOUND -- vitamin water -- taken in every sport by the top of the top of the cream of the crop. Holla!
Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! So far, it looks like Floyd has stayed retired (as he claimed and to the contrary of many Queening claims). However, looking at Pac, it seems he has not stayed retired. That IV drip of Floyd's sure is suspicious. But (as uncomfortable as it may be and as proven by how unpopular and selectively interpreted the subject is)
the provision for the IV drip was explicitly agreed upon by Pac; as per Pac's signature on the contracts. Remember folks, Pac signed the contract. What this means is that (whether is makes sense or not to those that don't appreciate and/or choose to ignore all the legalities of the matter) the IV drip - regardless of any isolated breach of individual WADA or other rules that would
otherwise apply - was not illegal. Not in the context of the MayPac fight and agreement. As both Pac and Floyd explicitly agreed so, and signed on the dotted line. In fact, (according to Hauser) Pac objected to far less concerning provisions in the MayPac contract when they negotiated the fight. But it seems Hauser, Queens, and others curiously failed to meaningfully raise "these" matters. Anyway, whilst the IV drip of Floyd's is not illegal in the context of the MayPac fight (due to Pac's signature) . . . it sure is still suspicious . . . . . There are, perhaps, a few other considerations for recidivistic and rebelling Queens to (should they attempt to transition into unbias boxing commentators) consider too . . . . You see - and this is the real kicker - the IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and also in boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing. Here's a little Queening test to prove a point . . . .

Can anyone point to and/or show me a fighter that has been as successful through all the weights as Pac, and as they did it - they did it by;


A) Not only, fighting with the indefatigable intensity for every 3 minutes that Pac has displayed.
B) But also, by stopping almost everyone; whether they're bigger than him or not?

That has not been in some way been suspected of and/or associated with PEDs?

If we're keeping it Snoop Doggy Dog Dog real, it's important to remember . . . . .

Most of the guys that have displayed - even some of - Pac's incredible traits and achievements have usually been associated with PEDs. Roy Jones (whom was probably the last guy to have supremely uncanny speed and, at the same time, also be as tireless in the ring as Pac was) was in this respect similar to Pac. And, it all ceased for him when Balco went down. Mosley, once, also possessed supremely uncanny speed and a seemingly tireless approach to activity in the ring. However, it too all ceased when Balco went down.

Amongst many; EPO was the main catalyst and/or most powerful ingredient that Balco sold.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163068-PEDs-Here-To-Stay-Or-Not&p=101132&viewfull=1#post101132

To understand how powerful it is please consider (performance-wise) the remarkable similarity of what happened to Jones and Mosley (particularly in terms of speed and stamina) immediately after the Balco game was up . . . . To that of Pac's MayPac performance when in with Floyd; immediately after Pac underwent his first meaningfully stringent PED testing program. :) Look, above I stated . . .

""Can anyone point to and/or show me a fighter that has been as successful through all the weights as Pac has? And as they did it - they did it by *stopping almost everyone and also fighting with an almost unseen intensity for the entire fight?""

And, just to show and prove a point how the IV drip that Floyd was associated with is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and also in boxing circles, and also is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing . . . . . . Forget (the *part about) moving through all the weight divisions and *knocking everyone out . . . .
How about if anyone here can point to and/or show me a fighter that (has not been in some way been suspected of and/or associated with PEDs, that) just fights with the intensity for every 3 minutes that Pac has done and/or does? Anyone?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- And, for now (to be fair) let's forget how I could easily, also, rewrite the above request like this . . . .

Can anyone point to and/or show me a fighter that has been as successful through all the weights as Pac, and as he did it - he did it by;


A) Not only, fighting with the indefatigable intensity for every 3 minutes that Pac has.
B) But also, stopping almost everyone; whether they're bigger than him or not?

That also;


A) Not only, has been in some way suspected of and/or associated with PEDs; as Pac has - Roach firing Ariza.
B) But also, provided such concerning excuses ("I'm {as I wear tattoos} afraid of giving blood") for not taking PED tests - as soon as he was offered to fight the guy (Floyd) that he was supposedly chasing all his career. Excuses that - later in his career - were found to be as questionable as his performance immediately after he eventually took the PED tests and fought Floyd



---------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, with all these considerations (and after acknowledging Floyd's IV drip is suspicious but occurred also due to the fact that Pac himself explicitly agreed to it - all as Pac withheld his own claimed {but never proven} injection requiring injury from the public) we strip back the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance associated with acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing. Such that when the insulation is cut back and we are left with only the bare conductor of the issue, we see some stuff that has been routinely sidestepped over. Stuff like . . . .


- If Manny really had the Toradol injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight, as he claimed - then why did he only announce it just hours before the MayPac fight, and in doing so defraud the NSAC in paperwork/writing in relation to it?

Why not just announce beforehand that you have an injury? Could the answer be that if that happened - amongst all the pre-MayPac fight hysteria and scrutiny - Pac would then possibly be required to
substantiate the injuries existence?


- Furthermore - if Manny really had a legitimate and injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight - then why didn't PacRoach (in relation to that supposed injection requiring injury) simply apply for a TUE beforehand (as Floyd did); and then, later, openly announce any injection/IV related procedure pertaining to it, when/after that procedure was actually performed.

As Floyd did with the IV when he called the testing officials in?



All these considerations seem to add up to someone not wanting to
substantiate an injury that they claim they had. Which was also claimed to be the very same injury that also served as Pac's reason for both, a Toradol injection and also his PacLossExcuse. To be (even more) fair, let's also forget how it was;


A) Not only, the absence of these (Toradol injection requiring injury) admissions beforehand that means PacRoach's conduct was suspicious.
B) But also, the fact that prior to the fight (at a time when PacJuice was said {but, only after he lost the fight} to have the Toradol injection requiring injury) PacRoach released misleading information to the world about Pac's suitability, not just to fight - but to also win by KO.

From this it's almost completely unmistakable that PacRoach both willfully released misleading information to the world about Pac's suitability to fight Floyd. Either that, or the Toradol injection requiring injury and it's true extent was fabricated.



Of course there is also the fact that Pac never explicitly appeared to have a shoulder injury during the whole MayPac fight either. In fact one of the most noticeably (negative) attributes to Pac's MayPac performance was that he visibly displayed signs of greatly reduced stamina and activity (see above comments about Jones, Mosley, Balco, and EPO) - after what was a period of stringent PED testing that caused so much concern in previous years for Pac that he had opted to let the chance for a MayPac fight (when it mattered more and when both guys where younger and less shop worn) to go completely by the wayside . . . . due to his claimed fear of needles and blood.

Borrowing Brother Voodoo's crystal ball and gazing into the past, I see . . . . .

Pacquiao watching hundreds of millions of dollars getting doused in kerosene and flames, and saying . . .

""Bye-bye hundreds of millions of dollars . . . no drug testing for me.









Not whilst I am completely jacked on juice and riding high"".





Happy to see video of any MayPac round where it is obvious that the PacJuiceInjury was in full swing and limiting Pac's performance. Conversely, please also remember that there also exists video of Pac vigorously using his (Toradol injection requiring and injured) shoulder in preparation for the MayPac fight. And, just incase the above considerations are not enough to prove a point and show how the IV drip that Floyd was associated with is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and also in boxing circles, and is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing . . . . . . Then there is also the curious manner in which Pac rehabilitated his Toradol injection requiring (and undisclosed) injury. Many news releases seem to state it was a "rehabilitation" like no other. One that was without complete adherence to the prescribed and/or typical procedures. Instead, it seems, Pac preferred to address that matter (of "rehabilitating" the PacLossExcuse and Toradol injection requiring {and undisclosed} injury) with nothing other than both, Jesus and salt water. Amen Brothers. And if that is not enough; perhaps we could also ponder what other PEDs (the requested injection) Toradol would possibly mask and/or provide an excuse for? So, all up . . . . . As I said at the commencement of this post . . . Incredibly imaginative piece of writing from Brother Voodoo. He even incorporated his own selective interpretation and Queening delusions into it !!!! Now don't get me wrong here. Like anyone, when the Donkey roars I know what time it is. And, like most, I also love a magician. And I love a laugh. So, with all that said I suggest a toast. And as such . . . I raise my glass (of glacial magical milk infused with cinnamon powder and watermelon seeds) and say to yawl . . . .

""Here's to self serving and selective interpretations combined with a never ending ability to fabricate and fantasize about reality . . . may the humor it brings always find you in good health and never cease"".


Storm. :) :) :)


-deepwater2 :

Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent. Just imagine if PAC had higher then normal testosterone levels. Just imagine if PAC had a gym where the majority of the fighters get caught for doping. Just imagine because it never happened. Those things happened in reality but let's not point out who the culprit was.


-Radam G :

Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent. Just imagine if PAC had higher then normal testosterone levels. Just imagine if PAC had a gym where the majority of the fighters get caught for doping. Just imagine because it never happened. Those things happened in reality but let's not point out who the culprit was.
Hehehehe! It is funny as heck that ____ ______ act like Money May was an all-time clean arse with his self-proclaimed TBE. TMT is composed of a bunch of syetheaded cheats. And the long-time evidence has clearly confirms that. Shame on all the _______ ______________ --________- ______ and ________. Holla!


-oubobcat :

I almost view this fight as a tuneup for Manny. Granted Vargas sports a nice record and a couple of names on his resume, he is not ready for a stage this large. I think Manny abuses this guy for twelve and then signs for a bigger money bout against one of the myriad of options out there. He could fight Crawford, Garcia, Khan, Canelo, Brook, Porter, Thurman, or dare I even say Floyd. We may end up seeing Manny for another 3 years possibly longer.
Though not 100% official, it does appears Vargas is the foe. And I agree, basically a good tune up fight. Arum will then turn to 2017 to either make the Crawford fight or the Mayweather rematch.


-stormcentre :

Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent. Just imagine if PAC had higher then normal testosterone levels. Just imagine if PAC had a gym where the majority of the fighters get caught for doping. Just imagine because it never happened. Those things happened in reality but let's not point out who the culprit was.
Yep, (within reason) you're right with some of that. Fact is, despite how your post incorrectly assumes the profile that Roaches gym is clean; there are only a few people from Roaches gym that have been caught doping. Probably less than Floyd's. Still, no strength and conditioning coach from Floyd's gym has been outed due to his inability to explain (to the head coach) what was in drinks he was providing to the main fighter; whom - at the time - had fiercely resisted PED testing to such an extent it explains your (cleverly explained) points about why Pac's testosterone levels have never been seen for as high as they may be. More on Pac's testosterone levels later. Now to your first (false narrative) point . . .

""Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent""

Is there any chance you can please explain how was Floyd ""caught"" doing this when;


A) The provision for the IV drip was explicitly negotiated and agreed upon by Pac; whereby Pac rejected seemingly lesser contractual provisions?
B) Floyd's team called in the officials in relation to it?

How could Floyd be ""caught"" doing this when his team called the officials in? Anyway, with all that said basically you're post proves my point in post #9. That being . . . .

""The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as
the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing"".

And it does so because, even aside from the fact that I have explicitly stated on many occasions that the IV drip is suspicious and that Floyd probably does dope; we need look no further than
yours and other Queens continual refusals to engage directly on the points I raised about Pac for substantiation of this fact. Rather than engage directly on the points I raised about Pac . . . It appears PacQueens instead prefer to go back to the same circular/misleading and/or false narratives that misdirect away from the issues raised about Pac. Almost as if they are afraid to discuss them head on and publicly, due to the fact that Pac lost against Floyd and proved them all wrong and in doing so created a very smelly PED trail of his own. Please remember . . . . Whilst Pac has both, sued Floyd for defamation in relation to PEDs and also exhibited a boxing style combined with a set of achievements that is simply other-worldly but at the same time almost completely absent when he is tested; Pac has also - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Why do you think that is? And, why was such consent to any form of retrograde testing not accompanying his writ for defamation? Typically, in court, when one party wishes to debunk another's claims in relation to their alleged consumption of illicit or other banned/illegal substances, in order to strengthen their case and assure the courts they are reliable, they provide evidence that they are clean. That evidence usually originates from a court approved and independent laboratory. So given all that, may I ask you, are there any points within my post #9
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393 That you do have the stones to meaningfully address head on without pointing the finger in the other direction and getting donkey all excited that he may be able to use it as a device to impale himself on? To answer that question . . . I don't mind if you consult with donkey about it. But remember, if you do, his track record on this subject (122 clinches; unproven: Floyd chopping bad wood; joke. Floyd swimming scared; unproven. Manny going backwards when Hatton was KO'd; wrong: Manny will KO Floyd; wrong: I'm a PacEntourage; pathological . . . and the list goes on and on) is almost as woefully unreliable as Pac himself being able to throw for 3 minutes of every round immediately after testing. So, how about it Deep? You up for answering some direct questions about Pac? 1st cab off the rank could be why did Pac not object to the contractual provision for an IV drip and/or TUE; when the terms of the agreement were (according to Hauser) openly negotiated and Pac chose to object to other/lesser terms within the same agreement? Could it be that he himself (all as PacRoach both conspired to defraud the public and the NSAC in relation to the injection requiring injury) expected to use such a provisional means after a shot of Toradol was snuck in on the 11th hour? 2nd cab off the rank could be any of the other points I raised in post #9; that you skipped over. Or it could be the question; why has the PacJuiceKing - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Remember, he was the one that took the matter to court as a means of stating he is clean. Over to you.
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent. Just imagine if PAC had higher then normal testosterone levels. Just imagine if PAC had a gym where the majority of the fighters get caught for doping. Just imagine because it never happened. Those things happened in reality but let's not point out who the culprit was.
Yep, (within reason) you're right with some of that. Fact is, despite how your post incorrectly assumes the profile that Roaches gym is clean; there are only a few people from Roaches gym that have been caught doping. Probably less than Floyd's. Still, no strength and conditioning coach from Floyd's gym has been outed due to his inability to explain (to the head coach) what was in drinks he was providing to the main fighter; whom - at the time - had fiercely resisted PED testing to such an extent it explains your (cleverly explained) points about why Pac's testosterone levels have never been seen for as high as they may be. More on Pac's testosterone levels later. Now to your first (false narrative) point . . .

""Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent""

Is there any chance you can please explain how was Floyd ""caught"" doing this when;


A) The provision for the IV drip was explicitly negotiated and agreed upon by Pac; whereby Pac rejected seemingly lesser contractual provisions?
B) Floyd's team called in the officials in relation to it?

How could Floyd be ""caught"" doing this when his team called the officials in? Anyway, with all that said basically you're post proves my point in post #9. That being . . . .

""The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as
the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing"".

And it does so because, even aside from the fact that I have explicitly stated on many occasions that the IV drip is suspicious and that Floyd probably does dope; we need look no further than
yours and other Queens continual refusals to engage directly on the points I raised about Pac for substantiation of this fact. Rather than engage directly on the points I raised about Pac . . . It appears PacQueens instead prefer to go back to the same circular/misleading and/or false narratives that misdirect away from the issues raised about Pac. Almost as if they are afraid to discuss them head on and publicly, due to the fact that Pac lost against Floyd and proved them all wrong and in doing so created a very smelly PED trail of his own. Please remember . . . . Whilst Pac has both, sued Floyd for defamation in relation to PEDs and also exhibited a boxing style combined with a set of achievements that is simply other-worldly but at the same time almost completely absent when he is tested; Pac has also - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Why do you think that is? And, why was such consent to any form of retrograde testing not accompanying his writ for defamation? Typically, in court, when one party wishes to debunk another's claims in relation to their alleged consumption of illicit or other banned/illegal substances, in order to strengthen their case and assure the courts they are reliable, they provide evidence that they are clean. That evidence usually originates from a court approved and independent laboratory. So given all that, may I ask you, are there any points within my post #9
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393 That you do have the stones to meaningfully address head on without pointing the finger in the other direction and getting donkey all excited that he may be able to use it as a device to impale himself on? To answer that question . . . I don't mind if you consult with donkey about it. But remember, if you do, his track record on this subject (122 clinches; unproven: Floyd chopping bad wood; joke. Floyd swimming scared; unproven. Manny going backwards when Hatton was KO'd; wrong: Manny will KO Floyd; wrong: I'm a PacEntourage; pathological . . . and the list goes on and on) is almost as woefully unreliable as Pac himself being able to throw for 3 minutes of every round immediately after testing. So, how about it Deep? You up for answering some direct questions about Pac? 1st cab off the rank could be why did Pac not object to the contractual provision for an IV drip and/or TUE; when the terms of the agreement were (according to Hauser) openly negotiated and Pac chose to object to other/lesser terms within the same agreement? Could it be that he himself (all as PacRoach both conspired to defraud the public and the NSAC in relation to the injection requiring injury) expected to use such a provisional means after a shot of Toradol was snuck in on the 11th hour? 2nd cab off the rank could be any of the other points I raised in post #9; that you skipped over. Or it could be the question; why has the PacJuiceKing - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Remember, he was the one that took the matter to court as a means of stating he is clean. Over to you.
Storm. :) :)
PS: not sure if you have noticed this or not, but the Queening irony of it all is not lost on me. Pac's coming out of retirement and passing up on Crawford, whilst chasing down the easier Vargas; whom they know both, Bradley (whom Pac) beat and they can contractually manipulate. Especially now that the Vargas V Brook fight fell through. And, Floyd (whom already beat Pac) is staying - true to his word - retired; and chilling. All as Triple - a middleweight - is looking for easy fights in the welterweight division. And, what do PacQueens see/say?

""Floyd must be running from Triple"".

Love it !!!!! Nothing wrong with that logic.


-SuperLight :

Yep, (within reason) you're right with some of that. Fact is, despite how your post incorrectly assumes the profile that Roaches gym is clean; there are only a few people from Roaches gym that have been caught doping. Probably less than Floyd's. Still, no strength and conditioning coach from Floyd's gym has been outed due to his inability to explain (to the head coach) what was in drinks he was providing to the main fighter; whom - at the time - had fiercely resisted PED testing to such an extent it explains your (cleverly explained) points about why Pac's testosterone levels have never been seen for as high as they may be. More on Pac's testosterone levels later. Now to your first (false narrative) point . . .

""Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent""

Is there any chance you can please explain how was Floyd ""caught"" doing this when;


A) The provision for the IV drip was explicitly negotiated and agreed upon by Pac; whereby Pac rejected seemingly lesser contractual provisions?
B) Floyd's team called in the officials in relation to it?

How could Floyd be ""caught"" doing this when his team called the officials in? Anyway, with all that said basically you're post proves my point in post #9. That being . . . .

""The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as
the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing"".

And it does so because, even aside from the fact that I have explicitly stated on many occasions that the IV drip is suspicious and that Floyd probably does dope; we need look no further than
yours and other Queens continual refusals to engage directly on the points I raised about Pac for substantiation of this fact. Rather than engage directly on the points I raised about Pac . . . It appears PacQueens instead prefer to go back to the same circular/misleading and/or false narratives that misdirect away from the issues raised about Pac. Almost as if they are afraid to discuss them head on and publicly, due to the fact that Pac lost against Floyd and proved them all wrong and in doing so created a very smelly PED trail of his own. Please remember . . . . Whilst Pac has both, sued Floyd for defamation in relation to PEDs and also exhibited a boxing style combined with a set of achievements that is simply other-worldly but at the same time almost completely absent when he is tested; Pac has also - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Why do you think that is? And, why was such consent to any form of retrograde testing not accompanying his writ for defamation? Typically, in court, when one party wishes to debunk another's claims in relation to their alleged consumption of illicit or other banned/illegal substances, in order to strengthen their case and assure the courts they are reliable, they provide evidence that they are clean. That evidence usually originates from a court approved and independent laboratory. So given all that, may I ask you, are there any points within my post #9
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393 That you do have the stones to meaningfully address head on without pointing the finger in the other direction and getting donkey all excited that he may be able to use it as a device to impale himself on? To answer that question . . . I don't mind if you consult with donkey about it. But remember, if you do, his track record on this subject (122 clinches; unproven: Floyd chopping bad wood; joke. Floyd swimming scared; unproven. Manny going backwards when Hatton was KO'd; wrong: Manny will KO Floyd; wrong: I'm a PacEntourage; pathological . . . and the list goes on and on) is almost as woefully unreliable as Pac himself being able to throw for 3 minutes of every round immediately after testing. So, how about it Deep? You up for answering some direct questions about Pac? 1st cab off the rank could be why did Pac not object to the contractual provision for an IV drip and/or TUE; when the terms of the agreement were (according to Hauser) openly negotiated and Pac chose to object to other/lesser terms within the same agreement? Could it be that he himself (all as PacRoach both conspired to defraud the public and the NSAC in relation to the injection requiring injury) expected to use such a provisional means after a shot of Toradol was snuck in on the 11th hour? 2nd cab off the rank could be any of the other points I raised in post #9; that you skipped over. Or it could be the question; why has the PacJuiceKing - to date - abjectly failed to consent to any form of retrograde testing that would otherwise tell us just how clean he is. Remember, he was the one that took the matter to court as a means of stating he is clean. Over to you.
Storm. :) :)
PS: not sure if you have noticed this or not, but the Queening irony of it all is not lost on me. Pac's coming out of retirement and passing up on Crawford, whilst chasing down the easier Vargas; whom they know both, Bradley (whom Pac) beat and they can contractually manipulate. Especially now that the Vargas V Brook fight fell through. And, Floyd (whom already beat Pac) is staying - true to his word - retired; and chilling. All as Triple - a middleweight - is looking for easy fights in the welterweight division. And, what do PacQueens see/say?

""Floyd must be running from Triple"".

Love it !!!!! Nothing wrong with that logic.
Some would say there's nothing wrong with a (current/recent) welterweight taking on a middleweight. If we were back in the days of same-day weigh-ins, then perhaps it would be less of an undertaking, a point some seem to omit when calling for Gennady and Floyd to clash. Interesting, too, the potential match-ups around Manny's weight class. I like your objective take on the Mayweather/Pacquiao debacle. I don't know as much background/inside information as some of you guys, but I know what I saw in the bout, and that was Pac being outclassed and outpointed overall. As great as he is/was, last year's bout either exposed him and/or Freddie, or simply had him up against someone too good. And I'll reiterate that I was going for Pac to win it, not with money on, but to barrack for the underdog, the historically more aggressive fighter, and the guy more inspiring for many casual fans.


-stormcentre :

Some would say there's nothing wrong with a (current/recent) welterweight taking on a middleweight. If we were back in the days of same-day weigh-ins, then perhaps it would be less of an undertaking, a point some seem to omit when calling for Gennady and Floyd to clash. Interesting, too, the potential match-ups around Manny's weight class. I like your objective take on the Mayweather/Pacquiao debacle. I don't know as much background/inside information as some of you guys, but I know what I saw in the bout, and that was Pac being outclassed and outpointed overall. As great as he is/was, last year's bout either exposed him and/or Freddie, or simply had him up against someone too good. And I'll reiterate that I was going for Pac to win it, not with money on, but to barrack for the underdog, the historically more aggressive fighter, and the guy more inspiring for many casual fans.
Yep. Agree SL. Look . . . (particularly whilst not within close proximity to Floyd and his gym) only a fool would put their hand on their heart and say there is no way that Floyd has juiced. The temptation, fame, and dollars involved make it so hard to resist; as (whilst you remain undetected) you can almost secure your legacy with PEDs. That said, what intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are. Even aside from Pac's preference these days (since PEDs have been associated with him) to do the bulk of his preparation in his home country (where it is far easier to dope and remain undetected); anyone that knows this sport well and can use understandable/coherent language to explain themselves, would be blind and retarded to not notice all the suspicious indicators and obvious deception that surrounds him. Not in the least the indefatigable and *absolutely tireless intensity that Pac fought with whilst he achieved all his accolades, his fear of stringent PED testing, and how that *absolutely tireless intensity that Pac fought with all just disappeared in the MayPac fight; immediately after both;


1) Pac had experienced the kind of stringent testing he usually feared and desperately sought to avoid - even if it cost him tens of millions of dollars.
2) The supposed Toradol injection PacLossExcuse requiring injury (that also appeared to be previously fabricated and largely held undisclosed to the public for such purposes) was neatly introduced, wheeled out, and rejected by the NSAC.

And, even aside from all the incorrect pre/post-MayPac claims that this forum has already accommodated as a means to float Voodoo magic and PacLossExcuses; these considerations and the continual inability of PacQueens and others to meaningfully engage on the matter of Pac's suspicious activities . . . . Simply proves the points I have raised in post #9, which include . . . .




- The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below.
- Can anyone point to and/or show me a fighter that has been as successful through all the weights as Pac, and as they did it - they did it by;


A) Not only, fighting with the indefatigable intensity for every 3 minutes that Pac has displayed.
B) But also, by stopping almost everyone; whether they're bigger than him or not?

That has not been in some way been suspected of and/or associated with PEDs?
- If Manny really had the Toradol injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight, as he claimed - then why did he only announce it just hours before the MayPac fight, and in doing so defraud the NSAC in paperwork/writing in relation to it? Why not just announce beforehand that you have an injury? Could the answer be that if that happened - amongst all the pre-MayPac fight hysteria and scrutiny - Pac would then possibly be required to substantiate the injuries existence?
- If Manny really had a legitimate and injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight - then why didn't PacRoach (in relation to that supposed injection requiring injury) simply apply for a TUE beforehand (as Floyd did); and then, later, openly announce any injection/IV related procedure pertaining to it, when/after that procedure was actually performed? Just as Floyd did with the IV when he called the testing officials in?
- Can anyone produce video of any MayPac round where it is obvious that the PacJuiceInjury was in full swing and limiting Pac's performance? Conversely, please also remember that there also exists video of Pac vigorously using his (Toradol injection requiring and injured) shoulder in preparation for the MayPac fight.
- Then there is also the curious manner in which Pac rehabilitated his Toradol injection requiring (and undisclosed) injury. Many news releases seem to state it was a "rehabilitation" like no other. One that was without complete adherence to the prescribed and/or typical procedures. Instead, it seems, Pac preferred to address that matter (of "rehabilitating" the PacLossExcuse and Toradol injection requiring {and undisclosed} injury) with nothing other than both, Jesus and salt water. What can we make of this in the context of all the above unanswered questions that Queens are running from?
- Why did Pac explicitly agree to the contractual provision of TUEs and/or the IV drip, when - in fact - he rejected other proposed contractual inclusions that were seemingly far lesser?



Lets keep it Snoop Doggy Dog Dog real. Cheers,
Storm.


-Radam G :

Some would say there's nothing wrong with a (current/recent) welterweight taking on a middleweight. If we were back in the days of same-day weigh-ins, then perhaps it would be less of an undertaking, a point some seem to omit when calling for Gennady and Floyd to clash. Interesting, too, the potential match-ups around Manny's weight class. I like your objective take on the Mayweather/Pacquiao debacle. I don't know as much background/inside information as some of you guys, but I know what I saw in the bout, and that was Pac being outclassed and outpointed overall. As great as he is/was, last year's bout either exposed him and/or Freddie, or simply had him up against someone too good. And I'll reiterate that I was going for Pac to win it, not with money on, but to barrack for the underdog, the historically more aggressive fighter, and the guy more inspiring for many casual fans.
The man fought with one arm. And Lil (farce) Floyd could not do syet with him. Holla!


-Radam G :

Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent. Just imagine if PAC had higher then normal testosterone levels. Just imagine if PAC had a gym where the majority of the fighters get caught for doping. Just imagine because it never happened. Those things happened in reality but let's not point out who the culprit was.
This is no doubt one of the greatest posts ever in this forum. It is straight to the point, and cannot be counter with any veracity. When it came to Money May, double standards from the bytch-arse crooks that be were immense. That "TBE" for Lil Floyd should stand for "Tarnish Bullsyet Eternal." Holla!


-stormcentre :

The man fought with one arm. And Lil (farce) Floyd could not do syet with him. Holla!
Glad you chimed in BrotherVoodooPacQueen. As you (whom must surely be {as proven by your phenomenally consistent ability to always resort to fabrication and fantasy, no matter how many times you're caught out and "DoubleWorldChampion" busted} the greatest PacQueen of them all) neatly skip over all the points within my posts #9 and #15, and yet again prove my point . . .

""That the IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

I was wondering . . . . Since (you previously claimed there was 122 clinches in the fight but failed to prove it, and since you now claim) Pac only had one arm in the MayPac fight . . And given how reliable all your pre-post MayPac claims have been . . . Is there any chance you can identify and show us here within the actual fight . . . .



Precisely where - in the fight - it is that;


A) Pac was fighting with only 1 arm?
B) Roach was asking Pac how his shoulder (injury?) was going in between rounds.

As per what usually happens when a corner knows their man is competing with a debilitating (PacLossExcuse) injury. Let alone one that supposedly required an injection (that was rejected by the NSAC) only an hour beforehand?


C) Pac was fighting in a way where he was favoring the (supposed injection requiring and undisclosed) injury?
D) How the video shows anything other than Pac simply not being as capable (and fully juiced up with EPO and other dope?) when in with Floyd and/or someone that was not contracted to fight Pac at a catch-weight (as per the usual PacRoach approach to a fight), was happening?

Now I know my post here basically constitutes a call for you to explain yourself and *substantiate. And I know how you hate *that almost as much as you love fiction and running, but . . . . . How about it? I mean (122 Clinch FloydChopBadWood MannyKOFloydEasily PacEntourage MayPac expert) you sure release all your (proven to be false) wild fantasy claims with a surplus of fanfare and (pretend?) confidence. So, how about utilizing the same energy to be real, explain, and prove? Look, if you chose to do so, I know it wont be easy for you at first . . . . . But, if you do choose to do so, you could possibly earn some real Snoop Doggy Dog Dog credibility here. As opposed to just being the village DonkeyClown, and proving to us all over and over that that title is suitably deserved. Seriously, I'm talking about you giving the truth a chance and with it possibly earning real credibility. The stuff you don't have to lie about. And that stands even though explaining yourself in this instance (assuming you did so in a manner that was remotely believable) would - in all fairness - probably still constitute success and honesty on a scale of one out of the every other hundred of utterly wild and unreliable claims you have made and galloped away from. So . . . . My magical multilevel mineral marketing glacial milk and cancer curing friend, whom also has the patent on fast handed watermelon seeds . . . . . How about using those special Voodoo powers that you are gifted with for good/honest purposes, and pointing out to all your fans here at the TSS forum where precisely it is - within the above MayPac video - that the above points "A", "B", "C", and "D" exist? Finally, please feel free to consult with other Queens if the above task is too much for you. Over to you Brother Voodoo.
Storm. :) :) :)


-stormcentre :


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101426&viewfull=1#post101426 This is no doubt one of the greatest posts ever in this forum. It is straight to the point,
. [QUOTE=StormCentre Post #13 Released Prior To, & Debunking, Brother Voodoos Above "Cannot Be Counter With Veracity" Claim] [SIZE=1]
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101414&viewfull=1#post101414 Now to your first (false narrative) point . . .

""Just imagine if PAC was caught injecting himself at home with a 750 ml masking agent""

Is there any chance you can please explain how was Floyd """" doing this when;


A) The provision for the IV drip was explicitly negotiated and agreed upon by Pac; whereby Pac rejected seemingly lesser contractual provisions?
B) Floyd's team called in the officials in relation to it?

How could Floyd be ""caught"" doing this when his team called the officials in? Anyway, with all that said basically you're post proves my point in post #9. That being . . . .

""The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as
the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing"".

And it does so because, even aside from the fact that I have explicitly stated on many occasions that the IV drip is suspicious and that Floyd probably does dope; we need look no further than
yours and other Queens continual refusals to engage directly on the points I raised about Pac for substantiation of this fact. Rather than engage directly on the points I raised about Pac . . . It appears PacQueens instead prefer to go back to the same circular/misleading and/or false narratives that misdirect away from the issues raised about Pac. Almost as if they are afraid to discuss them head on and publicly, due to the fact that Pac lost against Floyd and proved them all wrong and in doing so created a very smelly PED trail of his own.
When it came to Money May, double standards from the bytch-arse crooks that be were immense. That "TBE" for Lil Floyd should stand for "Tarnish Bullsyet Eternal." Holla![/QUOTE] As I stated in earlier posts . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

Thanks for proving my above points Random. May I politely suggest that you read all the pertinent posts before continuing on with PacQueen false narratives and your latest fabricated excuses? May I also politely suggest that your above claim ""and cannot be counter with any veracity"" is - like many from you - now in dire need of recalibration. If not, then perhaps you can (in clear and coherent language) answer my above question pitched to Deep, which appears to have got you all erect and - contrary to your recent claim - also appears to counter, with real veracity, the very suggestion that Floyd was "caught". With all this, I must say that it certainly seems that you're not applying all that "I'm an Academia too" intellect of yours; that you have reminded us you have. Genius PacQueen at work here folks. Finally, now with all the above said . . . Please go back and read the last 3 sentences of my above pasted post #13. Does it remind you of anyone? Hee Haw !!!!
Storm :) :) :)


-deepwater2 :

Storm, Did PAC ever have high levels of testosterone, ever use the 750ml drip after a weigh in or has him gym mates been busted? Was the IV drip in the contract? If you say so. I have seen boxers use the drip to rehydrate, but those guys drained 20lbs of fluid in camp. Floyd walks around at 140 or whatever and he doesn't go in the sweat box before the scale. As far as Ariza and his shakes no one knows except Ariza and Floyd hired him , possibility of Floyd drinking these same magic shakes then. Who really knows what either of these guys have really done in the past but the reality is Floyd has many red flags regarding the doping issue.


-deepwater2 :

Floyd was "caught" isn't the point. Floyd injected 750ml of something. I haven't seen this contract your talking about. But if the contract said that Floyd could take coke or a side meth before the fight it doesn't make it legal. Did Floyd have a TUE? If PAC did any of the things Floyd has done, you might call for the death penalty. From usada: We have seen an increase in inquires at USADA about the use of Intravenous (IV) Infusions for this purpose, and would like to assist athletes and medical personnel by offering education. In accordance with the WADA Prohibited List (Category M2 Chemical and Physical Manipulation), all IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL (~3.4 tablespoons) per 6-hour period are prohibited, except for those legitimately received in the course of hospital admissions, surgical procedures or clinical investigations. IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL per 6-hour period are prohibited at all times, both in- and out-of-competition unless the athlete has applied for and been granted a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) under the applicable anti-doping rules. Further, if a prohibited substance that is administered intravenously or via injection, a TUE is necessary for this substance regardless of volume.


-amayseng :

Floyd was "caught" isn't the point. Floyd injected 750ml of something. I haven't seen this contract your talking about. But if the contract said that Floyd could take coke or a side meth before the fight it doesn't make it legal. Did Floyd have a TUE? If PAC did any of the things Floyd has done, you might call for the death penalty. From usada: We have seen an increase in inquires at USADA about the use of Intravenous (IV) Infusions for this purpose, and would like to assist athletes and medical personnel by offering education. In accordance with the WADA Prohibited List (Category M2 Chemical and Physical Manipulation), all IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL (~3.4 tablespoons) per 6-hour period are prohibited, except for those legitimately received in the course of hospital admissions, surgical procedures or clinical investigations. IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL per 6-hour period are prohibited at all times, both in- and out-of-competition unless the athlete has applied for and been granted a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) under the applicable anti-doping rules. Further, if a prohibited substance that is administered intravenously or via injection, a TUE is necessary for this substance regardless of volume.
All this really is not hard to comprehend, unless you have Floyds nuts on your face or are an adult fake bully calling people names on a website like a bitch. Floyd broke the rules, simple as that.


-brownsugar :

The problem with this topic is Mayweather has already been exonerated, not one shred of evidence has been produced by ANYONE to suggest otherwise. Suspicion and accusations can only go so far.... even Hauser who's been after Floyd for everything from domestic abuse, to Ped use, to masterminding a shooting in Vegas has done nothing but chip his teeth trying to take a bite out of Floyd on behalf of all the Floyd haters in the world. (and to generate massive cash returns on a mythical expose') Even Arum has deemed that further inquiries and appeals on his behalf were totally without merit said in so many words that " I have better things to do" Bob's final comment on the fight... "I saw the fight, Pac just got outboxed" End of story... ... butt hurt fans still bothered by Floyd's results will have better luck finding a transgendre urinal in a consevative Women's Restroom than they will discrediting his victory in the most painful fight ever witness by Pacfans. I have yet to hear anything new, useful, or constructive from the opposition.


-stormcentre :

All this really is not hard to comprehend, unless you have Floyds nuts on your face or are an adult fake bully calling people names on a website like a bitch. Floyd broke the rules, simple as that.
And the rebellion gains it most haphazard Amazzzing member again and convinces itself it's arising. Hey winner . . . . By the way . . . I love Floyd's nuts. And you're right I am a fake adult; particularly when compared to you and your track record. But whilst I love Floyd's nuts. I don't love them nearly as much as I love slapping you around with ease, busting you for puppy behavior, and watching you run (to the Queens) from (all) the hard questions though. To prove a point . . . . A few questions;


1) What rules did Floyd break that were in effect due to the contract Pac and Floyd signed?
2) Why are donkey's dubious claims in relation to this matter and Pac of no concern to you?

Oh oh . . . Looks like its time to start gathering the troops again and telling us stories about your family circumstances. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Floyd was "caught" isn't the point. Floyd injected 750ml of something. I haven't seen this contract your talking about. But if the contract said that Floyd could take coke or a side meth before the fight it doesn't make it legal. Did Floyd have a TUE? If PAC did any of the things Floyd has done, you might call for the death penalty. From usada: We have seen an increase in inquires at USADA about the use of Intravenous (IV) Infusions for this purpose, and would like to assist athletes and medical personnel by offering education. In accordance with the WADA Prohibited List (Category M2 Chemical and Physical Manipulation), all IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL (~3.4 tablespoons) per 6-hour period are prohibited, except for those legitimately received in the course of hospital admissions, surgical procedures or clinical investigations. IV infusions and/or injections of more than 50mL per 6-hour period are prohibited at all times, both in- and out-of-competition unless the athlete has applied for and been granted a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) under the applicable anti-doping rules. Further, if a prohibited substance that is administered intravenously or via injection, a TUE is necessary for this substance regardless of volume.
Unfortunately you haven't seen the contract; points awarded to you for being honest there. Still, despite that I have previously on numerous occasions explicitly stated and referenced that the WADA rules in their entirety were not in effect due to the contract that Pac and Floyd negotiated and signed. You should know that illicit substances are not treated the same - in anti doping legislation and it's practices - as banned substances. Not in the least as some can be contracted in/out of pertinent agreements. So your meth and other examples are not entirely apt You ready to discuss the other points I raised yet? Or do we still have more circular misdirection? Finally, Floyd supposedly being "caught" is the point. As that was precisely what you claimed.
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

The problem with this topic is Mayweather has already been exonerated, not one shred of evidence has been produced by ANYONE to suggest otherwise. Suspicion and accusations can only go so far.... even Hauser who's been after Floyd for everything from domestic abuse, to Ped use, to masterminding a shooting in Vegas has done nothing but chip his teeth trying to take a bite out of Floyd on behalf of all the Floyd haters in the world. (and to generate massive cash returns on a mythical expose') Even Arum has deemed that further inquiries and appeals on his behalf were totally without merit said in so many words that " I have better things to do" Bob's final comment on the fight... "I saw the fight, Pac just got outboxed" End of story... ... butt hurt fans still bothered by Floyd's results will have better luck finding a transgendre urinal in a consevative Women's Restroom than they will discrediting his victory in the most painful fight ever witness by Pacfans. I have yet to hear anything new, useful, or constructive from the opposition.
Yep. More than anything it's just PacQueens parading their unhappiness (with the MayPac loss) and inability to discuss Pac's suspicious behavior, around the park again.
The only people whom don?t want to disclose the truth and discuss Pac openly, are the same people with something to hide and benefit from grouping together and Queening. Which is why we have the same puppy group gathering again and selectively responding and looking at fact/oids. Not one puppy can stand up alone answer questions directly and have a decent debate - with coherent, direct, non-evasive, and non circular language - on all the matters in hand. Matter that I might add Donkey (questionably) brought back into existence (again). Actually, I fully expect Brother Voodoo to chime in here again soon and just completely let go of himself and spray genetic emissions all over this thread; in a complete total a absence of mind for the all the unproven claims he's already got, not just on this subject - but also in total. And when that happens . . . . No puppy or Queen will be up in arms saying ""gee you lie a lot and fail to prove your claims Random, including those about Pac and curing cancer"" Nope . . . All puppies and PacQueens will probably welcome such diversionary and evasive approaches, and not only support such idiocy and hypocrisy and overlook what it means - but probably also continue on in the same vein proving that these below claims to be true . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

And the more PuppyPacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior, the more they prove my above points. It's all good fun. It's nothing personal to me, and that's not just because I have previously, easily, and utterly slapped them all (at once) down and kicked all their azzez for bullying and other questionable behavior (most of which was based on and/or originating from donkey's fantasy claims) over the years; but I simply love watching and laughing at them - whether its jointly or separately - making excuses (was there a TUE?) and running from all the tough questions; as they operate in a boxing forum. Anyway, here are the links to (just some of) the questions and considerations that Queens are currently running from . . . . .


A)
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101414&viewfull=1#post101414
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101419&viewfull=1#post101419
B) Call for Brother Voodoo to use the MayPac video and show us where all the incidents of Pac fighting with 1 arm are . .
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101428&viewfull=1#post101428 Please note how Queens continually completely ignore Random's (previous track record of unreliable claims on this matter and also his) inability to do this.
C) An example of one of Brother Voodoo's more recent and wildly obvious cases of hoof in mouth on the subject that has also been stepped over as misdirection becomes a more popular option
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101429&viewfull=1#post101429
D)
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

Finally, here are the discussion points that have been brought back to the forum by Random's (above point "B") claim (that he has - again - failed to prove) that Pac was fighting with 1 arm, that are currently being ran from . . . .




- The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below.
- Can anyone point to and/or show me a fighter that has been as successful through all the weights as Pac, and as they did it - they did it by;


A) Not only, fighting with the indefatigable intensity for every 3 minutes that Pac has displayed.
B) But also, by stopping almost everyone; whether they're bigger than him or not?

That has not been in some way been suspected of and/or associated with PEDs?
- If Manny really had the Toradol injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight, as he claimed - then why did he only announce it just hours before the MayPac fight, and in doing so defraud the NSAC in paperwork/writing in relation to it? Why not just announce beforehand that you have an injury? Could the answer be that if that happened - amongst all the pre-MayPac fight hysteria and scrutiny - Pac would then possibly be required to substantiate the injuries existence?
- If Manny really had a legitimate and injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight - then why didn't PacRoach (in relation to that supposed injection requiring injury) simply apply for a TUE beforehand (as Floyd did); and then, later, openly announce any injection/IV related procedure pertaining to it, when/after that procedure was actually performed? Just as Floyd did with the IV when he called the testing officials in?
- Can anyone produce video of any MayPac round where it is obvious that the PacJuiceInjury was in full swing and limiting Pac's performance? Conversely, please also remember that there also exists video of Pac vigorously using his (Toradol injection requiring and injured) shoulder in preparation for the MayPac fight.
- Then there is also the curious manner in which Pac rehabilitated his Toradol injection requiring (and undisclosed) injury. Many news releases seem to state it was a "rehabilitation" like no other. One that was without complete adherence to the prescribed and/or typical procedures. Instead, it seems, Pac preferred to address that matter (of "rehabilitating" the PacLossExcuse and Toradol injection requiring {and undisclosed} injury) with nothing other than both, Jesus and salt water. What can we make of this in the context of all the above unanswered questions that Queens are running from?
- Why did Pac explicitly agree to the contractual provision of TUEs and/or the IV drip, when - in fact - he rejected other proposed contractual inclusions that were seemingly far lesser?



Lets keep it Snoop Doggy Dog Dog real. Cheers,
Storm. :) :) Oh almost forgot this . . .
The good bit is around 4 mins; Ariza; ""Manny had no injury . . ."" What would Ariza know?


-amayseng :

The problem with this topic is Mayweather has already been exonerated, not one shred of evidence has been produced by ANYONE to suggest otherwise. Suspicion and accusations can only go so far.... even Hauser who's been after Floyd for everything from domestic abuse, to Ped use, to masterminding a shooting in Vegas has done nothing but chip his teeth trying to take a bite out of Floyd on behalf of all the Floyd haters in the world. (and to generate massive cash returns on a mythical expose') Even Arum has deemed that further inquiries and appeals on his behalf were totally without merit said in so many words that " I have better things to do" Bob's final comment on the fight... "I saw the fight, Pac just got outboxed" End of story... ... butt hurt fans still bothered by Floyd's results will have better luck finding a transgendre urinal in a consevative Women's Restroom than they will discrediting his victory in the most painful fight ever witness by Pacfans. I have yet to hear anything new, useful, or constructive from the opposition.
The fight was beyond disappointing on both ends from both guys, hurt the sport tremendously in the long run. Floyd broke the rules, it is what it is. Though to claim I am butthurt is beyond absurd. Grown men pretending to be women and going to the little girls room is inappropriate, gross and disturbing. Milo said it right, transgenderism is a mental disorder, Milo, the homosexual who works for Breitbart... Ok, now that I have stirred the pot I am going to head back to checking on my son who nearly died 34 days ago... This dad is basking in glory of the Lord almighty God for his miracle to my son, I could care less to have hurt feelings about Floyd breaking rules, though my disappointment in him for his lack of performance will never stifle because I expect more out of a phenom like himself. Why super die hard Floyd fans aren't disappointed he didn't deliver a better performance is beyond me.


-brownsugar :

Butthurt, in denial, non-acceptance, these words are interchangeable and the choice whether or not to feel that way is personal. My goal is not to antagonize... its to get to the bottom line. And I'm not disappointed in Floyd, Why would I be? Floyd got so comfortable in there he even started countering Pacs lethal lefts with uppercuts....that type of skill at Floyd's age is outrageous....... the folks I watched the fight with weren't disappointed either, as we all went home with smiles on our faces....One persons disappointment is another persons "warm sense of satisfaction". I'm glad my guy won and I'm glad he moved on. We all moved on. Hope your son gets better.


-stormcentre :

The fight was beyond disappointing on both ends from both guys, hurt the sport tremendously in the long run.
Floyd broke the rules, it is what it is. Though to claim I am butthurt is beyond absurd. Grown men pretending to be women and going to the little girls room is inappropriate, gross and disturbing. Milo said it right, transgenderism is a mental disorder, Milo, the homosexual who works for Breitbart... Ok, now that I have stirred the pot I am going to head back to checking on my son who nearly died 34 days ago... This dad is basking in glory of the Lord almighty God for his miracle to my son, I could care less to have hurt feelings about Floyd breaking rules, though my disappointment in him for his lack of performance will never stifle because I expect more out of a phenom like himself. Why super die hard Floyd fans aren't disappointed he didn't deliver a better performance is beyond me.
You can't even meaningfully and accurately explain the basis that you seem to both, think you're right and to use to ignore the raised points I refer to. As I stated in my above post #23 . . . . . ------------------------------------------------------------------------
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101490&viewfull=1#post101490


1)
What rules did Floyd break that were in effect due to the contract Pac and Floyd signed?
2) Why are donkey's dubious claims in relation to this matter and Pac of no concern to you?

Oh oh . . . Looks like its time to start gathering the troops again and telling us stories about your family circumstances. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ This may come as a surprise to you . . . . . But only the rules "that are in effect" matter.

The rules that you want to be in effect and also those that may justify your stance and continuation with flogging a dead horse, sadly - for you - don't matter. And, I suggest this goes a long way towards why Queens and Puppies can't answer the hard questions or think rationally about the PacLoss and all that surrounds it.

And, the only rules that were in effect - were those that Pac agreed to and signed; which permitted Floyd's TUE and drip. Cry about it, pretend it's merely the product of Floyd loving fans, and skirt around all the hard questions all you like; but . . . . . Crying about this is pretty much the same as expecting French (or other non applicable) laws to apply in Afghanistan, and advising Afghanis that the French broke the rules because they drove in a certain way that was not in adherence with Afghanistan law. You'd be better off and/or get more traction bagging Pac out for being so utterly stupid, as to agree to the suspicious provision (whilst at the same time Pac rejected far lesser terms within the contract) that explicitly allowed Floyd to use the drip/TUE. But then doing that, would probably make it all the more harder to (continue to) ignore the fact that Pac did this and other questionable things that some find difficult to discuss. Which leads me to this . . . . .

As stated in earlier posts . . . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points.


Storm. :) :) :)


-SuperLight :

The fight was beyond disappointing on both ends from both guys, hurt the sport tremendously in the long run. Floyd broke the rules, it is what it is. Though to claim I am butthurt is beyond absurd. Grown men pretending to be women and going to the little girls room is inappropriate, gross and disturbing. Milo said it right, transgenderism is a mental disorder, Milo, the homosexual who works for Breitbart... Ok, now that I have stirred the pot I am going to head back to checking on my son who nearly died 34 days ago... This dad is basking in glory of the Lord almighty God for his miracle to my son, I could care less to have hurt feelings about Floyd breaking rules, though my disappointment in him for his lack of performance will never stifle because I expect more out of a phenom like himself. Why super die hard Floyd fans aren't disappointed he didn't deliver a better performance is beyond me.
Amayseng, what happened to your son? I'm not a diehard fan by any means. I don't think Mayweather's performance in that bout was disappointing, and it certainly wasn't unexpected. The most common complaint I see from his detractors is that he "runs/ran" in his fights, and yet people act surprised he fought defensively. Also it didn't look to me like Pac was fighting with a shoulder injury. If there's a way to tell from the footage, please someone point it out for us. For example, is there a certain angle hook he couldn't throw that he otherwise would? it still looks to me like Manny lost and tried to save face.


-amayseng :

Butthurt, in denial, non-acceptance, these words are interchangeable and the choice whether or not to feel that way is personal. My goal is not to antagonize... its to get to the bottom line. And I'm not disappointed in Floyd, Why would I be? Floyd got so comfortable in there he even started countering Pacs lethal lefts with uppercuts....that type of skill at Floyd's age is outrageous....... the folks I watched the fight with weren't disappointed either, as we all went home with smiles on our faces....One persons disappointment is another persons "warm sense of satisfaction". I'm glad my guy won and I'm glad he movedFl on. We all moved on. Hope your son gets better.
Oh I am not taking them personal my friend, honestly, I just find it ridiculous that everyone makes Floyd vs Pac an either or pick. I have always been a fan of both fighters, though I never relented to hold them to a higher standard. I saw Floyd show fantastic abilities in there with Pac and I saw Pac countering Floyd more times than I ever expecting. Though what I did not expect and did NOT like was Floyd choosing to anti fight when he clearly had the ability to fight and pour on some intensity. However, I guess that it just shows his respect for Manny's abilities. Either way, I remain highly disappointed in the fight of the century. Yes Floyd's skill at that age was phenomenal, just as Pac displayed his skill against Tim his last fight, phenomenal. Pac and Floyd are true phenoms and that is why I expected more from them both, I have never refrained from that statement. Appreciate the thoughts for my son. And Floyd broke the rules with the iv and/or details of it's use, unless I am so sleep deprived I can not remember..!!!!!


-amayseng :

Amayseng, what happened to your son? I'm not a diehard fan by any means. I don't think Mayweather's performance in that bout was disappointing, and it certainly wasn't unexpected. The most common complaint I see from his detractors is that he "runs/ran" in his fights, and yet people act surprised he fought defensively. Also it didn't look to me like Pac was fighting with a shoulder injury. If there's a way to tell from the footage, please someone point it out for us. For example, is there a certain angle hook he couldn't throw that he otherwise would? it still looks to me like Manny lost and tried to save face.
You can have his injury and throw hooks that look like hooks but do not have the snap, intensity and torque in them like normal. As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury. I truly believe that Pac hurt that shoulder and in round 4 when he hurt and staggered Floyd to the ropes he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's. Either way, Pac hurt or not I expected Floyd to fight more than anti fight, see the Ortiz fight, Cotto fight and such, I expected Floyd to step up his offense to negate Pac's own offense. I also figured Floyd would comprehend the stage of this fight and would step up and attempt to make a statement. He did not, it disappoints me as it hurt the sport. My son was riding his four wheeler and got clipped by a 8 inch tree hanging over part of the trail (there from a previous storm that was never there) he was riding about 25 mph or more and not wearing his helmet like he knew to. Anyways he sustained a tramatic brain injury which includes a fractured skull, epidural hematoma which is bleeding in the brain, bruised brain, swollen brain. Anyway his cousin called me and I was right up the road working thankfully, got to him , saw he had more than a concussion, got him to the ER at the hospital I work at and was able to get him back asap for a ct scan which showed all this, during all this he went out (most slip into a coma) and they life flighted him to the university hospital and performed life saving surgery on him. 30 or 60 mins later and my boy wouldnt be here and Amayseng would be in an insane asylum...ha..truly. Liam Neeson's wife sustained the same injury, sadly they didnt recognize it and did not get her medical help and she died. On another note, Ward vs Kovalev who is going? Is it worth going or will Ward slow and stall the fight like Bhop does and try to break down Kovalev's offense while controlling the pace and taking rounds on points?


-Radam G :

I'm just hoping that Farce Floyd gets brave enough to rematch with Da Manny. Let us see how smooth and swift TUE-cheating Floyd is against a healthy PacMan. In the words of Uncle Roger: "Most people don't know shyt 'bout boksin!'" Holla!


-amayseng :

I'm just hoping that Farce Floyd gets brave enough to rematch with Da Manny. Let us see how smooth and swift TUE-cheating Floyd is against a healthy PacMan. In the words of Uncle Roger: "Most people don't know shyt 'bout boksin!'" Holla!
I wouldnt buy it but i would watch it. Floyd could still make a ton of money off it, i say he does it next year.


-stormcentre :

I'm just hoping that Farce Floyd gets brave enough to rematch with Da Manny. Let us see how smooth and swift TUE-cheating Floyd is against a healthy PacMan. In the words of Uncle Roger: "Most people don't know shyt 'bout boksin!'" Holla!
Of course that doesn't apply to you. But then, perhaps we all have to remember . . . . . . Not everyone knows every Iota of the boxing game like you. And not everyone has the faultless track record like you to show for it. And not everyone has invented fast handed watermelon seeds and other magical potions . . . . . Like you Random. Holla. No . . . actually . . Hee-Haw !!!!!
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :


1) You can have his injury and throw hooks that look like hooks but do not have the snap, intensity and torque in them like normal. As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury.
2) he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's.

1)

Yep, it's truly a shame that (Queens don't care how) Pac or anyone never got around to publicly releasing detailed information about the true nature and origin of his alleged (injection requiring and NSAC fraud related) injury. Like you Amayzzing, I too have seen and experienced a few rotator cuff injuries. And with them all (unlike you) I have never seen anyone be able to freely move, compete in a world boxing championship (I mean a real one - not a DoubleWorldChampionship one, such as those {highly questionable claims} that you consistently overlook from your best mate as you feed us these ones of yours), and also throw their shoulders and arms around like Pac did in the MayPac fight. Let alone do so in conjunction with the following considerations;


- Straight after the PacLossExcuse injury supposedly required an injection but did/didn't receive it.
- The fight took place after a period of intense preparation work executed by Pac where no reports (or video of him training) suggest Pac was as injured as claimed.
- Pac failed to rehabilitate the PacLossExcuseInjury as prescribed.
- Pac opted to rehabilitate the PacLossExcuseInjury with Jesus and salt water; amen Queens.
- Pac and Roach worked together - for months - to deceptively ensure the PacLossExcuseInjury was not disclosed (whilst also presenting a completely different/opposite view about Pac's chances against Floyd) right up until only a few hours before the fight - whereby then an injection (one that could easily provide an advantage, explain why Pac failed to reject the TUE/IV drip clause, and mask other PEDs) was then requested.
- The above-mentioned injection PacRoach requested was requested by explicitly fraudulent means that;


a) Not only, directly contradicted with all PacRoach had crowed on about before the MayPac fight.
b) But also, directly contradicted with all (your DoubleWorldChamp mate, whom also claimed he was) PacEntourage claimed before the MayPac fight, too.

So, (just from this point "b" alone) either DoubleWorldChamp is a PacEntourage that (without any concern from you) lied about Pac's injury before the fight and in doing so he assisted the PacRoach architecture of the PacLossExcuse deception. Or, DoubleWorldChamp is not a PacEntourage and is still a liar (without any concern from you); whom you obviously support/promote - whilst you're also unable to explain yourself and answer all these questions about your views/stances on the PacLossExcuse matter. A matter that you clearly feel so strongly about that (as you cry about and call others out for using names) you yourself claim are fake adults. Hypocrisy and fantasy gone wild here folks !!!! Either way, DoubleWorldChamp is you best ally in this PacLossExcuse scam, and what's more, he is clearly a proven liar possessing no ability greater than that by which he is consistently unable to explain his wild claims - which are the same you invest in


- The fact that controversy related to PEDs is not disassociated with Pac.
- The fact that - to date - an almost complete lack of medical and/or other evidence exists that substantiates the nature and true origins of Pac's PacLoss(InjectionRequiring)Excuse.



So given that brief list - which (like Brother Voodoo's E&HHOF which details his pretending exploits) is by no means as comprehensive as it could be - a good question and/or set of considerations may be as follows . . . Given that you're a reliable (non fake) adult and that (from above) you claim . .


Amayzzing claim; ""As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury"".
Amayzzing claim; "But, you can [still] have [Pac's] injury and throw hooks that look like hooks but do not have the snap, intensity and torque in them like normal. "






Question 1; Can you please explain (when the last time was and/or) how often - in all your 10 years experience - you have seen a rotator cuff injury serious enough for both an injection and a PacLossExcuse that is also associated with all the above/below considerations and questions that are currently being ignored and ran from?
Question 2; Can you please explain (when the last time was and/or) how often - in all your 10 years experience - you have seen other physical therapists with ten years experience, that;


a) Willingly accept (as you clearly do) that you can have a legitimate rotator cuff tear and/or injury that (whilst you have seen no medical evidence that substantiates the nature and true origins of it, and instead witnessed only a hesitance on injury owner's part to provide such evidence) is serious enough to warrant both;


(i) An injection.
(ii) And also the PacLossExcuse(s) that both Pac and you are wheeling out . . . . .


b) Whilst - all at the same time - that same supposedly legitimate rotator cuff tear and/or injury is also associated (in the context of an umbilical cord) with all the above/below suspicious considerations and questions that are currently being ignored and ran from. . .

And, with it all (and - like most PacQueen claims - when I say ""all"" . . . ""all"" means quite a lot to swallow) - I mean all . . . . Including the myriad of unanswered questions - all the many questionable and diversionary PacQueen claims - all the extremely suspicious circumstances - and also the complete lack of medical evidence that exists that would otherwise substantiate the nature and true origins of Pac's PacLoss(InjectionRequiring)Excuse . . . . So . . . . with all that cause for concern . . . And, not to mention also . . . All donkey's related (to all that cause for concern) unproven and eyebrow raising claims . . that you obviously accept and take in your PacQueen stride, with all this . . . . . How often - in all your 10 years of physical therapy experience - have you have seen other physical therapists with ten years experience or more, that would follow in your footsteps and pay absolutely no attention to all these glaring warning signs, oversights and complete failures to explain . . . Such that they (push logic and professional experience to one side and down the cliff, and instead) place so much blind faith into successively unproven claims such that arrive at your level of Wallach-Glacial-Milk inspired blind-faith expertise?


Points to consider for all honest professional therapists with 10 years experience. Given all the below and above-mentioned associated and suspicious considerations (that you and Queens enjoy ignoring) I think it's fair to say that - with the PacQueen approach to this matter and also the PacLossExcuse - we are not just talking about a simple and medically proven rotator cuff injury that one can easily fight a 12 round fight with and draw no suspicion from it. Likewise, given all the below and above-mentioned associated and suspicious considerations (that you and Queens enjoy ignoring) I think it's also fair to say that -with the PacQueen approach to this matter and also the PacLossExcuse - we are not just talking about a simple and medically proven rotator cuff injury that easily fits the criteria of being worthy of both an injection and PacLossExcuse; whilst at the same time no (other) professional therapist (than, of course, you would believes a) requirement exists to ensure both the injury is legitimate and all its associated concerns are fully explained.

Therefore, I would be very interested to hear from you (use the same effort/dedication used as that you employed to contrast the medium sized post to which I am responding) about the number of other physical therapists with ten years or more experience that you know of that would openly accept (without asking/answering any questions) as you do, and - with it all - (not only accept a donkey afraid of the truth into their practice, but also) ultimately do all this in the same manner that you and other PacQueens do. In fact, I would be very interested to hear from you about the number of other physical therapists with ten years or more experience that you know of that would not simply laugh at the entire PacLossExcuse claim (set), almost as soon as they saw how closely;


a) All the above suspicious considerations and unanswered questions (that you or any other Queen can't answer) were associated with it.
b) Brother Voodoo and his annual release of consistently fantastic and unproven donkey claims were associated with it.



So . . . (with respect to point 1 of your above post) over to you Amayzzing . . . Please let us know if there are any other therapists out there that share your penchant for wild and suspicious claims, the circumvention of answers, harboring fiction addicted PacEntourages, and PacQueening. OK, now let's look at point 2 of your above post . . . . . .




2)

Glad that you have - to some extent - defined the basis your claims that Pac fought with an injury and/or 1 arm. Of course (as you know) stating you truly believe is a long way from even attempting to explain and/or prove yourself. I say that, as some here - especially after Pac lost - have (lied and) stated Pac was subjected to 122 clinches and then just (with some assistance from a handful of chosen PacQueens) ran from the claim. Anyway, I know you wouldn't support that kind of behavior or just look the other way as it happens. Now, don't worry, as right here/now within this post I am not going to ask you as to why you have thus far been unable to answer the *below questions from my post #23 . . . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101490&viewfull=1#post101490

. . . . That both, replied to your post (that suggested you're an adult :) ) and also looked into your PacLossExcuse claims/stance .

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ A few *questions;


1) What rules did Floyd break that were in effect due to the contract Pac and Floyd signed?
2) Why are donkey's dubious claims in relation to this matter and Pac of no concern to you? As it's (abundantly) clear their loneliness and how quick they have been fled from not only clarifies adulthood and being able to explain yourself on this subject, but also substantiates my below claims.



""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."



""Oh oh . . . Looks like its time to start gathering the troops again and telling us stories about your family circumstances"". ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



For now we will leave them, and why it is that donkey's (hundreds of) dubious claims in relation to this matter and also Pac are of no concern to you. OK, getting back to point 2 . . . . Alright, since;


A) .
B) The typical PacLossExcuse thing to do is to abjectly fail to even attempt to support any claim related to a PacLossExcuse; but you are an adult so such stereotypes will not apply to you.
C) And since there exists video of the MayPac fight for you to prove your claims with . . . . .

I was wondering, is there any chance you can identify and show us here within the actual fight . . . .



Precisely where it is that;


A)
B) Roach was asking Pac how his shoulder (injury?) was going when he sustained the injury and/or in between rounds.

As per what usually happens when a corner knows their man is competing with a debilitating (PacLossExcuse) injury. Let alone one that supposedly required an injection (that was rejected by the NSAC) only an hour beforehand?


C) Pac was fighting in a way where he was favoring the (supposed injection requiring and undisclosed) injury?

Heck, who knows . . . . If you can (with or without donkey's assistances) perform this miracle (and first time) act of (PacQueen) explanation and substantiation . . . . You may just get to rise above both your reputation and also the insurmountable barrier that "fear of
substantiation" currently presents to donkey in relation to the majority of his PacLossExcuse and other claims. And in doing so you may also get to prove
Storm wrong. So, as the self confessed adult that you are . . . . Is there any chance you can stand up and show us precisely where - in the above provided MayPac video - lies the origin of your above PacLossExcuseInjection(Requiring)Injury claims? Furthermore, if you do do all that . . . . I will consider disregarding the fact that you have treated the TUE/Iv drip rules and PacSigned contract in question in a manner not unlike expecting the 3 knockdown rule to be in effect due to the fact that your fighter lost in a competition where both fighters specifically knew and agreed such a rule was not in effect.

Finally, please say hello to DoubleWorld(Donkey)Champ for me won't you? You guys (and your fear of explaining even a quarter as good as you release claims and defend them) are an absolute scream. But then, I suppose, if this were not the case . . . You guys, puppies and PacQueens, would have less in common and holding you together; at night when it's cold. Best regards,
Storm. :) :)
PS:



""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."




-stormcentre :

Calling all PacQueens and PacQueen sympathizers . . . . . Amayzzzzzzing (and Brother Voodoo {whom also enjoys the [self appointed] privilege of being a PacEntourage and DoubleWorldChampion}) may need a little hand here explaining the mess they have found themselves in as a result of all the episodically peddled fiction, donkey denials, and publicly swallowed emissions. . . . . . :) Neither seem to be able to meaningfully overcome their fear of
substantiation and adequately explain themselves in relation to their most strongly held, loudly boasted about, and vehemently defended, claims, pertaining to the infamous and endlessly hilarious;


A) PacLossExcuse.
B) PacInjectionRequiringInjury.

In fact - truth be told - their individual inabilities to explain their PacLossExcuse theory far outstrips their combined ability to round up troops, ask no questions but still act with thought, attack, release endless false narratives, pretend, and misdirect. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they actually can answer the tough PacQueen questions and act like adults - but, they just don't right because they're a little confused at the moment. If you like, let's call it the onset of anxiety associated with fear of
substantiation. OK, so we have a little PacQueenSubstantiation mental block . . . Nothing
Storm can't help with . . . . . Let's see if I can help Queens prove their (most cherished) point . . .

Amayzzzzing, the above post #31 . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101506&viewfull=1#post101506

. . Claims that MayPac round 4 is where he ""truly believes that the PacLossExcuse originates from and is evident . . . .""

Alright then . . . Round 4 is around about the 18 minute mark of the MayPac video provided within the above post I have provided. Any Queen - please - go there, review that round, and then give both Amayyzzzzing and his best fantasy addicted friend a hand on the matter of . . . precisely where it is that PacJuice shows signs of fighting;


A) As Amayzzzzing claims.
B) And also with a PacInjectionRequiringInjury that would support the PacLossExcuse theory.

When it comes to meaningful
substantiation and explanation; I am all ears on how this PacLossExcuse theory works. Let's give the Queens a few more *days to see if they can muster up the energy and confidence to spend the 3 minutes (which mind you, is probably 1/1000th of the effort they have displaced to date to fabricate, pretend, and defend their PacLossExcuse) it will take to (i) have a look, (ii) clarify, and (iii) define precisely where it is that both, the origin of their PacLossExcuse exists and also precisely where it is/was that Pac was fighting with the supposed injection and PacLoss justifying injury. If - after the *above-mentioned few days have passed, and it's clear then that PacQueens still can't front up, act like adults, and explain themselves and their most cherished PacQueen and PacLossExcuse policies . . . then . . . . Since I am a fair
Storm and one that likes to help folks . . . . In that case
Storm will then lead the way (by adult example) and review round 4 (and possibly others) that the current assortment of silent/disquieted Queens appear to place all their faith and stock in when (cuddling together late at night and) wishing and hoping . . . That their PacLossExcuse is real . . . rather than just merely yet another figment of a fiction afflicted donkey's imagination that . . . . .

Has its origins long, long ago, and at a far away place that's earmarked by a time when some TSS readers - whom (in all fairness and comparison to what they have hypocritically ballooned into today) were probably then only "ProspectivePacPuppyQueens" - gave far, far, too much credence to DonkeyMagic and PacHysteria; particularly as it was preached then by our resident magician. And in this way Brother Voodoo (and his many personas) cleverly fooled and implicated ProspectivePacPuppyQueens with his unique blend of fantasy, fiction, fabrication and endless Queening; such that before many ProspectivePacQueens knew it they had already - on numerous occasions - publicly supported various frivolous, unproven, and potentially embarrassing, donkey beliefs and views - in manner that tied them closely to Brother Voodoo (where he required them to be) almost as much as it defeated any attempt that the same ProspectivePacQueens may have embarked upon to explain themselves and their PacQueening actions. And this explains the psychology associated with how the PacLossExcuse phenomena and fairytale has gained almost as much traction as it also consistently evades explaining itself. In this way, the PacLossExcuse policies and associated phenomena was allowed to pass - completely un-scrutinized - into the desperate consciousness of all those fanatical fabricators that would later become ProspectivePacQueens and then - after that - graduate as fully blown Pacqueens; whom not only, grew accustomed to (and supported such outrageous claims as) fast handed watermelon seed magical potions and the like - but also were (especially at the post-MayPac time) extremely desperate for a (PacLossExcuseHope) straw to clutch at - as they attempted to sooth the (Puppy?) pains associated with the stupendous myth (which they had all invested in) of Pac supposedly being about to beat Floyd . . . A myth, that was - quite literally - destroyed before theirs and world's very eyes; when Pac failed to perform as forecasted.

Finally, as stated above . . .

""When it comes to meaningful
substantiation and explanation; I am all ears on how this PacLossExcuse theory works"".

Please stand up as adults and use the provided MayPac video to support your claims and theories. Over to you Queens. Love it !!!!! Best regards,
Storm. :) :)






-SuperLight :

You can have his injury and throw hooks that look like hooks but do not have the snap, intensity and torque in them like normal. As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury. I truly believe that Pac hurt that shoulder and in round 4 when he hurt and staggered Floyd to the ropes he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's. Either way, Pac hurt or not I expected Floyd to fight more than anti fight, see the Ortiz fight, Cotto fight and such, I expected Floyd to step up his offense to negate Pac's own offense. I also figured Floyd would comprehend the stage of this fight and would step up and attempt to make a statement. He did not, it disappoints me as it hurt the sport. My son was riding his four wheeler and got clipped by a 8 inch tree hanging over part of the trail (there from a previous storm that was never there) he was riding about 25 mph or more and not wearing his helmet like he knew to. Anyways he sustained a tramatic brain injury which includes a fractured skull, epidural hematoma which is bleeding in the brain, bruised brain, swollen brain. Anyway his cousin called me and I was right up the road working thankfully, got to him , saw he had more than a concussion, got him to the ER at the hospital I work at and was able to get him back asap for a ct scan which showed all this, during all this he went out (most slip into a coma) and they life flighted him to the university hospital and performed life saving surgery on him. 30 or 60 mins later and my boy wouldnt be here and Amayseng would be in an insane asylum...ha..truly. Liam Neeson's wife sustained the same injury, sadly they didnt recognize it and did not get her medical help and she died. On another note, Ward vs Kovalev who is going? Is it worth going or will Ward slow and stall the fight like Bhop does and try to break down Kovalev's offense while controlling the pace and taking rounds on points?
Righto, I'll review the fight footage and see what I can spot. Let's not just go by my impression at the time or my memory of it now. Sorry to hear what happened to your boy. Hope he makes a proper recover and you stay out of the asylum.


-amayseng :

Righto, I'll review the fight footage and see what I can spot. Let's not just go by my impression at the time or my memory of it now. Sorry to hear what happened to your boy. Hope he makes a proper recover and you stay out of the asylum.
Thanks for the well wishes for my son I truly appreciate it. Yes, that is my opinion of when he exacerbated or reinjured his shoulder, heck it may have been before or later I just think from the way he pulled back that is when it occurred. Things happen, it is no excuse for the loss, just like when Tim hurt his ankles and calves just trying to keep up with and escape Pac's physical abilities, things happen. With or without the injury I am disappointed with Floyd's performance because I expected more from him. However, I just have to chalk it up to him respecting Manny and Manny's boxing ability. Heck, even Floyd sr was screaming at Floyd for fighting scared.


-King Beef :

You can have his injury and throw hooks that look like hooks but do not have the snap, intensity and torque in them like normal. As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury. I truly believe that Pac hurt that shoulder and in round 4 when he hurt and staggered Floyd to the ropes he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's. Either way, Pac hurt or not I expected Floyd to fight more than anti fight, see the Ortiz fight, Cotto fight and such, I expected Floyd to step up his offense to negate Pac's own offense. I also figured Floyd would comprehend the stage of this fight and would step up and attempt to make a statement. He did not, it disappoints me as it hurt the sport. My son was riding his four wheeler and got clipped by a 8 inch tree hanging over part of the trail (there from a previous storm that was never there) he was riding about 25 mph or more and not wearing his helmet like he knew to. Anyways he sustained a tramatic brain injury which includes a fractured skull, epidural hematoma which is bleeding in the brain, bruised brain, swollen brain. Anyway his cousin called me and I was right up the road working thankfully, got to him , saw he had more than a concussion, got him to the ER at the hospital I work at and was able to get him back asap for a ct scan which showed all this, during all this he went out (most slip into a coma) and they life flighted him to the university hospital and performed life saving surgery on him. 30 or 60 mins later and my boy wouldnt be here and Amayseng would be in an insane asylum...ha..truly. Liam Neeson's wife sustained the same injury, sadly they didnt recognize it and did not get her medical help and she died. On another note, Ward vs Kovalev who is going? Is it worth going or will Ward slow and stall the fight like Bhop does and try to break down Kovalev's offense while controlling the pace and taking rounds on points?
1st and foremost, sorry to hear about your son; and wishing a quick and full recovery!


-King Beef :

I never would have thought Pac would succumb to the "irresistible pull" back to the ring before Floyd would. I take it Vargas is still the target, although I am wondering how that PPV draw will do. I personally would have liked to see Crawford in there, but Manny has earned the right just like Mayweather, to fight whoever. On a side note... I can't believe we are still debating the fight "that was or never was". There was no way that fight had a chance of living up to the expectations and a rematch will be more of the same. Injury or no injury, and I am in the believe of the latter, maybe an old nagging hitch, but nothing that would have done anything to change the outcome of that fight, but kudos to Freddy for keeping that "injury ace" in his back pocket to help try to spur an interest in a rematch.


-brownsugar :

Well said KingBeef, that's it in a nutshell. Floyd said 8 years ago that he knew how to beat Pac, and when he did it, everyone would call it boring. Personally speaking the only PPV I plan to buy is Ward vs Kovalev...and even though Kell Brook is weighing in at 176 lbs vs 165 for Golovkin, Golovkins weight is true condensed biomass, and at its core consists of muscle, bone, ligaments and fuel, while Brook has been burning off excess body-fluids. It's common knowledge that Danny Garcia and Terrence Crawford tip the scales at 170 between fights. While Canelo exceeds 180lbs. The extra weight will help Brook be more comfortable but I can't see how it will make Brook competitive after 5 rounds. If Brook had 6 months to bulk up....or if he already has been bulking up since his last fight, I could see a better result but Brook is simply not the technician that Golovkin is....don't let "I want big drama show" fool you. 3G is not a face fighting brawler. I would buy Crawford vs Pac..... or Crawford vs Garcia because of the factor of competitiveness, both fighters bite down in big fights and are loathe to lose against their peers. The icing on the cake is their willingness to allow a little bad blood to drizzle over the prefight promotion... I love it when boxers want to turn a boxing event into a revenge fight. But Pac vs Vargas is not PPV worthy in my opinion..... Vargas did do a great job against Sadam Ali, but Pac will pick him apart unless there has been some major slippage. In the world of fantasy fights, the internet has been blowing up with speculation over a Crawford vs Spence match up. To me..... its like the speculation between Oscar and Pac, a decade ago but in this case (Spence) the bigger fighter was a better fighter in the amateurs and is a bigger stronger and better fighter in the professional ranks. Besides they are likely to be in different weight classes for the bulk of their careers. Instead give us a good heavyweight fight....any permutation of a match between Ortiz, Povetkin, Wilder, Joshua, and Fury will do.


-amayseng :

1st and foremost, sorry to hear about your son; and wishing a quick and full recovery!
Thank you so much, I truly appreciate it!


-amayseng :

Well said KingBeef, that's it in a nutshell. Floyd said 8 years ago that he knew how to beat Pac, and when he did it, everyone would call it boring. Personally speaking the only PPV I plan to buy is Ward vs Kovalev...and even though Kell Brook is weighing in at 176 lbs vs 165 for Golovkin, Golovkins weight is true condensed biomass, and at its core consists of muscle, bone, ligaments and fuel, while Brook has been burning off excess body-fluids. It's common knowledge that Danny Garcia and Terrence Crawford tip the scales at 170 between fights. While Canelo exceeds 180lbs. The extra weight will help Brook be more comfortable but I can't see how it will make Brook competitive after 5 rounds. If Brook had 6 months to bulk up....or if he already has been bulking up since his last fight, I could see a better result but Brook is simply not the technician that Golovkin is....don't let "I want big drama show" fool you. 3G is not a face fighting brawler. I would buy Crawford vs Pac..... or Crawford vs Garcia because of the factor of competitiveness, both fighters bite down in big fights and are loathe to lose against their peers. The icing on the cake is their willingness to allow a little bad blood to drizzle over the prefight promotion... I love it when boxers want to turn a boxing event into a revenge fight. But Pac vs Vargas is not PPV worthy in my opinion..... Vargas did do a great job against Sadam Ali, but Pac will pick him apart unless there has been some major slippage. In the world of fantasy fights, the internet has been blowing up with speculation over a Crawford vs Spence match up. To me..... its like the speculation between Oscar and Pac, a decade ago but in this case (Spence) the bigger fighter was a better fighter in the amateurs and is a bigger stronger and better fighter in the professional ranks. Besides they are likely to be in different weight classes for the bulk of their careers. Instead give us a good heavyweight fight....any permutation of a match between Ortiz, Povetkin, Wilder, Joshua, and Fury will do.
I agree and will happily buy a Ward vs Kovalev fight, I had planned on attending it but now I will not leave my son and be that far away from him, **** an hour is far enough. I am also in support of a TC vs Garcia fight and I see TC outclassing him though Garcia does have that debilitating game changing power. TC vs Spence may be a bit premature at this point though those two are for sure stars in the making. Pac vs Vargas would be a very exciting fight as both guys come to be offensive and like the fireworks, though I would much prefer a TC vs Pac fight, Pac looked great against the excellent Tim Bradley so why not make it happen? Pac should call the shots and TC should abide as that young hungry lion. Kel Brooke weighing more than GGG at 30 days out amazes me, too much weight to put on and now take off or he put on too much muscle lifting too much. The best thing you can do is fight at your best weight, not go up or down due to the opponent.


-stormcentre :

I never would have thought Pac would succumb to the "irresistible pull" back to the ring before Floyd would. I take it Vargas is still the target, although I am wondering how that PPV draw will do. I personally would have liked to see Crawford in there, but Manny has earned the right just like Mayweather, to fight whoever.
1) = On a side note... I can't believe we are still debating the fight "that was or never was". There was no way that fight had a chance of living up to the expectations and a rematch will be more of the same. Injury or no injury, and I am in the believe of the latter, maybe an old nagging hitch, but nothing that would have done anything to change the outcome of that fight, but kudos to Freddy for keeping that "injury ace" in his back pocket to help try to spur an interest in a rematch.
Hey KB. How's things?
1) = Yes, agreed. But to be fair it's a slightly different point we are now discussing, and that point is captured below . . .

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- As stated in earlier posts . . . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, as you can see KB . . . And, if you will excuse the (perhaps apt) pun . . . it's all about getting the Queens to drop their skirts now and seeing whether they;


A) Are as worthy of the trust they (and all their PacLossExcuse
s) claim they are.
B) Have truly transitioned into adulthood as completely as they claim.

:) In summary . . . This thread has - (aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below}) as far as I am concerned - evolved into an opportunity for PacQueens to reveal their true substance and that of their cherished PacLossExcuse policies. Perhaps better put . . . . It's a great opportunity for (self confessed) therapists with 10 years experience (as Amayzzing claims he is) and (self confessed) adults (as Amayzzing claims he is) to stand up . . . After all the (years and years of) PacLossExcuse shenanigans, and openly explain - using the MayPac video (so it is real easy; just a few minutes) - precisely where all the PacLossExcuse incidents are of PacJuice fighting with hesitation/restriction, being debilitated, and favoring his injury . . . . . . . As Amayzzzing and the PacQueens claim.
Storm's way of thinking about all this is this . . . . . If there is one ounce (or even a tenth of an ounce) to the basis of all the PacLossExcuses and resulting Puppy and PacQueening behavior that we have all seen . . . and if we are really dealing with adults and professionals with 10 years experience (as Amayzzzing claims) that supposedly know injuries well . . . . Then, standing up, behaving as an adult, and meaningfully explaining both yourself and the PacLossExcuse theory with the MayPac video (without misdirecting and/or evading) should be easy and the least the Queens and professional therapists can do. Now, whilst that approach is good in theory it has a weakness, because it assumes that the widespread and rampant fear of
substantiation that Queens obviously experience can be controlled and/or suppressed for 3 minutes. And, as we all know a Queen would rather become intimate with a donkey and/or act as a damsel in distress and misdirect, as opposed to explaining the basis for their curious claims and questionable PacLossExcuse religion. So . . . . Unfortunately, to date (and please note that) this was predicted in my ""Calling all PacQueens and PacQueen sympathizers . . . "" post #36 . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101593&viewfull=1#post101593 And also other posts I have authored. .

Amayzzing has failed to even go close to the provided video to support his PacLossExcuse. And (aside from the fact that doing so would most likely expose the basis upon which his PacLossExcuse and all the interesting conduct that has flowed on from it rests - as well as revealing the true substance the PacQueen religion contains) I suspect that doing so would constitute yet another hilarious episode of him being caught out releasing questionable claims as a means of covering the same before them that both he and other Queens simply can't explain; but still invest in. Examples of such Amayzzzzing claims (that are released as a means of covering the same before them are) such as this (from this very thread) right here . . . . .

[QUOTE=Physical Therapist With 10 Years Experience Afraid 2 Provide Evidence Of Diagnosis]
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101506&viewfull=1#post101506 As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury. I truly believe that Pac hurt that shoulder and in round 4 when he hurt and staggered Floyd to the ropes he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's. [/QUOTE]

Now, aside from how thoroughly I have address Amayzzing's above post here in this below-linked post #35 of mine . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101559&viewfull=1#post101559

Which of course, has gone without answer from Amayyzzzing, as he enjoys the (neatly timed*) subject change to his family matter (more on *that later). There is also the fact that - even if we accept Amayyzzzing's therapeutical assessment of the situation and (what therefore constitutes his) latest clutch at straws to keep the PacLossExcuse dream alive . . . . Amayyzzzing still seems awfully scared of using the provided MayPac video (it's just here Amayzzzing, so you don't have to look too far) . . . . . .



To stand up like an adult and show us all where precisely it is that Pac throws . . . .



Due to the PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury that Amayzzing's 10 years as a professional therapist allows him to make judgment on. It's a shame Amayzzing is consistently running and unable to both stand up for the PacQueenMovement and explain himself, as . . . . Doing so would;


A) Not only, allow us all to understand how Amayzzzing assesses and invests in, truth and fiction.
B) But also, it would allow us all to have a better understanding of the basis upon which his above-mentioned PacLossExcuse therapeutical assessment and latest theory has been formed.

Ah, well, at least it provides insight into why Brother Voodoo and him have such a great relationship. Anyway, with all that said, and despite how cherished the PacLossExcuse is to Amayyzzing - how suspicious (for a therapist with 10 years experience) his obviously (caterpillar belly) low tolerances are for both, unexplainable claims and also those that pretend are - and despite how easy it is for him (or any fully blown Queen) to step us all through the above MayPac video and show us all where all evidence (notice I am not even asking for proof at this stage) is that supports their lucid dreams in relation to the PacLossExcuse . . . . All that our resident rotator cuff therapist has done to date is . . . . . Nothing; other than run and evade. To be fair though . . . Amayzzing's probably got an excuse for this too. . . . . He probably - with his busy rotator cuff therapy practice (that accepts and acts upon unproven diagnoses from unqualified voodoo donkeys) - can't find the 3 minutes within his busy schedule (of posting 10 minute long excuses) that's required to go through round 4 and substantiate precisely where the evidence is that supports his (years and years of) PacQueen claims. Interesting it is eh? However, (and rather curiously) Amayyzzzzing can - and rather conveniently I might add - take the time introduce;


A) Another theory, that (in the bowels of his rotator cuff surgery's practice and no doubt with consultant donkey present providing advice on how to escape substantiation) appears, at least on face value, to be able to keep the wolves from the door and "blow" new life into donkeys' dream of a . . . . .

PacLossExcuse that can never be answered or questioned and one that completely shelters the entire PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury debacle from the truth.


B) Another pensive family discussion point that ensures anyone expecting him to stand up as an adult and explain his PacLossExcuse with the video provided, feels a little hesitance for doing so and/or at least expecting him to without (at least) buying into his latest example of family discussion; whereby he can then utilize this "buy in" for sympathy and/or diversionary (away from explaining) purposes.

For those that don't already know . . . . This (continual running and inability to explain - even the most outrageous and denial riddled claims - whilst always releasing a succession of equally dubious and laughable claims as a means to buy time and misdirect, combined with all the other PacLossExcuse related conduct that Amayzzing and other PacQueens exhibit) is called or . And it's;


A) Not only, proof that Amayzzing is one of the greatest PacQueens of them all.
A) But also, it's why/how I justify using such terms.

After all, when;


(i) One subscribes to what is obviously a stupendous lie (that's as completely unproven and indefensible as Amayzzing has shown {by always running and evading} his PacLossExcuse and other associated claims to be) for more than a year.
(ii) And when one, at the same time, also loves using the same falsehood set as the basis for Queening and other questionable group activities, as Amayyzzzing has . . . then there can be no doubt that you are a PacQueen addicted to fantasy, fiction, fabrication, and - of course - running.





Yep, (according to PacQueens and Amayzzing) PacJuice can (just after not receiving a supposedly much needed injection) fight for 12 rounds in the world's biggest boxing fight, and against one of boxing best performers, all with a PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury
AND also (without drawing any suspicion to yourself) use the same PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury, as your PreFabricatedPacLossExcuse . . . . Due to all the reasons Amayzzing;


A) Stated.
B) But (surprise, surprise) is still consistently running from (even attempting to) meaningfully use his 10 years experience as a professional therapist to explain.

That's SaltWaterJesus my brothers !!!! Amen and hallelujah !!!!!! May you never have to explain yourself and the most obviously wild PacQueen claims. Finally, above I stated . . . .

""Aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below} . . . .""

Now, I appreciate this may - at first - appear harsh. But it's not really.

You see Amayzzing has a history of ensuring discussions (especially those pertaining to where he has been caught bullying, releasing false claims, and Queening) quickly disintegrate into his family circumstances; where he can garner sympathy and attention, and then utilize that for evasive means. And, of course misdirect. Perhaps, it's the donkey voodoo equivalent of galloping away whilst releasing obnoxious "I'm a DoubleWorldChampion & Will Prove It" gases. And the proof of that assessment is that Amayzzzing could easily wheel out his family matters for discussion whilst at the same time also - spending the 3 minutes it requires - directly addressing the outstanding issues upon which his PacLossExcuse theory and Queening activities rest. But that never happens. As the family matters almost always serve other purposes that are evidenced by Amayyyzzzing not being able to explain both himself and the basis for his PacLossExcuse religion/denial. So, these are interesting points for consideration. As is the fact that - whilst in full swing and attack last year with all the puppies in full tow - Amayyzzing displayed no such family related interest on his own behalf whilst he released concerning/questionable comments that paid no attention and indeed also directly disrespected the fact that some people here had family members that had died from diabetes and/or cancer. Clearly, "those" family matters were of no interest to, and/or served no purpose for, Amayzzzing. Now (with or without the PacLossExcuse phenomena that has clearly become the unexplainable and dubious religion that Amayyzzing has cornered himself with) that's certainly a strange set of, and simply duplicitous, principles for any PacQueen (seeking to convince us he's an adult and trustworthy) to possess . . .. Whether or not, he's moonlighting as a rotator cuff therapist with 10 years experience - that's also, at the same time, clearly taking all he can (in terms of advice and other favors) in the backroom from donkeys with a proven track record in reliability; whilst every single opportunity to explain himself and his claims is ignored and ran from.

Now, I wonder what could be the cause for such curious traits?

Could it be that Amayzzing suffers from fear of substantiation. Most pretenders do. Or, perhaps the cause for such curious (and Amayseng) traits is that the PacLossExcuse and its entire PacUnproven basis is as reliable as someone (say, perhaps someone like a PacEntourage) peddling watermelon seeds to ensure you (but not Pac with a shoulder injury when he needs them the most) punches faster? Or perhaps it's all of the above?

Ahh well . . . (even if Amayyzzzing and all other PacQueens are too afraid too) at least our good friend Superlight has stepped up to the plate - is unafraid of the truth - and has the stones to look at the MayPac video. Queens take note - that is how you do it. Not by running. Let's see if SuperLight can find any evidence of the mythical PacLossExcuse that supposedly supports all the claims Amayzzing and other Queens have made, Deeply invested in, but ran from when
substantiation comes knocking on the door.
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

I agree and will happily buy a Ward vs Kovalev fight, I had planned on attending it but now I will not leave my son and be that far away from him, **** an hour is far enough. I am also in support of a TC vs Garcia fight and I see TC outclassing him though Garcia does have that debilitating game changing power. TC vs Spence may be a bit premature at this point though those two are for sure stars in the making. Pac vs Vargas would be a very exciting fight as both guys come to be offensive and like the fireworks, though I would much prefer a TC vs Pac fight, Pac looked great against the excellent Tim Bradley so why not make it happen? Pac should call the shots and TC should abide as that young hungry lion. Kel Brooke weighing more than GGG at 30 days out amazes me, too much weight to put on and now take off or he put on too much muscle lifting too much. The best thing you can do is fight at your best weight, not go up or down due to the opponent.
There you go . . .
Round 4. Any round. Please, show us where (as per all your previous claims and posts you say) the origin of all your claims and the PacLossExcuse is. You can (at the same time) still talk about your family and other stuff. Best regards,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

I never would have thought Pac would succumb to the "irresistible pull" back to the ring before Floyd would. I take it Vargas is still the target, although I am wondering how that PPV draw will do. I personally would have liked to see Crawford in there, but Manny has earned the right just like Mayweather, to fight whoever.
1) = On a side note... I can't believe we are still debating the fight "that was or never was". There was no way that fight had a chance of living up to the expectations and a rematch will be more of the same. Injury or no injury, and I am in the believe of the latter, maybe an old nagging hitch, but nothing that would have done anything to change the outcome of that fight, but kudos to Freddy for keeping that "injury ace" in his back pocket to help try to spur an interest in a rematch.
Hey KB. How's things?
1) = Yes, agreed. But to be fair it's a slightly different point we are now discussing, and that point is captured below . . .

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- As stated in earlier posts . . . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, as you can see KB . . . And, if you will excuse the (perhaps apt) pun . . . it's all about getting the Queens to drop their skirts now and seeing whether they;


A) Are as worthy of the trust they (and all their PacLossExcuse
s) claim they are.
B) Have truly transitioned into adulthood as completely as they claim.

:) In summary . . . This thread has - (aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below}) as far as I am concerned - evolved into an opportunity for PacQueens to reveal their true substance and that of their cherished PacLossExcuse policies. Perhaps better put . . . . It's a great opportunity for (self confessed) therapists with 10 years experience (as Amayzzing claims he is) and (self confessed) adults (as Amayzzing claims he is) to stand up . . . After all the (years and years of) PacLossExcuse shenanigans, and openly explain - using the MayPac video (so it is real easy; just a few minutes) - precisely where all the PacLossExcuse incidents are of PacJuice fighting with hesitation/restriction, being debilitated, and favoring his injury . . . . . . . As Amayzzzing and the PacQueens claim.
Storm's way of thinking about all this is this . . . . . If there is one ounce (or even a tenth of an ounce) to the basis of all the PacLossExcuses and resulting Puppy and PacQueening behavior that we have all seen . . . and if we are really dealing with adults and professionals with 10 years experience (as Amayzzzing claims) that supposedly know injuries well . . . . Then, standing up, behaving as an adult, and meaningfully explaining both yourself and the PacLossExcuse theory with the MayPac video (without misdirecting and/or evading) should be easy and the least the Queens and professional therapists can do. Now, whilst that approach is good in theory it has a weakness, because it assumes that the widespread and rampant fear of
substantiation that Queens obviously experience can be controlled and/or suppressed for 3 minutes. And, as we all know a Queen would rather become intimate with a donkey and/or act as a damsel in distress and misdirect, as opposed to explaining the basis for their curious claims and questionable PacLossExcuse religion. So . . . . Unfortunately, to date (and please note that) this was predicted in my ""Calling all PacQueens and PacQueen sympathizers . . . "" post #36 . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101593&viewfull=1#post101593 And also other posts I have authored. .

Amayzzing has failed to even go close to the provided video to support his PacLossExcuse. And (aside from the fact that doing so would most likely expose the basis upon which his PacLossExcuse and all the interesting conduct that has flowed on from it rests - as well as revealing the true substance the PacQueen religion contains) I suspect that doing so would constitute yet another hilarious episode of him being caught out releasing questionable claims as a means of covering the same before them that both he and other Queens simply can't explain; but still invest in. Examples of such Amayzzzzing claims (that are released as a means of covering the same before them are) such as this (from this very thread) right here . . . . .

[QUOTE=Physical Therapist With 10 Years Experience Afraid 2 Provide Evidence Of Diagnosis]
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101506&viewfull=1#post101506 As a physical therapist for ten years now I have seen many rotator cuff tears, some of major degree and some of minor degree. There are four tendons that attach to the humeral head, dependent on which tendon and the degree of tear will result in the diminished ability and intensity of the injury. I truly believe that Pac hurt that shoulder and in round 4 when he hurt and staggered Floyd to the ropes he threw some hard right hooks and you could see him back off of Floyd due to exacerbating it. I myself at this time have a small tear in my left shoulder. I hurt it playing football in high school and re tore the scar tissue last winter sparring throwing a hook. It is much better now but I could not throw a left hook with not even 3/4 intensity and I could not turn my fist over through the motion, i had to keep my palm towards my face through its motion so to speak or it hurt and had no sting at all on it though my tear is diff from Manny's. [/QUOTE]

Now, aside from how thoroughly I have address Amayzzing's above post here in this below-linked post #35 of mine . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101559&viewfull=1#post101559

Which of course, has gone without answer from Amayyzzzing, as he enjoys the (neatly timed*) subject change to his family matter (more on *that later). There is also the fact that - even if we accept Amayyzzzing's therapeutical assessment of the situation and (what therefore constitutes his) latest clutch at straws to keep the PacLossExcuse dream alive . . . . Amayyzzzing still seems awfully scared of using the provided MayPac video (it's just here Amayzzzing, so you don't have to look too far) . . . . . .



To stand up like an adult and show us all where precisely it is that Pac throws . . . .



Due to the PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury that Amayzzing's 10 years as a professional therapist allows him to make judgment on. It's a shame Amayzzing is consistently running and unable to both stand up for the PacQueenMovement and explain himself, as . . . . Doing so would;


A) Not only, allow us all to understand how Amayzzzing assesses and invests in, truth and fiction.
B) But also, it would allow us all to have a better understanding of the basis upon which his above-mentioned PacLossExcuse therapeutical assessment and latest theory has been formed.

Ah, well, at least it provides insight into why Brother Voodoo and him have such a great relationship. Anyway, with all that said, and despite how cherished the PacLossExcuse is to Amayyzzing - how suspicious (for a therapist with 10 years experience) his obviously (caterpillar belly) low tolerances are for both, unexplainable claims and also those that pretend are - and despite how easy it is for him (or any fully blown Queen) to step us all through the above MayPac video and show us all where all evidence (notice I am not even asking for proof at this stage) is that supports their lucid dreams in relation to the PacLossExcuse . . . . All that our resident rotator cuff therapist has done to date is . . . . . Nothing; other than run and evade. To be fair though . . . Amayzzing's probably got an excuse for this too. . . . . He probably - with his busy rotator cuff therapy practice (that accepts and acts upon unproven diagnoses from unqualified voodoo donkeys) - can't find the 3 minutes within his busy schedule (of posting 10 minute long excuses) that's required to go through round 4 and substantiate precisely where the evidence is that supports his (years and years of) PacQueen claims. Interesting it is eh? However, (and rather curiously) Amayyzzzzing can - and rather conveniently I might add - take the time introduce;


A) Another theory, that (in the bowels of his rotator cuff surgery's practice and no doubt with consultant donkey present providing advice on how to escape substantiation) appears, at least on face value, to be able to keep the wolves from the door and "blow" new life into donkeys' dream of a . . . . .

PacLossExcuse that can never be answered or questioned and one that completely shelters the entire PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury debacle from the truth.


B) Another pensive family discussion point that ensures anyone expecting him to stand up as an adult and explain his PacLossExcuse with the video provided, feels a little hesitance for doing so and/or at least expecting him to without (at least) buying into his latest example of family discussion; whereby he can then utilize this "buy in" for sympathy and/or diversionary (away from explaining) purposes.

For those that don't already know . . . . This (continual running and inability to explain - even the most outrageous and denial riddled claims - whilst always releasing a succession of equally dubious and laughable claims as a means to buy time and misdirect, combined with all the other PacLossExcuse related conduct that Amayzzing and other PacQueens exhibit) is called or . And it's;


A) Not only, proof that Amayzzing is one of the greatest PacQueens of them all.
A) But also, it's why/how I justify using such terms.

After all, when;


(i) One subscribes to what is obviously a stupendous lie (that's as completely unproven and indefensible as Amayzzing has shown {by always running and evading} his PacLossExcuse and other associated claims to be) for more than a year.
(ii) And when one, at the same time, also loves using the same falsehood set as the basis for Queening and other questionable group activities, as Amayyzzzing has . . . then there can be no doubt that you are a PacQueen addicted to fantasy, fiction, fabrication, and - of course - running.





Yep, (according to PacQueens and Amayzzing) PacJuice can (just after not receiving a supposedly much needed injection) fight for 12 rounds in the world's biggest boxing fight, and against one of boxing best performers, all with a PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury
AND also (without drawing any suspicion to yourself) use the same PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury, as your PreFabricatedPacLossExcuse . . . . Due to all the reasons Amayzzing;


A) Stated.
B) But (surprise, surprise) is still consistently running from (even attempting to) meaningfully use his 10 years experience as a professional therapist to explain.

That's SaltWaterJesus my brothers !!!! Amen and hallelujah !!!!!! May you never have to explain yourself and the most obviously wild PacQueen claims. Finally, above I stated . . . .

""Aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below} . . . .""

Now, I appreciate this may - at first - appear harsh. But it's not really.

You see Amayzzing has a history of ensuring discussions (especially those pertaining to where he has been caught bullying, releasing false claims, and Queening) quickly disintegrate into his family circumstances; where he can garner sympathy and attention, and then utilize that for evasive means. And, of course misdirect. Perhaps, it's the donkey voodoo equivalent of galloping away whilst releasing obnoxious "I'm a DoubleWorldChampion & Will Prove It" gases. And the proof of that assessment is that Amayzzzing could easily wheel out his family matters for discussion whilst at the same time also - spending the 3 minutes it requires - directly addressing the outstanding issues upon which his PacLossExcuse theory and Queening activities rest. But that never happens. As the family matters almost always serve other purposes that are evidenced by Amayyyzzzing not being able to explain both himself and the basis for his PacLossExcuse religion/denial. So, these are interesting points for consideration. As is the fact that - whilst in full swing and attack last year with all the puppies in full tow - Amayyzzing displayed no such family related interest on his own behalf whilst he released concerning/questionable comments that paid no attention and indeed also directly disrespected the fact that some people here had family members that had died from diabetes and/or cancer. Clearly, "those" family matters were of no interest to, and/or served no purpose for, Amayzzzing. Now (with or without the PacLossExcuse phenomena that has clearly become the unexplainable and dubious religion that Amayyzzing has cornered himself with) that's certainly a strange set of, and simply duplicitous, principles for any PacQueen (seeking to convince us he's an adult and trustworthy) to possess . . .. Whether or not, he's moonlighting as a rotator cuff therapist with 10 years experience - that's also, at the same time, clearly taking all he can (in terms of advice and other favors) in the backroom from donkeys with a proven track record in reliability; whilst every single opportunity to explain himself and his claims is ignored and ran from.

Now, I wonder what could be the cause for such curious traits?

Could it be that Amayzzing suffers from fear of substantiation. Most pretenders do. Or, perhaps the cause for such curious (and Amayseng) traits is that the PacLossExcuse and its entire PacUnproven basis is as reliable as someone (say, perhaps someone like a PacEntourage) peddling watermelon seeds to ensure you (but not Pac with a shoulder injury when he needs them the most) punches faster? Or perhaps it's all of the above?

Ahh well . . . (even if Amayyzzzing and all other PacQueens are too afraid too) at least our good friend Superlight has stepped up to the plate - is unafraid of the truth - and has the stones to look at the MayPac video. Queens take note - that is how you do it. Not by running. Let's see if SuperLight can find any evidence of the mythical PacLossExcuse that supposedly supports all the claims Amayzzing and other Queens have made, Deeply invested in, but ran from when
substantiation comes knocking on the door.
Storm. :) :)


-King Beef :

Hey KB. How's things?
1) = Yes, agreed. But to be fair it's a slightly different point we are now discussing, and that point is captured below . . .

----------------------------------------------------------------------------- As stated in earlier posts . . . . .

""What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below"."

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, as you can see KB . . . And, if you will excuse the (perhaps apt) pun . . . it's all about getting the Queens to drop their skirts now and seeing whether they;


A) Are as worthy of the trust they (and all their PacLossExcuse
s) claim they are.
B) Have truly transitioned into adulthood as completely as they claim.

:) In summary . . . This thread has - (aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below}) as far as I am concerned - evolved into an opportunity for PacQueens to reveal their true substance and that of their cherished PacLossExcuse policies. Perhaps better put . . . . It's a great opportunity for (self confessed) therapists with 10 years experience (as Amayzzing claims he is) and (self confessed) adults (as Amayzzing claims he is) to stand up . . . After all the (years and years of) PacLossExcuse shenanigans, and openly explain - using the MayPac video (so it is real easy; just a few minutes) - precisely where all the PacLossExcuse incidents are of PacJuice fighting with hesitation/restriction, being debilitated, and favoring his injury . . . . . . . As Amayzzzing and the PacQueens claim.
Storm's way of thinking about all this is this . . . . . If there is one ounce (or even a tenth of an ounce) to the basis of all the PacLossExcuses and resulting Puppy and PacQueening behavior that we have all seen . . . and if we are really dealing with adults and professionals with 10 years experience (as Amayzzzing claims) that supposedly know injuries well . . . . Then, standing up, behaving as an adult, and meaningfully explaining both yourself and the PacLossExcuse theory with the MayPac video (without misdirecting and/or evading) should be easy and the least the Queens and professional therapists can do. Now, whilst that approach is good in theory it has a weakness, because it assumes that the widespread and rampant fear of
substantiation that Queens obviously experience can be controlled and/or suppressed for 3 minutes. And, as we all know a Queen would rather become intimate with a donkey and/or act as a damsel in distress and misdirect, as opposed to explaining the basis for their curious claims and questionable PacLossExcuse religion. So . . . . Unfortunately, to date (and please note that) this was predicted in my ""Calling all PacQueens and PacQueen sympathizers . . . "" post #36 . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101593&viewfull=1#post101593 And also other posts I have authored. .

Amayzzing has failed to even go close to the provided video to support his PacLossExcuse. And (aside from the fact that doing so would most likely expose the basis upon which his PacLossExcuse and all the interesting conduct that has flowed on from it rests - as well as revealing the true substance the PacQueen religion contains) I suspect that doing so would constitute yet another hilarious episode of him being caught out releasing questionable claims as a means of covering the same before them that both he and other Queens simply can't explain; but still invest in. Examples of such Amayzzzzing claims (that are released as a means of covering the same before them are) such as this (from this very thread) right here . . . . .



Now, aside from how thoroughly I have address Amayzzing's above post here in this below-linked post #35 of mine . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101559&viewfull=1#post101559

Which of course, has gone without answer from Amayyzzzing, as he enjoys the (neatly timed*) subject change to his family matter (more on *that later). There is also the fact that - even if we accept Amayyzzzing's therapeutical assessment of the situation and (what therefore constitutes his) latest clutch at straws to keep the PacLossExcuse dream alive . . . . Amayyzzzing still seems awfully scared of using the provided MayPac video (it's just here Amayzzzing, so you don't have to look too far) . . . . . .



To stand up like an adult and show us all where precisely it is that Pac throws . . . .



Due to the PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury that Amayzzing's 10 years as a professional therapist allows him to make judgment on. It's a shame Amayzzing is consistently running and unable to both stand up for the PacQueenMovement and explain himself, as . . . . Doing so would;


A) Not only, allow us all to understand how Amayzzzing assesses and invests in, truth and fiction.
B) But also, it would allow us all to have a better understanding of the basis upon which his above-mentioned PacLossExcuse therapeutical assessment and latest theory has been formed.

Ah, well, at least it provides insight into why Brother Voodoo and him have such a great relationship. Anyway, with all that said, and despite how cherished the PacLossExcuse is to Amayyzzing - how suspicious (for a therapist with 10 years experience) his obviously (caterpillar belly) low tolerances are for both, unexplainable claims and also those that pretend are - and despite how easy it is for him (or any fully blown Queen) to step us all through the above MayPac video and show us all where all evidence (notice I am not even asking for proof at this stage) is that supports their lucid dreams in relation to the PacLossExcuse . . . . All that our resident rotator cuff therapist has done to date is . . . . . Nothing; other than run and evade. To be fair though . . . Amayzzing's probably got an excuse for this too. . . . . He probably - with his busy rotator cuff therapy practice (that accepts and acts upon unproven diagnoses from unqualified voodoo donkeys) - can't find the 3 minutes within his busy schedule (of posting 10 minute long excuses) that's required to go through round 4 and substantiate precisely where the evidence is that supports his (years and years of) PacQueen claims. Interesting it is eh? However, (and rather curiously) Amayyzzzzing can - and rather conveniently I might add - take the time introduce;


A) Another theory, that (in the bowels of his rotator cuff surgery's practice and no doubt with consultant donkey present providing advice on how to escape substantiation) appears, at least on face value, to be able to keep the wolves from the door and "blow" new life into donkeys' dream of a . . . . .

PacLossExcuse that can never be answered or questioned and one that completely shelters the entire PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury debacle from the truth.


B) Another pensive family discussion point that ensures anyone expecting him to stand up as an adult and explain his PacLossExcuse with the video provided, feels a little hesitance for doing so and/or at least expecting him to without (at least) buying into his latest example of family discussion; whereby he can then utilize this "buy in" for sympathy and/or diversionary (away from explaining) purposes.

For those that don't already know . . . . This (continual running and inability to explain - even the most outrageous and denial riddled claims - whilst always releasing a succession of equally dubious and laughable claims as a means to buy time and misdirect, combined with all the other PacLossExcuse related conduct that Amayzzing and other PacQueens exhibit) is called or . And it's;


A) Not only, proof that Amayzzing is one of the greatest PacQueens of them all.
A) But also, it's why/how I justify using such terms.

After all, when;


(i) One subscribes to what is obviously a stupendous lie (that's as completely unproven and indefensible as Amayzzing has shown {by always running and evading} his PacLossExcuse and other associated claims to be) for more than a year.
(ii) And when one, at the same time, also loves using the same falsehood set as the basis for Queening and other questionable group activities, as Amayyzzzing has . . . then there can be no doubt that you are a PacQueen addicted to fantasy, fiction, fabrication, and - of course - running.





Yep, (according to PacQueens and Amayzzing) PacJuice can (just after not receiving a supposedly much needed injection) fight for 12 rounds in the world's biggest boxing fight, and against one of boxing best performers, all with a PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury
AND also (without drawing any suspicion to yourself) use the same PacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjury, as your PreFabricatedPacLossExcuse . . . . Due to all the reasons Amayzzing;


A) Stated.
B) But (surprise, surprise) is still consistently running from (even attempting to) meaningfully use his 10 years experience as a professional therapist to explain.

That's SaltWaterJesus my brothers !!!! Amen and hallelujah !!!!!! May you never have to explain yourself and the most obviously wild PacQueen claims. Finally, above I stated . . . .

""Aside from Amayzzzing's attempts to evade and divert away from the real matters at hand by talking about his family/personal issues and using them as his "ace up his sleeve" to misdirect away from his inability to explain {*more on this below} . . . .""

Now, I appreciate this may - at first - appear harsh. But it's not really.

You see Amayzzing has a history of ensuring discussions (especially those pertaining to where he has been caught bullying, releasing false claims, and Queening) quickly disintegrate into his family circumstances; where he can garner sympathy and attention, and then utilize that for evasive means. And, of course misdirect. Perhaps, it's the donkey voodoo equivalent of galloping away whilst releasing obnoxious "I'm a DoubleWorldChampion & Will Prove It" gases. And the proof of that assessment is that Amayzzzing could easily wheel out his family matters for discussion whilst at the same time also - spending the 3 minutes it requires - directly addressing the outstanding issues upon which his PacLossExcuse theory and Queening activities rest. But that never happens. As the family matters almost always serve other purposes that are evidenced by Amayyyzzzing not being able to explain both himself and the basis for his PacLossExcuse religion/denial. So, these are interesting points for consideration. As is the fact that - whilst in full swing and attack last year with all the puppies in full tow - Amayyzzing displayed no such family related interest on his own behalf whilst he released concerning/questionable comments that paid no attention and indeed also directly disrespected the fact that some people here had family members that had died from diabetes and/or cancer. Clearly, "those" family matters were of no interest to, and/or served no purpose for, Amayzzzing. Now (with or without the PacLossExcuse phenomena that has clearly become the unexplainable and dubious religion that Amayyzzing has cornered himself with) that's certainly a strange set of, and simply duplicitous, principles for any PacQueen (seeking to convince us he's an adult and trustworthy) to possess . . .. Whether or not, he's moonlighting as a rotator cuff therapist with 10 years experience - that's also, at the same time, clearly taking all he can (in terms of advice and other favors) in the backroom from donkeys with a proven track record in reliability; whilst every single opportunity to explain himself and his claims is ignored and ran from.

Now, I wonder what could be the cause for such curious traits?

Could it be that Amayzzing suffers from fear of substantiation. Most pretenders do. Or, perhaps the cause for such curious (and Amayseng) traits is that the PacLossExcuse and its entire PacUnproven basis is as reliable as someone (say, perhaps someone like a PacEntourage) peddling watermelon seeds to ensure you (but not Pac with a shoulder injury when he needs them the most) punches faster? Or perhaps it's all of the above?

Ahh well . . . (even if Amayyzzzing and all other PacQueens are too afraid too) at least our good friend Superlight has stepped up to the plate - is unafraid of the truth - and has the stones to look at the MayPac video. Queens take note - that is how you do it. Not by running. Let's see if SuperLight can find any evidence of the mythical PacLossExcuse that supposedly supports all the claims Amayzzing and other Queens have made, Deeply invested in, but ran from when
substantiation comes knocking on the door.
Storm. :) :)
Everything is good my friend, and you know whether it is Mayweather fans or Pac fans, either side is going to defend their position to the end. Pac vs Mayweather debates reminds me very much of the same back and forth of people heavy into politics. To me there has been some brow raising actions from both for some time. I think both May and Pac have taken certain liberties that come with the status they have attained. I have to admit the IV thing had me raising a eyebrow, and the players involved and circumstances didn't do much to clear it up. As far as the Pac shoulder injury....same thing. Re-watching the fight, I was looking for a cringe, a stop hitch, rubbing of the shoulder in the corner or something; but I didn't notice anything. ( I could be wrong, but I don't think any of that would have effected the outcome of that fight when Mayweather is the better technical boxer and you couple that with his advantages) Either way what's done is done. Now Storm, how do you feel about Ward vs Kovalev, Pac vs. Vargas


-deepwater2 :

PAC never had elevated labs, never used the 750ml saline, if he did then I might say it looks like he could be dirty. PAC came to fight and Floyd did enough to stifle him. Most non boxing people thought PAC did enough to win since he looked like he was making the fight. The most you can say about PAC is that he refused Floyd's demands on testing. If a man has the position of power during negotiations he uses that power to decline all requests. PAC had to take the test after he lost his negotiating leverage. It is what it is.


-stormcentre :

Everything is good my friend, and you know whether it is Mayweather fans or Pac fans, either side is going to defend their position to the end. Pac vs Mayweather debates reminds me very much of the same back and forth of people heavy into politics. To me there has been some brow raising actions from both for some time. I think both May and Pac have taken certain liberties that come with the status they have attained. I have to admit the IV thing had me raising a eyebrow, and the players involved and circumstances didn't do much to clear it up. As far as the Pac shoulder injury....same thing. Re-watching the fight, I was looking for a cringe, a stop hitch, rubbing of the shoulder in the corner or something; but I didn't notice anything. ( I could be wrong, but I don't think any of that would have effected the outcome of that fight when Mayweather is the better technical boxer and you couple that with his advantages) Either way what's done is done. Now Storm, how do you feel about Ward vs Kovalev, Pac vs. Vargas
Hey KB. Yes, without doubt both guys have suspicions surrounding them. The IV drip is a suspicious but (as Pac's agreement to that specific clause testifies) they're not entirely uncommon in boxing; as (to name a few) Oscar, Hopkins, Jones, Floyd, Pac and a few others have used them. Had Floyd's team not called in the officials in relation to it, and had Floyd not possessed a TUE, that suspicion on my part would be greatly elevated. That said - and as I have said before (and this is what differentiates between whether Queens can openly discuss Pac and Floyd, as to myself) - you would be pretty na?ve to put your hand on your heart and say Floyd (or Pac) have never doped. Pac's exploits in the area are quite a lot more obvious though. And that's exacerbated by the PacQueen brigade's complete unwillingness to go near a discussion about them whilst continually releasing more and more hilarious, untrue, (see my responses to Amayzzing, Random, and Deep) and diversionary claims. I think all the PacQueens laid down so many extreme pre/post MayPac claims, humped each others leg stupid over them, and also displayed so much questionable behavior, that fear of
substantiation is here to stay for them. I mean . . . . that MayPac video I posted sure is lonely. :) Pac (particularly without PEDs/dope) could never beat Floyd. Pac (fully PED/doped) could probably - in the Money May part of Floyd's career - push him hard, maybe even (possibly then depending on whether Floyd doped) win. Not many boxers can run and/or stay with a fully doped PacJuice for 12 rounds. Especially if they are contracted at catch-weight, as most of Pac's big wins were.
Kovalev V Ward; I think Ward, but I need a little more time to look at the bigger picture.
Vargas V Pac; If Pac is fully EPO'd up, and shed the ring rust, he will probably roll over Vargas. Not sure how to work out if Pac has truly shed the ring rust though, as nothing that comes out of the PacRoach camp is believable. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

PAC never had elevated labs, never used the 750ml saline, if he did then I might say it looks like he could be dirty. 1) PAC came to fight and Floyd did enough to stifle him. 2) Most non boxing people thought PAC did enough to win since he looked like he was making the fight. 3) The most you can say about PAC is that he refused Floyd's demands on testing. 4) If a man has the position of power during negotiations he uses that power to decline all requests. PAC had to take the test after he lost his negotiating leverage. It is what it is.
Dear me. Aside from (as with all the other PacQueens) avoiding the MayPac video to show us where this injury (deemed worthy of a PacLossExcuse) is . . . . . You must be desperate
Deep. Getting Queens to locate and identify - within the MayPac video - their cherished PacLossExcuse is starting to take on a Loch Nest Monster and/or Lost Mermaid of Atlantis feel to it. Many folk (whom benefit from keeping the dream alive) say it's there - but no-one can overcome their fear (in a boxing forum?) to bring themselves to
substantiate it. Love it !!!!! OK, lets look into
Deep's latest round of Queening, questionable, and diversionary claims . . . .


1) Floyd won on points and gave a clinic on how to close down Pac. The worst Floyd did was fight overly cautious, move a lot, and box in a non entertaining manner, but this actually made it all the more easy for Pac to win.

Pac failed - enormously - to live up to what he and PacRoach claimed they would do. Pac Failed to cut the ring off. Pac landed very few punches of note. At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent power punches on Floyd in round 4; which is probably one reason why Amayyzzzing can't back up his latest excuse that serves as the reason why he can't back up his PacLossExcuse. Floyd - pretty much - whilst operating (as proven by PacQueen's ridicule) at a far lower level of technical superiority and activity than he usually does - still managed to close Pac down and beat him. This was mostly done by Floyd taking away Pac's predictable - lean to left - throw the right cross through the centerline - then step around to your opponent's right side - make him reset - and hit him as he does. Floyd did all this with one or two easy moves that involved sliding to the left and/or becoming extremely side-on (whilst holding a defensive guard) as Pac starts to attempt the above maneuver.

Once Floyd did this Pac failed to adjust. Pac could not cut the ring off. Pac could not adjust. Pac was uncomfortable when matched in speed. Pac was uncomfortable with an opponent with a defence. Pac was unable to genuinely create openings and gather points with an opponent whom was;


(i) A skilled boxer.
(ii) Able to control distance.
(iii) Not compromised by catch-weight clauses.
(iv) As fast as Pac.
(v) That knew all aspects of boxing.
(vi) As strong as Pac.






2) This means nothing, as most savvy spectators, experienced boxers, almost all commentators, those in the industry, and all the judges on the night, all thought (correctly that) Floyd won.

What does it mean that most non-boxing people whom don't really know boxing thought Floyd lost? Many PacQueens also are clearly in denial, they can't even begin to explain their claims, and they think the same too. Perhaps there's some (non-boxing knowledge) commonality there.


3) Wrong. That is not the most you can say. Yes Pac refused previous testing with an extremely concerning excuse. But (as per all the PacJuice questions that Queens ignore and run from) you can also say the following;


a) Pac defrauded the NSAC in search of an injection (just hours before the fight) for an undisclosed injury that all PacQueens claim exist - but are too scared to show us (in the MayPac video) where.
b) Pac and Roach worked together to conspire and conceal Pac's alleged injury; why?
c) The above and other considerations amounted to such a fraud that Pac was sued by multiple entities; a first for a fighter?
d) Pac's team is also the first I have ever heard (in boxing) that sacked the strength and endurance coach for providing consumables that he would define to Pac; this is confirmed by Roach announcing it in the presence of Arum and Pac. Another example (just like the PreFabricatedPacLossExcuseInjury) of PacRoach possibly setting up a ready made excuse for throwing a positive test? Who knows?
e) Pac - during his defamation writ against Floyd - failed to produce his own retrograde testing results; extremely suspicious and one of the reasons why no publicly available results exist for Pac.
f) Pac's miraculous performance - in terms of power, speed, intensity, recovery, and *stamina - throughout all the weights he has been successful in (even in the context of the *individual attributes) far outstrips other fighters known to dope. If this is not suspicious then explain how a Tour De France Pelaton rider would be able to keep up with Lance Armstrong, if he were not doping.
g)
PacKeepPacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjurySecret; If Manny really had the Toradol injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight, as he claimed - then why did he only announce it just hours before the MayPac fight, and in doing so defraud the NSAC in paperwork/writing in relation to it? Why not just announce beforehand that you have an injury?
h)
PacFail2Apply4TUEButStillClaimInjury; If Manny really had a legitimate and injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight - then why didn't PacRoach (in relation to that supposed injection requiring injury) simply apply for a TUE beforehand (as Floyd did); and then, later, openly announce any injection/IV related procedure pertaining to it, when/after that procedure was actually performed? Just as Floyd did with the IV when he called the testing officials in?
i) Pac rehabilitate his fraud related, non disclosed, and PacLossExcuse injury in a manner that anointed him as SaltWaterJesus. What serious rotator cuff injuries (that are not used as an excuse for injections, masking and/or other agents) that also form an excuse for competitive losses in the world's biggest boxing fight can be rehabilitated like this?


4) Not sure what to make of this comment of yours, as it pretty much assists my argument in that Pac (for all his fights prior to MayPac) refused and/or didn't want to take stringent tests due to his doping interests - but was unable to (as he usually and/or otherwise did) avoid truly stringent testing in the lead up to the MayPac fight.

From there we saw Pac coming to the fight without a lot of energy and with a PreFabricated&UnprovenSaltWaterJesusPacLossExcuse. Furthermore, Pac - as the "A" side - throughout his career significantly (and dangerously) used his position of power during negotiations to marginalize other fighters in a catch-weight and other context. So, whilst Floyd uses his position as the "A" side in negotiations (not nearly as much as Pac in a catch-weight context though) so does Pac.



So, there you go . . . Yet another stream of questionable and diversionary claims from Queens that overlook many facts and considerations to create a false narrative, whilst - at the same time - the MayPac video (the one mechanism that surely has the best chances of substantiating PacQueen claims and revealing also where/how Pac fought with his supposed injury) still remains awfully lonely and without any attention. So
Deep. . . . I have played your little game. Are you ready to help your Queening mate Amayyzzzing out with his professional (10 year experienced) therapeutical assessment of Pac's round 4; now
Deep?
If so, then please step us through the MayPac video and show us where Amayzzing's PacLossExcuse comments hold true and also where Pac sustains and/or substantiates his PacLossExcuse injury. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)
PS: By the way. . . . . Just as a special treat . . . . Should all Queens opt to consistently run from (easily) proving their PacLossExcuse case with the MayPac video and in doing so prove to us all that fear of
substantiation exists and is rampant amongst the PacQueenMovement and those that got their MayPac prediction wrong . . . . I have a professional injury investigator ready whom - like our Queen Amayzzzing has at least 10 years experience in his field (actually it's 18 years) - delivers written reports on a weekly basis to the courts on injuries for a living. He is an expert witness whom has communicated, collaborated, and worked with many professional doctors and therapists, and he has also seen thousands of rotator cuff injuries As a side note, he is also a qualified lawyer. He is not into boxing and he finds this thread interesting and funny, and has agreed to write a report on round 4, and possibly others. Just to prepare you for that, in the relevant industry the acronym NUM = normally unrestricted movement. NUM of a serious injury does not usually happen vigorously and in succession (especially within a condensed timeframe of less than 12 hours) unless that injury is not serious. But then, Amayyzzzing - as a professional therapist afraid of reviewing the MayPac video and supporting his claims - would know all this. As the (personal injury and liability) insurance industry provides most therapists with at least some work during their career.


-stormcentre :

PAC never had elevated labs, never used the 750ml saline, if he did then I might say it looks like he could be dirty. 1) PAC came to fight and Floyd did enough to stifle him. 2) Most non boxing people thought PAC did enough to win since he looked like he was making the fight. 3) The most you can say about PAC is that he refused Floyd's demands on testing. 4) If a man has the position of power during negotiations he uses that power to decline all requests. PAC had to take the test after he lost his negotiating leverage. It is what it is.
Dear me. Aside from (as with all the other PacQueens) avoiding the MayPac video to show us where this injury (deemed worthy of a PacLossExcuse) is . . . . . You must be desperate
Deep. Getting Queens to locate and identify - within the MayPac video - their cherished PacLossExcuse is starting to take on a Loch Nest Monster and/or Lost Mermaid of Atlantis feel to it. Many folk (whom benefit from keeping the dream alive) say it's there - but no-one can overcome their fear (in a boxing forum?) to bring themselves to
substantiate it. Love it !!!!! OK, lets look into
Deep's latest round of Queening, questionable, and diversionary claims . . . .


1) Floyd won on points and gave a clinic on how to close down Pac. The worst Floyd did was fight overly cautious, move a lot, and box in a non entertaining manner, but this actually made it all the more easy for Pac to win.

Pac failed - enormously - to live up to what he and PacRoach claimed they would do. Pac Failed to cut the ring off. Pac landed very few punches of note. At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent power punches on Floyd in round 4; which is probably one reason why Amayyzzzing can't back up his latest excuse that serves as the reason why he can't back up his PacLossExcuse. Floyd - pretty much - whilst operating (as proven by PacQueen's ridicule) at a far lower level of technical superiority and activity than he usually does - still managed to close Pac down and beat him. This was mostly done by Floyd taking away Pac's predictable - lean to left - throw the right cross through the centerline - then step around to your opponent's right side - make him reset - and hit him as he does. Floyd did all this with one or two easy moves that involved sliding to the left and/or becoming extremely side-on (whilst holding a defensive guard) as Pac starts to attempt the above maneuver.

Once Floyd did this Pac failed to adjust. Pac could not cut the ring off. Pac could not adjust. Pac was uncomfortable when matched in speed. Pac was uncomfortable with an opponent with a defence. Pac was unable to genuinely create openings and gather points with an opponent whom was;


(i) A skilled boxer.
(ii) Able to control distance.
(iii) Not compromised by catch-weight clauses.
(iv) As fast as Pac.
(v) That knew all aspects of boxing.
(vi) As strong as Pac.






2) This means nothing, as most savvy spectators, experienced boxers, almost all commentators, those in the industry, and all the judges on the night, all thought (correctly that) Floyd won.

What does it mean that most non-boxing people whom don't really know boxing thought Floyd lost? Many PacQueens also are clearly in denial, they can't even begin to explain their claims, and they think the same too. Perhaps there's some (non-boxing knowledge) commonality there.


3) Wrong. That is not the most you can say. Yes Pac refused previous testing with an extremely concerning excuse. But (as per all the PacJuice questions that Queens ignore and run from) you can also say the following;


a) Pac defrauded the NSAC in search of an injection (just hours before the fight) for an undisclosed injury that all PacQueens claim exist - but are too scared to show us (in the MayPac video) where.
b) Pac and Roach worked together to conspire and conceal Pac's alleged injury; why?
c) The above and other considerations amounted to such a fraud that Pac was sued by multiple entities; a first for a fighter?
d) Pac's team is also the first I have ever heard (in boxing) that sacked the strength and endurance coach for providing consumables that he would define to Pac; this is confirmed by Roach announcing it in the presence of Arum and Pac. Another example (just like the PreFabricatedPacLossExcuseInjury) of PacRoach possibly setting up a ready made excuse for throwing a positive test? Who knows?
e) Pac - during his defamation writ against Floyd - failed to produce his own retrograde testing results; extremely suspicious and one of the reasons why no publicly available results exist for Pac.
f) Pac's miraculous performance - in terms of power, speed, intensity, recovery, and *stamina - throughout all the weights he has been successful in (even in the context of the *individual attributes) far outstrips other fighters known to dope. If this is not suspicious then explain how a Tour De France Pelaton rider would be able to keep up with Lance Armstrong, if he were not doping.
g)
PacKeepPacLossExcuseInjectionRequiringInjurySecret; If Manny really had the Toradol injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight, as he claimed - then why did he only announce it just hours before the MayPac fight, and in doing so defraud the NSAC in paperwork/writing in relation to it? Why not just announce beforehand that you have an injury?
h)
PacFail2Apply4TUEButStillClaimInjury; If Manny really had a legitimate and injection requiring injury beforehand to the MayPac fight - then why didn't PacRoach (in relation to that supposed injection requiring injury) simply apply for a TUE beforehand (as Floyd did); and then, later, openly announce any injection/IV related procedure pertaining to it, when/after that procedure was actually performed? Just as Floyd did with the IV when he called the testing officials in?
i) Pac rehabilitate his fraud related, non disclosed, and PacLossExcuse injury in a manner that anointed him as SaltWaterJesus. What serious rotator cuff injuries (that are not used as an excuse for injections, masking and/or other agents) that also form an excuse for competitive losses in the world's biggest boxing fight can be rehabilitated like this?


4) Not sure what to make of this comment of yours, as it pretty much assists my argument in that Pac (for all his fights prior to MayPac) refused and/or didn't want to take stringent tests due to his doping interests - but was unable to (as he usually and/or otherwise did) avoid truly stringent testing in the lead up to the MayPac fight.

From there we saw Pac coming to the fight without a lot of energy and with a PreFabricated&UnprovenSaltWaterJesusPacLossExcuse. Furthermore, Pac - as the "A" side - throughout his career significantly (and dangerously) used his position of power during negotiations to marginalize other fighters in a catch-weight and other context. So, whilst Floyd uses his position as the "A" side in negotiations (not nearly as much as Pac in a catch-weight context though) so does Pac.



So, there you go . . . Yet another stream of questionable and diversionary claims from Queens that overlook many facts and considerations to create a false narrative, whilst - at the same time - the MayPac video (the one mechanism that surely has the best chances of substantiating PacQueen claims and revealing also where/how Pac fought with his supposed injury) still remains awfully lonely and without any attention. So
Deep. . . . I have played your little game. Are you ready to help your Queening mate Amayyzzzing out with his professional (10 year experienced) therapeutical assessment of Pac's round 4; now
Deep?
If so, then please step us through the MayPac video and show us where Amayzzing's PacLossExcuse comments hold true and also where Pac sustains and/or substantiates his PacLossExcuse injury. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)
PS: By the way. . . . . Just as a special treat . . . . Should all Queens opt to consistently run from (easily) proving their PacLossExcuse case with the MayPac video and in doing so prove to us all that fear of
substantiation exists and is rampant amongst the PacQueenMovement and those that got their MayPac prediction wrong . . . . I have a professional injury investigator ready whom - like our Queen Amayzzzing has at least 10 years experience in his field (actually it's 18 years) - delivers written reports on a weekly basis to the courts on injuries for a living. He is an expert witness whom has communicated, collaborated, and worked with many professional doctors and therapists, and he has also seen thousands of rotator cuff injuries As a side note, he is also a qualified lawyer. He is not into boxing and he finds this thread interesting and funny, and has agreed to write a report on round 4, and possibly others. Just to prepare you for that, in the relevant industry the acronym NUM = normally unrestricted movement. NUM of a serious injury does not usually happen vigorously and in succession (especially within a condensed timeframe of less than 12 hours) unless that injury is not serious. But then, Amayyzzzing - as a professional therapist afraid of reviewing the MayPac video and supporting his claims - would know all this. As the (personal injury and liability) insurance industry provides most therapists with at least some work during their career.


-amayseng :

My contention is that in round 4 Pac hurt his shoulder or rehurt it. Not hard to understand. In the video below there is stop capture to show landed punches, round 4 sure shows a lot for Pac. My eyes are phenomenal, just ask the 95mph fastball i hit 470' at age 23 so I pick up more visually than the average person who may nees this video. Either way i dont give a **** about this Pac May argument that never ends or the cyber bully who name calls on here like the POS he is. So thro a message to me informing me this POS wont stop, [as i refuse to read anything by him or respond to him] i am posting it for a buddy on here for this said worthless POS who tries to bully like the pathetic weakling he is. What a pathetic waste.
->https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fcc9_cqy2l8&feature=youtu.be


-Radam G :

My contention is that in round 4 Pac hurt his shoulder or rehurt it. Not hard to understand. In the video below there is stop capture to show landed punches, round 4 sure shows a lot for Pac. My eyes are phenomenal, just ask the 95mph fastball i hit 470' at age 23 so I pick up more visually than the average person who may nees this video. Either way i dont give a **** about this Pac May argument that never ends or the cyber bully who name calls on here like the POS he is. So thro a message to me informing me this POS wont stop, [as i refuse to read anything by him or respond to him] i am posting it for a buddy on here for this said worthless POS who tries to bully like the pathetic weakling he is. What a pathetic waste.
->https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fcc9_cqy2l8&feature=youtu.be
There is no doubt that Da Manny had a bum shoulder. Money May has even said that he knew about it from the jump. And he knew that Da Manny didn't spar for three weeks before the MayPac Farce because of it. Of course, none of Money May's nut sack riders heard him say that. But the whole world can hear him brag about it on Floydhype -- I mean Fighthype. Holla!


-stormcentre :

Does this mean you still will be unable to prove any of your claims? Including those related to the 122 clinches? What about the MayPac video and your reputation for not being able to be trusted on anything, including Floyd or Pac? Does your post mean anything in the context of changing that?
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

There is no doubt that Da Manny had a bum shoulder. Money May has even said that he knew about it from the jump. And he knew that Da Manny didn't spar for three weeks before the MayPac Farce because of it. Of course, none of Money May's nut sack riders heard him say that. But the whole world can hear him brag about it on Floydhype -- I mean Fighthype. Holla!
Does this mean you still will be unable to prove any of your claims? Including those related to the 122 clinches? What about the MayPac video and your reputation for not being able to be trusted on anything, including Floyd or Pac? Does your post mean anything in the context of changing that? Remember, I am offering all you Queens $500 to prove you're telling the truth. Don't be afraid of the truth Brother Voodoo.
Storm. :) :)


-amayseng :

There is no doubt that Da Manny had a bum shoulder. Money May has even said that he knew about it from the jump. And he knew that Da Manny didn't spar for three weeks before the MayPac Farce because of it. Of course, none of Money May's nut sack riders heard him say that. But the whole world can hear him brag about it on Floydhype -- I mean Fighthype. Holla!
Yep. It is what it is and it is disturbing I am told a grown man is STILL on here calling other adult men degrading names. A dude is this pathetic, u cant make things up. U have to have lost at life to act this way. Pac should fight Garcia and Floyd could come back against Thurman. Same ppv for 100$. I would be game for that.


-stormcentre :

My contention is that in round 4 Pac hurt his shoulder or rehurt it. *Not hard to understand. In the video below there is stop capture to show landed punches, round 4 sure shows a lot for Pac. My eyes are phenomenal, just ask the 95mph fastball i hit 470' at age 23 so I pick up more visually than the average person who may nees this video. Either way i dont give a **** about this Pac May argument that never ends or the cyber bully who name calls on here like the he is. So thro a message to me informing me this wont stop, [as i refuse to read anything by him or respond to him] i am posting it for a buddy on here for this said who tries to bully like the he is. What a pathetic waste.
->https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fcc9_cqy2l8&feature=youtu.be
Hey, with all that you're hurting my feelings. It's OK, I know you don't mean it. I know for you, your half hearted explanations might seem like they're *not hard to understand; but (even at first glance it's obvious that) they're really just - yet more - false PacQueen narratives designed to conceal your never ending inability to tell the truth and explain. You see, the matter in hand is (not as you misinterpret for the purpose of evasion, but) how much difficulty Queens have;


A) Meaningfully and truthfully discussing Pac's suspicious exploits.
B) Pointing to where in the fight it was that Pac fought in the manner they (including you; remember your claim about round 4?) claim and/or where PacJuice sustained/
substantiated the mysterious PacLossExcuse injury.

So, what we have from you (a 10 year professional therapist) is yet more false narratives, excuses, and diversions. Surprise, surprise. OK, let's move on . . . to your real problems, and give you a real therapy (and history) lesson . . . . Listen up Queen. Here's some tissues for all those tears . . . .
Yes, it's all a little bit different now isn't it my little ray of Amayzzzing (and crying?) sunshine? Last year (when you thought you had the numbers), bullying was then in, tribal activities were also green lighted, and the truth was pushed aside (as if it were a donkey's tail) to make way for an assortment of wild, hypocritical, and laughable claims; some of those claims formed the basis of your attacks and you're still running from them now. And, as if that's not enough both you and your PuppyPacQueen brigade were almost (but only as a group) fearless and without concern for the basis of many wild donkey claims that appeared to underpin all your questionable conduct. You were big time then (with all the puppies in tow) eh? I remember your smart and incisive comments. As many of them are the same ones that you're running from, and reaching for the tissue box with, now. And, truth be told, you're not even under 50% of the pressure I could bring here in this forum and still do so without losing the element of humor that's always associated with slapping you Queens around; whether it be individually or collectively. Paybacks are a real bytch aren't they professional therapist? It's OK, most bullies and pretenders don't like them. Hey, I know. How about you run to donkey, make a call to arms, and get him to help you. :) Or, perhaps another well timed and sad family story? Yes, we certainly sing (squeal?) a different tune when placed under a small amount of that same pressure that you freely handed out previously to others, don't we Queen? What's a matter Amayzzing? Don't you like what you dish out? With all your stories about how you're afraid of no man (that sometimes associated what you were going to do to me), I would have thought you a little more resilient and tougher than this? You give in so easily. What a surprise. All we are doing here is asking you explain the basis of all your Queening and bullying? Nothing more? Oh, that and highlighting how you are almost completely unable to do it nearly half as well as you can create excuses for doing so. Queen, may I suggest that if you cant handle what you dish out and if the truth is uncomfortable for you Amayzzzing, you can always stop lying and running. May I also suggest that if you're an adult (and not a fake one) you could also - conversely - step up to the plate and show us all where precisely in the MayPac video the origin of your PacLossExcuse claims are. None of this (fake adult?) stuff like that you have been wheeling out lately . . .

""Oh I think this is what happened and/or I really feel Pac hurt his shoulder . . but {despite the fact that this claim of mine forms the basis of much of my wild claims and previous bullying} I cant even begin to prove it because {I'm scared and} it doesn't suit me"".

Look, (and I know this will be hard) remember also too . . . You can always try to think about whom you decide to make enemies with; as you conduct yourself as above-mentioned. That may save some tears. Sometimes (and this applies even if the stupidity I refer to was not executed by someone like you whom doesn't exactly walk along without leaving any poodle poos and smelly questions behind them) a bit of forethought on these things goes a long way. Especially with someone like you, whom clearly can't handle the taste of her own medicine. :) So . . . Let this be a lesson to you Queen. Try and learn from it in a way most pretenders and bullies don't. If you really cant help but release false and fictitious claims to make yourself feel good - and if you really can't help but lie about whose posts you read and respond to - and if you really can't help but run from explaining all your incredible claims - and if doing all that feels so good for you that you forget your own previous actions and what little common sense you have - to such an extent that you then cant help but to throw yourself into a good old PuppyPacQueen bullying session (that you may regret later; like now). . . . . Perhaps it's time to start revising whom you call out and perhaps it's also time to start thinking (rather than acting) in advance. Who knows? Perhaps it's also time to be careful. Because some day it all may just come back and bite you on that Queening azz of yours that both, you speak out of and donkey loves so much. Now finally, 2 things . . .


1) In relation to all your previous claims that inferred and/or directly stated you would physically hurt me if we were ever in close proximity to you. Should you ever grow the stones to (explain your own claims with provided video, let alone) meet me at any of the gyms I visit in the USA (including those I have previously advised you of when you made such comments) you can expect, at least, a similar experience to how easily I have run rings around you (and all your puppies) here. Learn from this experience Queen. Make a change.
2) Remember last year? When you (amongst all the other false claims you released for purposes of continuing your bullying) made several derogatory comments, including suggesting I was lying, about me in relation to Fox and website I was working on? Well (and I appreciate that right now as you {a fully blow PacQueen whose transitional activities have clearly not hormonally progressed as well as expected and planned} run from explaining your 10-year-professional self with the provided MayPac video, that it is probably not the best time to expect you to prove yourself wrong with another exploit) please feel free to PM me about this so I can provide you with the URL for that website {you inferred/claimed didn't exist} wont you?

Oh, I almost forgot. Glad to hear about your fastball exploits. Now if only you could use the same motivation (to change subject and evade) to go near that MayPac video and explain yourself and
substantiate. Remember, I have $500 if Queens can. So, that clearly applies to you. Lots of love,
Storm. :) :)


-amayseng :

There is no doubt that Da Manny had a bum shoulder. Money May has even said that he knew about it from the jump. And he knew that Da Manny didn't spar for three weeks before the MayPac Farce because of it. Of course, none of Money May's nut sack riders heard him say that. But the whole world can hear him brag about it on Floydhype -- I mean Fighthype. Holla!
yep people become sheep and their very minds close. **** that vid wont wont lets try this one
->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcC9_cqy2L8


-stormcentre :

Yep they sure do become
predictable sheep don't they Amayyzzzing? So . . . Getting back to the matter at hand . . . Does this means you will be unable to prove any of your claims? And, Amayzzzing . . does it mean you have (desperately) changed subject again? This time to a video (that's off subject, misdirects, and one) that (laughably) claims Pac won? Which, therefore means you "still" can't *show us where it is within the MayPac fight video I provided that it is that Pac supposedly sustained his PacLossExcuse injury; as you claim? Which, (in association with how difficult it was to get Queens to stay on subject {a point your last post proves} and/or meaningfully discuss and/or prove their PacLossExcuse point {another point set your last post proves}) was what the *subject at hand was about. Wow, after all this time, and the opportunity (from my last post) given to you to learn from; Queening - for you - is still the preferred option. Geez . . . You just cant pay these Queens ($500) to (even try to) prove their point and not; run, change subject, evade, and misdirect. Still love the
predictability of it all though. As, there was no way this fully blown Queen was ever going to step up to the plate, fear no challenge, and show us where the basis of his claims exist. Pac's shoulder injury must sure be real special. As no Queen that believes in both it and how it forms a PacLossExcuse can actually point to where (within the MayPac fight) it is and/or where it has effect. When I say "no Queen" . . . I mean, unless, of course, you are Amayzzing and/or place faith in his new diversionary video. As then, in that case, Pac's PacLossExcuseInjury is not a PacLossExcuse; cause (laughably) Pac then won. Talk about hedging your bets with multiple unproven and laughable claims; as a means of concealing your inability to justify your belief in Voodoo. This is taking Queening to whole new level. Hey Amayzzzing . . . . Any chance you can show us where (even in your own very special PacQueen video of Pac supposedly beating Floyd) Pac actually sustains his injury and round 4; as you claim? Or are you incapable of proving your point with even your very own hand picked PacPretend fantasy video? My bet is the answer is yes. Donkey (even if he is not behind suggesting the video to sooth your troubled little truth rejecting soul) will love you for bringing out this evasive and misdirecting stunt. Genius move from a fast learner. You two are made for each other. Love it !!!
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Yep they sure do become
predictable sheep don't they Amayyzzzing? So . . . Getting back to the matter at hand . . . Does this means you will be unable to prove any of your claims? And, Amayzzzing . . does it mean you have (desperately) changed subject again? This time to a video (that's off subject, misdirects, and one) that (laughably) claims Pac won? Which, therefore means you "still" can't *show us where it is within the MayPac fight video I provided that it is that Pac supposedly sustained his PacLossExcuse injury; as you claim? Which, (in association with how difficult it was to get Queens to stay on subject {a point your last post proves} and/or meaningfully discuss and/or prove their PacLossExcuse point {another point set your last post proves}) was what the *subject at hand was about. Wow, after all this time, and the opportunity (from my last post) given to you to learn from; Queening - for you - is still the preferred option. Geez . . . You just cant pay these Queens ($500) to (even try to) prove their point and not; run, change subject, evade, and misdirect. Still love the
predictability of it all though. As, there was no way this fully blown Queen was ever going to step up to the plate, fear no challenge, and show us where the basis of his claims exist. Pac's shoulder injury must sure be real special. As no Queen that believes in both it and how it forms a PacLossExcuse can actually point to where (within the MayPac fight) it is and/or where it has effect. When I say "no Queen" . . . I mean, unless, of course, you are Amayzzing and/or place faith in his new diversionary video. As then, in that case, Pac's PacLossExcuseInjury is not a PacLossExcuse; cause (laughably) Pac then won. Talk about hedging your bets with multiple unproven and laughable claims; as a means of concealing your inability to justify your belief in Voodoo. This is taking Queening to whole new level. Hey Amayzzzing . . . .
Any chance you can show us where (even in your own very special and cherry picked PacQueen video of Pac supposedly beating Floyd) Pac actually sustains his injury in round 4 (as you claim) and/or demonstrates it exists? Or are you incapable of proving your point with even your very own hand picked PacPretend fantasy video? My bet is the answer is yes. Donkey (even if he is not behind suggesting the video to sooth your troubled little truth rejecting soul) will love you for bringing out this evasive and misdirecting stunt. Genius move from a fast learner. You two are made for each other. Therefore, I think I am going to have to make you your very own special
Evasion & Hypocritical Hall Of Fame. Perhaps I will call it "
Amayzzing's Blissfully Ignorant, Pretending, Running, Denail & PacQueening, HoF". Lord knows we certainly have some candidates for it. Run Queen run. Love it !!!
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Yep they sure do become
predictable sheep don't they Amayyzzzing? So . . . Getting back to the matter at hand . . . Does this means you will be unable to prove any of your claims? And, Amayzzzing . . does it mean you have (desperately) changed subject again? This time to a video (that's off subject, misdirects, and one) that (laughably) claims Pac won? Which, therefore means you "still" can't *show us where it is within the MayPac fight video I provided that it is that Pac supposedly sustained his PacLossExcuse injury; as you claim? Which, (in association with how difficult it was to get Queens to stay on subject {a point your last post proves} and/or meaningfully discuss and/or prove their PacLossExcuse point {another point set your last post proves}) was what the *subject at hand was about. Wow, after all this time, and the opportunity (from my last post) given to you to learn from; Queening - for you - is still the preferred option. Geez . . . You just cant pay these Queens ($500) to (even try to) prove their point and not; run, change subject, evade, and misdirect. Still love the
predictability of it all though. As, there was no way this fully blown Queen was ever going to step up to the plate, fear no challenge, and show us where the basis of his claims exist. Pac's shoulder injury must sure be real special. As no Queen that believes in both it and how it forms a PacLossExcuse can actually point to where (within the MayPac fight) it is and/or where it has effect. When I say "no Queen" . . . I mean, unless, of course, you are Amayzzing and/or place faith in his new diversionary video. As then, in that case, Pac's PacLossExcuseInjury is not a PacLossExcuse; cause (laughably) Pac then won. Talk about hedging your bets with multiple unproven and laughable claims; as a means of concealing your inability to justify your belief in Voodoo. This is taking Queening to whole new level. Hey Amayzzzing . . . .
Any chance you can show us where (even in your own very special and cherry picked PacQueen video of Pac supposedly beating Floyd) Pac actually sustains his injury in round 4 (as you claim) and/or demonstrates it exists? Or are you incapable of proving your point with even your very own hand picked PacPretend fantasy video? My bet is the answer is yes. Donkey (even if he is not behind suggesting the video to sooth your troubled little truth rejecting soul) will love you for bringing out this evasive and misdirecting stunt. Genius move from a fast learner. You two are made for each other. Therefore, I think I am going to have to make you your very own special
Evasion & Hypocritical Hall Of Fame. Perhaps I will call it "
Amayzzing's Blissfully Ignorant, Pretending, Running, Denail & PacQueening, HoF". Lord knows we certainly have some candidates for it. Run Queen run. . . . . . away from reality and the truth. Love it !!!
Storm. :) :)


-The Good Doctor :

yep people become sheep and their very minds close. **** that vid wont wont lets try this one
->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcC9_cqy2L8
I am not trying to jump in you guys back in forth. I actually find it engaging and slightly funny. I watched your video link and it is very interesting. The video suggests that Pacquiao won but I want to play devil's advocate just for arguments sake here. Full disclosure, I did think Mayweather won but I am more than open to publicly changing my mind if facts are presented that prove otherwise. I also watched the fight with no sound and by myself. In addition, although I am not a huge believer in judging replays as subconsciously you know who won the fight, I did watch the fight several times and my opinion did not change. You can also review my posts and see that I try to be as fair and logical as possible. With that in mind here is what I would ask about the proof your link is presenting: -How clean and effective is the punching if we need slow motion and still caps to see it? -A part of judging is not only how often a boxer lands but his ability to consistently land. When we see a fighter missing punches it does affect how a round is viewed and shaped. How do you reconcile the fact that the video shows very little of how many punches Manny missed and some by almost a foot? -As we all know, disregarding a ko, fights are judged by individual rounds. Since we know that punches landed is not the only parameter when judging a round, is it to be conceived that the video is misleading especially when considering that 7 of the rounds had punches landed within a range of 3 shots. -I have seen several people on here and myself included say that you can control a fight through evasiveness, footwork, clinching, angles, and without punches. Would you agree that this video does not account for that? -Couldn't I argue that there is a legitimate bias to the video? If I set out with the sole purpose of setting out to show how either fighter won the fight, I am sure I can paste together clips that make it look like either guy won. Again, no finger pointing but more interested in how you perceive what the link shows. I would also say, that please consider the following statement from Pacquiao's own trainer Freddie Roach when responding: "
"Bob (Arum) and Manny watched the fight with the sound off and felt like Manny landed more punches and won the fight however I do not agree with them, I think Floyd won the fight". " What say you?


-Radam G :

I am not trying to jump in you guys back in forth. I actually find it engaging and slightly funny. I watched your video link and it is very interesting. The video suggests that Pacquiao won but I want to play devil's advocate just for arguments sake here. Full disclosure, I did think Mayweather won but I am more than open to publicly changing my mind if facts are presented that prove otherwise. I also watched the fight with no sound and by myself. In addition, although I am not a huge believer in judging replays as subconsciously you know who won the fight, I did watch the fight several times and my opinion did not change. You can also review my posts and see that I try to be as fair and logical as possible. With that in mind here is what I would ask about the proof your link is presenting: -How clean and effective is the punching if we need slow motion and still caps to see it? -A part of judging is not only how often a boxer lands but his ability to consistently land. When we see a fighter missing punches it does affect how a round is viewed and shaped. How do you reconcile the fact that the video shows very little of how many punches Manny missed and some by almost a foot? -As we all know, disregarding a ko, fights are judged by individual rounds. Since we know that punches landed is not the only parameter when judging a round, is it to be conceived that the video is misleading especially when considering that 7 of the rounds had punches landed within a range of 3 shots. -I have seen several people on here and myself included say that you can control a fight through evasiveness, footwork, clinching, angles, and without punches. Would you agree that this video does not account for that? -Couldn't I argue that there is a legitimate bias to the video? If I set out with the sole purpose of setting out to show how either fighter won the fight, I am sure I can paste together clips that make it look like either guy won. Again, no finger pointing but more interested in how you perceive what the link shows. I would also say, that please consider the following statement from Pacquiao's own trainer Freddie Roach when responding: "
"Bob (Arum) and Manny watched the fight with the sound off and felt like Manny landed more punches and won the fight however I do not agree with them, I think Floyd won the fight". " What say you?
Lil Floyd is a master of deceit. But he will also tell the truth like all AAAAA Grade pugs will. Money is their fill. But being forced to see a farce, most fans will take a support them _____ ____ pill. And one can convince them to even to believe that to get a pail of water, Jack and went up the hill. Holla!


-stormcentre :


Lil Floyd is a master of deceit. But he will also tell the truth like all AAAAA Grade pugs will. Money is their fill.
But being forced to see a farce, most fans will take a support them _____ ____ pill. And one can convince them to even to believe that to get a pail of water, Jack and went up the hill. Holla!
And, just as predicted in my last post, out comes donkey with his tail lifted high for Amayyzzzing. Ha ha ha. Love it !!!! You're not
a master of deceit (and hypocrisy) though are you?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?20462-Tally-List-Of-Un-Substantiated-Posts&p=79438&viewfull=1#post79438
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?20462-Tally-List-Of-Un-Substantiated-Posts&p=79438&viewfull=1#post79438

Never mind the fact that the video is heavily edited will you Queens? Nope . . . . All that matters is that it keeps the PacPretendHeWon dream alive, and (seemingly, provided you don't scrutinize it) at the same time keeps the PacLossExcuse wolves from the door. Any excuse will do here folks !!!! So long as Queens can keep rejecting the truth and reality, and in doing so never be accountable for all their lies and actions that were dependent upon them. Run Queens run . . . . .





No wonder these Queens huddle together and can't be trusted and/or point to where this magical
PacPretendHeWonLossInjectionRequiringInjuryExcuse happened within the fight . . . . . Not only is that due to the fact that it (the injury) never happened . . . But also, now these running FairyPacQueens reference for the (version of the) fight (they imagine) and their pretending is a heavily edited video that doesn't contain all 3 minutes of every round. It's Ok though, cause all that matters is that the video - rather *fittingly - claims PacJuice won. Hold onto that PacPretendHeWon Queening video of yours won't you running Queens? Ha ha ha . . . Don't you dare spend 1/110th of the energy you're spending to run and lie, to meaningfully prove your claims. Anyway, in the meantime I thank you Queens for proving my claims and all the laughs that have been provided by all your lies and how willingly gullible and eternally stupid you two are, because . . . .

*As previously stated in earlier posts . . . . .

"What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below".

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points.

Very seldom can you find the kind of brilliant humor that's derived from a magical potion mix of Voodoo Donkeys, Clowns and Queens that cant even begin to explain themselves and/or learn from all their episodic and idiotic mistakes. But here, we have two of them; DonkeyClown and AmayyzzzingQueen. Both, are out of the closet and working in tandem to convince themselves that fiction is real. Just so they can continue to ignore reality, escape the truth, and continue pretending. My God this is hilarious fun watching these PacQueenClowns dig themselves into an ever Deeper hole. I know 9 year olds that avoid the truth less. Keep it up beautiful Queens, but remember . . .



Once you stop pretending and running that lippy and mascara of yours may need a little touch up. Lots of love,
Storm. :) :) :)


-stormcentre :


Lil Floyd is a master of deceit. But he will also tell the truth like all AAAAA Grade pugs will. Money is their fill.
But being forced to see a farce, most fans will take a support them _____ ____ pill. And one can convince them to even to believe that to get a pail of water, Jack and went up the hill. Holla!
And, just as predicted in my last post, out comes donkey with his tail lifted high for Amayyzzzing. Ha ha ha. Love it !!!! You're not
a master of deceit (and hypocrisy) though are you?


Mr. Acedamia:
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?20462-Tally-List-Of-Un-Substantiated-Posts&p=79438&viewfull=1#post79438
Mr. Cancer Curer:
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?25439-Dr-Joel-Wallach-s-Credentials-Speak-For-Themselves&highlight=wallach

Never mind the fact that the video is heavily edited will you Queens? Nope . . . . All that matters is that it keeps the PacPretendHeWon dream alive, and (seemingly, provided you don't scrutinize it) at the same time keeps the PacLossExcuse wolves from the door. Any excuse will do here folks !!!! So long as Queens can keep rejecting the truth and reality, and in doing so never be accountable for all their lies and actions that were dependent upon them. Run Queens run . . . . .





No wonder these Queens huddle together and can't be trusted and/or point to where this magical
PacPretendHeWonLossInjectionRequiringInjuryExcuse happened within the fight . . . . . Not only is that due to the fact that it (the injury) never happened . . . But also, now these running FairyPacQueens reference for the (version of the) fight (they imagine) and their pretending is a heavily edited video that doesn't contain all 3 minutes of every round. It's Ok though, cause all that matters is that the video - rather *fittingly - claims PacJuice won. Hold onto that PacPretendHeWon Queening video of yours won't you running Queens? Ha ha ha . . . Don't you dare spend 1/110th of the energy you're spending to run and lie, to meaningfully prove your claims. Anyway, in the meantime I thank you Queens for proving my claims and all the laughs that have been provided by all your lies and how willingly gullible and eternally stupid you two are, because . . . .

*As previously stated in earlier posts . . . . .

"What intrigues me quite a lot is the almost complete rejection of facts and any rational discussion that PacQueens and some others possess, pertaining to how overtly obvious Pac's exploits in this area are". "The IV drip is (in itself not entirely uncommon to Pac and boxing circles, and it is) not nearly as suspicious as the PacQueen movement's continual hesitance and fear shown when acknowledging all the equally (if not more) suspicious PED related matters pertaining to the PacJuiceKing, including those listed below".

And the more Puppies and PacQueens skirt around the tough questions, promote/allow their leader to pretend, misdirect, and rely on this type of group behavior . . . The more they simply prove the above points.

Very seldom can you find the kind of brilliant humor that's derived from a magical potion mix of Voodoo Donkeys, Clowns and Queens that cant even begin to explain themselves and/or learn from all their episodic and idiotic mistakes. But here, we have two of them; DonkeyClown and AmayyzzzingQueen. Both, are out of the closet and working in tandem to convince themselves that fiction is real. Just so they can continue to ignore reality, escape the truth, and continue pretending. My God this is hilarious fun watching these PacQueenClowns dig themselves into an ever Deeper hole. I know 9 year olds that avoid the truth less. Keep it up beautiful Queens, but remember . . .



Once you stop pretending and running that lippy and mascara of yours may need a little touch up. Lots of love,
Storm. :) :) :)


-amayseng :

I am not trying to jump in you guys back in forth. I actually find it engaging and slightly funny. I watched your video link and it is very interesting. The video suggests that Pacquiao won but I want to play devil's advocate just for arguments sake here. Full disclosure, I did think Mayweather won but I am more than open to publicly changing my mind if facts are presented that prove otherwise. I also watched the fight with no sound and by myself. In addition, although I am not a huge believer in judging replays as subconsciously you know who won the fight, I did watch the fight several times and my opinion did not change. You can also review my posts and see that I try to be as fair and logical as possible. With that in mind here is what I would ask about the proof your link is presenting: -How clean and effective is the punching if we need slow motion and still caps to see it? -A part of judging is not only how often a boxer lands but his ability to consistently land. When we see a fighter missing punches it does affect how a round is viewed and shaped. How do you reconcile the fact that the video shows very little of how many punches Manny missed and some by almost a foot? -As we all know, disregarding a ko, fights are judged by individual rounds. Since we know that punches landed is not the only parameter when judging a round, is it to be conceived that the video is misleading especially when considering that 7 of the rounds had punches landed within a range of 3 shots. -I have seen several people on here and myself included say that you can control a fight through evasiveness, footwork, clinching, angles, and without punches. Would you agree that this video does not account for that? -Couldn't I argue that there is a legitimate bias to the video? If I set out with the sole purpose of setting out to show how either fighter won the fight, I am sure I can paste together clips that make it look like either guy won. Again, no finger pointing but more interested in how you perceive what the link shows. I would also say, that please consider the following statement from Pacquiao's own trainer Freddie Roach when responding: "
"Bob (Arum) and Manny watched the fight with the sound off and felt like Manny landed more punches and won the fight however I do not agree with them, I think Floyd won the fight". " What say you?
I think Floyd won when I watched it live, 7-5. My video was put out because someone on here asked me to to show that in round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches.....Also I think Pac hurt his shoulder in this round, you can hurt something and use it to a less affect, not everything is an absolute, there are different degrees of injuries..... I said from the beginning Floyd is a MASTER of rolling and diminishing landed punches, like a damn magician in there. Either way I am disappointed Floyd didnt step up offensively for the fight of the century.... some people can NOT get past this fight or act like they lost their home and savings over it, I lost what could have been an entertaining fight and was disappointed, that is all.... I like both fighters, always have and expected more from both of them...


-stormcentre :

I think Floyd won when I watched it live, 7-5.
My video was put out because someone on here asked me to to show that in round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches..... Also I think Pac hurt his shoulder in this round, you can hurt something and use it to a less affect, not everything is an absolute, there are different degrees of injuries..... I said from the beginning Floyd is a MASTER of rolling and diminishing landed punches, like a damn magician in there. Either way I am disappointed Floyd didnt step up offensively for the fight of the century.... some people can NOT get past this fight or act like they lost their home and savings over it, I lost what could have been an entertaining fight and was disappointed, that is all.... I like both fighters, always have and expected more from both of them...
Tempted to say . . . . .

""Do you not find it concerning that you cant explain yourself and/or the basis of;


A) Not only, something you obviously feel so strongly about and have acted upon.
B) But also, all the diversionary claims you offer us instead of the real explanations?"

"

But then we all know being concerned about pretending and faking it, and being able to explain yourself, is probably something you clearly have no moral place for. And as such the risk associated with being caught out lying is something you (not only have in common with donkey, but also) appear to have welcomed with open arms. So, instead . . . I will start this post like this . . . . Fresh new Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen false narrative designed to misdirect, evade, and both, avoid the real question at hand and also pretend the PacPretendHeWon video (and the resulting flawed theory Amayzzzing has wrongly deduced from it) has a basis in fact; has just been pooped out by Pac(Amayyzzzing)Queen. Too bad that - like all the other PacLossExcuse theories and excuses not explain - it's as completely flawed as it is evidence that the Queens know their claims are indefensible with fact and logic. OK, let's get into it, and see the real substance of this fresh new Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen false narrative release. Ahhh . . . excuse me Queen . . . .

Above, where you say . . .

""
My video was put out because someone on here asked me to show that in round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches.....""

Well . . . it's a (predictable) lie. You see, from my post #49 here . . . . .
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101699&viewfull=1#post101699 I actually say . . . . .

""At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent
power punches on Floyd in round 4; which is probably one reason why Amayyzzzing can't back up his latest excuse that serves as the reason why he can't back up his PacLossExcuse"".



Now, I know you're a (self confessed) 10 year experienced therapist and all that . . .

And we all know you wouldn't lie about that . . . . Cause heaps of respected therapists;


A) Jump at and accept unproven injury claims.
B) And, also run from explaining why they do it whilst wheeling out successive excuses that make increasingly less sense the more you look at them.

Like you do. So . . you're safe there.

But (because you obviously cant explain yourself and/or tell the truth, I have to assume) just incase you cant read; please note PacLossExcuse(Amayzzzzing)Queen that . . . . No matter how much you enjoy lubricating donkey's behind - believe fiction is reality - and attempt to wish such fantasy dreams into existence to sooth your troubled and truth rejecting soul . . . My statement . . . .

""At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent power punches on Floyd in round 4""

Does not equate to . . . Your (above posts' laughable) misinterpretation of . . .

""In round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches"".

Geez . . . No wonder you and Silly Sam got on so well (when you were big time last year); as you both seem to have an obvious problem with comprehension and then go onto cause other dilemmas for yourselves on that and other bases. Clever Queen aren't you? Keep this up Queen and you will be Queening at such a high rate that you're literally only one wig away from being Catlyn Jenner. And, just so your supposedly 10 year professional therapist knows . . . . . The key there is the (differentiating) term "
power punches". And, just so your eternally pretending azz knows; usually power punches in a boxing fight don't equate to total punches. Not even if both boxers drink all the watermelon seeded juice that you yourself can suck and squeeze from donkey's crown-like glans and corona. Now, after all that and yet another well deserved spanking dished out to you for being caught out running, pretending, and Queening . . .



Perhaps you have the time to do something worthwhile. Perhaps you have the time to use the video I provided (which, unlike the PacPretendHeWon video you clearly favor, is not heavily edited and largely fictional) in your plight to convince us all that you're trustworthy, reliable, not blind, and capable of explaining yourself. Hey (and this is just because I am a fair
Storm and know that you really struggle with the truth) . . . . . you can even use the proper (and unedited) MayPac video I provided to substantiate your above but incomplete (misdirecting) claim . . . but this time do it in the correct context of how many
power punches Pac landed in round 4. See how you go. Rush to it as if it were your latest PacLossExcuse theory, wont you? See if - without your above-mentioned comprehension misinterpretation - your assumption (that my claim pertaining to the
power punches you neatly misinterpreted {with the aid of a fictional video} as total punches) is correct. And, just incase that exercise is too hard for you (and we all know it will be), I wrote this to apply . . . In simple terms, perhaps we can put it like this for you . . . . so it's real simple . . . . simple enough for any Queen to grasp . . . .

Queen, (aside from the fact that you're caught out running/lying again) the PacPretendHeWon video you clearly favor and are referring is so obviously fictional and "edited for a purpose" that it would not convince anyone (other than desperate fools like you and donkey) that the PacLossExcuse fictions you believe in are real. But then you already knew that didn't you? Otherwise you would have been able to;


A) Answer all the simple questions that the Good Doctor and myself have asked you about your PacLossExcuse hypothesis. Including pointing out precisely where (in the fight) this magical PacLossExcuse injury occurs, and/or where the (hesitated and/or modified torque) shoulder-movement (that you claim in earlier posts) exists.
B) Refrain from both, wheeling out flawed excuse after flawed excuse, and your endlessly embarrassing Queening exhibitions.



So . .. Pac(Amayyyzzzzing)Queen . . since you obviously want to keep lying and Queening . . . you will hopefully appreciate that I therefore reserve the right to laugh at your expense and ask these incredibly relevant questions.


1) Are there any question about your PacLossExcuse that you can meaningfully answer - will not run from - will not wheel out flawed excuse after flawed excuse about - and can approach without Queening?
2) Is there any PacExcuse(ex)Planation that you and donkey have already cooked up in relation to evading and misdirecting away from answering the hard questions about your PacLossExcuse, that - when scrutinized - will not cause you to immediately create another fantasy excuse-story and/or run to a fictitious PacPretendHeWon video over; as has clearly happened episodically here over your last few posts?
3) Do you foresee anytime in the (even distant) future when the truth will finally flow from your mouth and/or keyboard as freely as its polar opposite counterpart currently does?

Look, I know these questions are hard for you and I also know you don't learn real quick from mistakes and being caught out lying and Queening . . . So . . . (against the backdrop of you being busted - yet again {we're in the high double digits with this count folks} - for misdirecting, lying, and PacLossExcuseQueening, and) whilst you contemplate those aforementioned truth related and therefore scary questions . . . . And whilst you also (now you're in the spotlight) withdraw your member from donkey's familiarly comfortable rump . . . . . Here's something for you to do that - just to make you feel at home - involves your very own cherry picked, laughable, and highly loved PacPretendHeWon video . . .


* Please feel free to use your own cherry picked and hilariously fictitious PacPretendHeWon video (or even the one that is a far, far, more accurate facsimile of the MayPac fight, such as that I have provided) to show us all where - in round 4 and as you claim - Pac supposedly sustained and/or further aggravated his injury.

See, I am a fair
Storm. So . . . now it's over to you my little truth rejecting and eternally fantasizing Queen. Now - just to make it real easy for you - you can *use your own (highly questionable) PacPretendHeWon video evidence to prove your own (highly questionable) PacLossExcuseInjury claims pertaining to round 4; and - if you do it - the $500 reward I previously pitched still stands. The reason I am so sure is, not just the exceptionally poor quality of all the excuses that have been wheeled out - but also the fact that, with this Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen, we are dealing with a fully blown Queen whom has experienced problems hormonally transitioning. :) Time to stand up and stop running Queen. Lots of love,
Storm. :) :)
PS: Secret message from
Storm; I bet Amayzzzing cant even *use his own (highly questionable) PacPretendHeWon video evidence to prove his own (highly questionable) PacLossExcuseInjury claims. The reason I am so sure is, not just because of the exceptionally poor quality of excuses that have been successively wheeled out - but also because, with this Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen, we are dealing with a fully blown Queen that has not hormonally transitioned as well as expected. :) They almost always struggle with reality and the truth.


-stormcentre :

I think Floyd won when I watched it live, 7-5.
My video was put out because someone on here asked me to to show that in round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches..... Also I think Pac hurt his shoulder in this round, you can hurt something and use it to a less affect, not everything is an absolute, there are different degrees of injuries..... I said from the beginning Floyd is a MASTER of rolling and diminishing landed punches, like a damn magician in there. Either way I am disappointed Floyd didnt step up offensively for the fight of the century.... some people can NOT get past this fight or act like they lost their home and savings over it, I lost what could have been an entertaining fight and was disappointed, that is all.... I like both fighters, always have and expected more from both of them...
Tempted to say . . . . .

""Do you not find it concerning that you cant explain yourself and/or the basis of;


A) Not only, something you obviously feel so strongly about and have acted upon.
B) But also, all the diversionary claims you offer us instead of the real explanations?"

"

But then we all know being concerned about pretending and faking it, and being able to explain yourself, is probably something you clearly have no moral place for. And as such the risk associated with being caught out lying is something you (not only have in common with donkey, but also) appear to have welcomed with open arms. So, instead . . . I will start this post like this . . . . Fresh new Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen false narrative designed to misdirect, evade, and both, avoid the real question at hand and also pretend the PacPretendHeWon video (and the resulting flawed theory Amayzzzing has wrongly deduced from it) has a basis in fact; has just been pooped out by Pac(Amayyzzzing)Queen. Too bad that - like all the other PacLossExcuse theories and excuses not explain - it's as completely flawed as it is evidence that the Queens know their claims are indefensible with fact and logic. OK, let's get into it, and see the real substance of this fresh new Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen false narrative release. Ahhh . . . excuse me Queen . . . .

Above, where you say . . .

""
My video was put out because someone on here asked me to show that in round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches.....""

Well . . . it's a (predictable) lie. You see, from my post #49 here . . . . .
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101699&viewfull=1#post101699 I actually say . . . . .

""At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent
power punches on Floyd in round 4; which is probably one reason why Amayyzzzing can't back up his latest excuse that serves as the reason why he can't back up his PacLossExcuse"".



Now, I know you're a (self confessed) 10 year experienced therapist and all that . . .

And we all know you wouldn't lie about that . . . . Cause heaps of respected therapists;


A) Jump at and accept unproven injury claims.
B) And, also run from explaining why they do it whilst wheeling out successive excuses that make increasingly less sense the more you look at them.

Like you do. So . . you're safe there.

But (because you obviously cant explain yourself and/or tell the truth, I have to assume) just incase you cant read; please note PacLossExcuse(Amayzzzzing)Queen that . . . . No matter how much you enjoy lubricating donkey's behind - believe fiction is reality - and attempt to wish such fantasy dreams into existence to sooth your troubled and truth rejecting soul . . . My statement . . . .

""At best, Pac only landed 3 or 4 (more like 2), decent power punches on Floyd in round 4""

Does not equate to . . . Your (above posts' laughable) misinterpretation of . . .

""In round 4 Pac landed more than 2-3 punches"".

Geez . . . No wonder you and Silly Sam got on so well (when you were big time last year); as you both seem to have an obvious problem with comprehension and then go onto cause other dilemmas for yourselves on that and other bases. Clever Queen aren't you? Keep this up Queen and you will be Queening at such a high rate that you're literally only one wig away from being Catlyn Jenner. And, just so your supposedly 10 year professional therapist knows . . . . . The key there is the (differentiating) term "
power punches". And, just so your eternally pretending azz knows; usually power punches in a boxing fight don't equate to total punches. Not even if both boxers drink all the watermelon seeded juice that you yourself can suck and squeeze from donkey's crown-like glans and corona. Now, after all that and yet another well deserved spanking dished out to you for being caught out running, pretending, and Queening . . .
Perhaps you have the time to do something worthwhile. Perhaps you have the time to use the video I provided (which, unlike the PacPretendHeWon video you clearly favor, is not heavily edited and largely fictional) in your plight to convince us all that you're trustworthy, reliable, not blind, and capable of explaining yourself. Hey (and this is just because I am a fair
Storm and know that you really struggle with the truth) . . . . . you can even use the proper (and unedited) MayPac video I provided to substantiate your above but incomplete (misdirecting) claim . . . but this time do it in the correct context of how many
power punches Pac landed in round 4. See how you go. Rush to it as if it were your latest PacLossExcuse theory, wont you? See if - without your above-mentioned comprehension misinterpretation - your assumption (that my claim pertaining to the
power punches you neatly misinterpreted {with the aid of a fictional video} as total punches) is correct. And, just incase that exercise is too hard for you (and we all know it will be), I wrote this to apply . . . In simple terms, perhaps we can put it like this for you . . . . so it's real simple . . . . simple enough for any Queen to grasp . . . .

Queen, (aside from the fact that you're caught out running/lying again) the PacPretendHeWon video you clearly favor and are referring is so obviously fictional and "edited for a purpose" that it would not convince anyone (other than desperate fools like you and donkey) that the PacLossExcuse fictions you believe in are real. But then you already knew that didn't you? Otherwise you would have been able to;


A) Answer all the simple questions that the Good Doctor and myself have asked you about your PacLossExcuse hypothesis. Including pointing out precisely where (in the fight) this magical PacLossExcuse injury occurs, and/or where the (hesitated and/or modified torque) shoulder-movement (that you claim in earlier posts) exists.
B) Refrain from both, wheeling out flawed excuse after flawed excuse, and your endlessly embarrassing Queening exhibitions.



So . .. Pac(Amayyyzzzzing)Queen . . since you obviously want to keep lying and Queening . . . you will hopefully appreciate that I therefore reserve the right to laugh at your expense and ask these incredibly relevant questions.


1) Are there any question about your PacLossExcuse that you can meaningfully answer - will not run from - will not wheel out flawed excuse after flawed excuse about - and can approach without Queening?
2) Is there any PacExcuse(ex)Planation that you and donkey have already cooked up in relation to evading and misdirecting away from answering the hard questions about your PacLossExcuse, that - when scrutinized - will not cause you to immediately create another fantasy excuse-story and/or run to a fictitious PacPretendHeWon video over; as has clearly happened episodically here over your last few posts?
3) Do you foresee anytime in the (even distant) future when the truth will finally flow from your mouth and/or keyboard as freely as its polar opposite counterpart currently does?

Look, I know these questions are hard for you and I also know you don't learn real quick from mistakes and being caught out lying and Queening . . . So . . . (against the backdrop of you being busted - yet again {we're in the high double digits with this count folks} - for misdirecting, lying, and PacLossExcuseQueening, and) whilst you contemplate those aforementioned truth related and therefore scary questions . . . . And whilst you also (now you're in the spotlight) withdraw your member from donkey's familiarly comfortable rump . . . . . Here's something for you to do that - just to make you feel at home - involves your very own cherry picked, laughable, and highly loved PacPretendHeWon video . . .


* Please feel free to use your own cherry picked and hilariously fictitious PacPretendHeWon video (or even the one that is a far, far, more accurate facsimile of the MayPac fight, such as that I have provided) to show us all where - in round 4 and as you claim - Pac supposedly sustained and/or further aggravated his injury.

See, I am a fair
Storm. So . . . now it's over to you my little truth rejecting and eternally fantasizing Queen. Now - just to make it real easy for you - you can *use your own (highly questionable) PacPretendHeWon video evidence to prove your own (highly questionable) PacLossExcuseInjury claims pertaining to round 4; and - if you do it - the $500 reward I previously pitched still stands. Time to stand up and stop running Queen. Lots of love,
Storm. :) :)
PS: Secret message from
Storm; I bet Amayzzzing cant even *use his own (highly questionable) PacPretendHeWon video evidence to prove his own (highly questionable) PacLossExcuseInjury claims. The reason I am so sure is, not just because of the exceptionally poor quality of excuses that have been successively wheeled out - but also because, with this Pac(Amayzzzing)Queen, we are dealing with a fully blown Queen that has not hormonally transitioned as well as expected. :) They almost always struggle with reality and the truth.


-deepwater2 :

The 750 ml casts a big shadow over Lil Floyd's biggest fight. I thought The judges would not be impressed with Floyd's work , just like Trinidad Delahoya. Delahoya easily won the first half of that fight but the judges punished him for safety first in the second half. A super fight can be scored a bit different was my reckoning. Forgot how much the Nevada commission bent over for Floyd.


-stormcentre :


The 750 ml casts a big shadow over Lil Floyd's biggest fight. I thought The judges would not be impressed with Floyd's work , just like Trinidad Delahoya. Delahoya easily won the first half of that fight but the judges punished him for safety first in the second half. A super fight can be scored a bit different was my reckoning. Forgot how much the Nevada commission bent over for Floyd.
Yep it sure does. Not as much though, as Queens continually wheeling out lame excuse after lame excuse, and then offering a bogus and heavily edited PacPretendHeWon video, as a means to avoid all the simply questions and also protect both, all their claims and cherished PacLossExcuse though. Still, the humor watching PacQueens idiotically squirm and desperately reach for anything (and as we can see from the last few pages of this thread, I mean anything) that will prevent them from having to face facts and the truth, is just gold. Pure Gold. Cheers,
Storm. :) :) :)


-SuperLight :

Yep it sure does. Not as much though, as Queens continually wheeling out lame excuse after lame excuse, and then offering a bogus and heavily edited PacPretendHeWon video, as a means to avoid all the simply questions and also protect both, all their claims and cherished PacLossExcuse though. Still, the humor watching PacQueens idiotically squirm and desperately reach for anything (and as we can see from the last few pages of this thread, I mean anything) that will prevent them from having to face facts and the truth, is just gold. Pure Gold. Cheers,
Storm. :) :) :)
Hey, Storm. I recall you saying something to the effect I have the balls to examine the footage and honestly state my opinion. Indeed that is or was my plan. I've been waiting until have have a bit of free time to dedicate the task and do it properly. Having followed this thread I tend to agree with you on most points regarding the bout in question. I must say, though, it's hard to get at the truth with all the jabs at sexuality and acts between man and donkey. If anyone wants to know my take on this fight that won't die, please let me know. I might do it here or in a fresh thread, and I'll happily take the time to do it properly, but I'm getting tired of sifting through the crap some of you guys are flinging.


-Radam G :

Hey, Storm. I recall you saying something to the effect I have the balls to examine the footage and honestly state my opinion. Indeed that is or was my plan. I've been waiting until have have a bit of free time to dedicate the task and do it properly. Having followed this thread I tend to agree with you on most points regarding the bout in question. I must say, though, it's hard to get at the truth with all the jabs at sexuality and acts between man and donkey. If anyone wants to know my take on this fight that won't die, please let me know. I might do it here or in a fresh thread, and I'll happily take the time to do it properly, but I'm getting tired of sifting through the crap some of you guys are flinging.
Money May -- like any real pug -- has zero issues with eventually telling the truth.
->https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-0yJv9_6nQ4. There will be much luv for Money May when he pays his visit to the P-Islands. Holla!


-stormcentre :

Yep, fair enough. I will not hide from the fact that I enjoy paybacks and also taking some liberties with exposing extensive liars. It's a shame the same concerns for flung crap was not expressed (by you or anyone) when all these guys were in full swing (sometimes with a 7:1 ratio) last year; where all the claims the Queens are now running from originated. Or even over the extent that Queens squirm, evade, and fail to explain themselves; surely the origin of the matter. Still, looking at that, would be approaching the matter in a non symptomatic way. OK, with that said . . . I take your points on board . . . Apologies on my part for being naughty and persistent with the pretenders. So . . . lets heard your review of the footage. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Yep, fair enough. I will not hide from the fact that I enjoy paybacks and also taking some liberties with exposing extensive liars. It's a shame the same concerns for flung crap was not expressed (by you or anyone) when all these guys were in full swing (sometimes with a 7:1 ratio) last year; where all the claims the Queens are now running from originated. Or even over the extent that Queens squirm, evade, continuously lie, and fail to explain themselves; surely the origin of the matter. Still, looking at that, would be approaching the matter in a non symptomatic way. OK, with that said . . . I take your points on board . . . Apologies on my part for being naughty and persistent with the pretenders. OK . . . . So . . . lets hear your review of the footage. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Yep, fair enough SL. I will not hide from the fact that I enjoy paybacks and also taking some liberties with exposing extensive liars - particularly those that extend their falsehoods right out beyond 12 months, whilst at the same time being completely unable and unwilling to explain them. It's a shame the same concerns for flung crap was not expressed (by you or indeed anyone);


A) When all these Queens were in full swing (sometimes with a 7:1 ratio) last year; where all the claims that the Queens are now running from actually originated.
B) Over the extent that Queens squirm, evade, continuously lie, and fail to explain themselves; which is surely the origin of the matter.

Still, looking at that, would be approaching the matter in a non symptomatic way and involve taking on multiple pretenders at once. And (aside from Muhammad Ali and perhaps a few others that enjoy beating down the gangster bullies regardless of their ratios) not many people have the stones to do that whilst also exposing the rationale/justification behind it. OK, with that said . . . I take your points on board . . . Apologies on my part for being naughty and persistent with the pretenders. Please remember also, there's always about 20 threads on any given TSS forum page. So there's absolutely no need to labor yourself and *sift through all the lies and donkey comments that exist in 1 or 2 threads; especially if they're not to your liking. Additionally, such *exercises wont help you review the footage either. As that MayPac video URL is readily accessible without going through all the thread's posts each/every time. Plus, the matter at hand here is simply where (if it exists at all) is there any evidence - within the MayPac video (not the fictitious and heavily edited PacPretendHeWon video that Random and Amayzzzing like) - that Pac sustained and/or aggravated his PacLossExcuseInjury; in any manner that resembles the multitude of exceptionally lame claims and diversions that we have seen episodically go down here for over a year - whenever any PacQueen is asked to meaningfully explain themselves and/or their PacLossExcuse. OK . . . . So . . . lets hear your review of the footage SL. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-SuperLight :

Yep, fair enough. I will not hide from the fact that I enjoy paybacks and also taking some liberties with exposing extensive liars. It's a shame the same concerns for flung crap was not expressed (by you or anyone) when all these guys were in full swing (sometimes with a 7:1 ratio) last year; where all the claims the Queens are now running from originated. Or even over the extent that Queens squirm, evade, continuously lie, and fail to explain themselves; surely the origin of the matter. Still, looking at that, would be approaching the matter in a non symptomatic way. OK, with that said . . . I take your points on board . . . Apologies on my part for being naughty and persistent with the pretenders. OK . . . . So . . . lets hear your review of the footage. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)
Brother Storm, that looks to me like taking it like a man. Good stuff. In fact you will see I'm not placing blame in one direction. Further, my point is the insults are clouding any reasonable discussion of what was the topic at hand. It doesn't bother me who called whom what. As I've said before, you all should be able to take it and/or sort it out like grown-ups. So, back to Manny and Floyd, yes, I'll happily do my part to the best of my ability. I'll not start a fresh thread, but will post here my methodology and disclaimers first. Please, boys and girls, be patient. Get ready to look into the past and into the mirror, to learn a bit, and hopefully to have some fun with this.


-stormcentre :

Brother Storm, that looks to me like taking it like a man. Good stuff. In fact you will see I'm not placing blame in one direction. Further, my point is the insults are clouding any reasonable discussion of what was the topic at hand. It doesn't bother me who called whom what. As I've said before, you all should be able to take it and/or sort it out like grown-ups. So, back to Manny and Floyd, yes, I'll happily do my part to the best of my ability. I'll not start a fresh thread, but will post here my methodology and disclaimers first. Please, boys and girls, be patient. Get ready to look into the past and into the mirror, to learn a bit, and hopefully to have some fun with this.
Look, SL, I don't agree with you on some things you say, but hey it's cool. I can see that you like to be diplomatically correct if possible, and that's cool too. None of this stuff (beyond a source of humor) really matters to me. As I know if any Queen could prove a (valid/worthy) PacLossExcuse or other point with facts, they would stop running and do so. So, don't let the big posts misleadingly dictate to you (or anyone) about the terms of my apparent attachment. The posts are almost always in direct proportion to the lies and incredible - but always unexplained - claims that multiple Queens release. Lying (even when it is not executed in tandem or as a threesome) is quite an evolved skill, so you don't just unravel and expose it in a 4 line post. Pretenders know this; which, is largely, one reason why lying/pretending is, in some parts, so prevalent around here. All up, I just love to see how much and to what extent Queens will squirm and lie, and run from even beginning to explain themselves. It's funny. There's also humor - for me at least - in detailing the historical events that define and lead up to all their episodically lame excuses and claims too. As usually - it's due to the fact that that aspect of most experienced liars game is not always easily revealed - that most pretenders and imposters continue in their rampant and uncontrolled pretending/tribal state. OK . . . . So . . . (when you're ready) lets hear your review of the footage SL. The criteria is as follows . . . . .

Where (if it exists at all) is there any evidence - within the MayPac video (not the fictitious and heavily edited PacPretendHeWon video that Random and Amayzzzing like) - that Pac sustained and/or aggravated his PacLossExcuseInjury; in any manner that resembles the multitude of exceptionally lame claims and diversions that we have seen episodically go down here for over a year - whenever any PacQueen is asked to meaningfully explain themselves and/or their PacLossExcuse.

Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-SuperLight :

Brothers and sisters, here comes my attempt to untangle the Mayweather-Pacquiao debacle. First we breach Disclaimer city limits. I do not claim to be a qualified or professional coach, fighter, judge, referee, therapist or medical professional of any kind. I consider myself a fight fan and “weekday warrior” if you will. I spar and train in boxing usually twice a week, and have some other martial art experience years ago (more on that some time in another thread). To this day I don’t know which of Pac’s shoulders was supposed to have been injured. I have not watched any interviews, read any medical reports or press releases regarding the matter. Likewise I don’t know whether Pac’s shoulder is supposed to have been injured before the bout (and aggravated at some point therein) or else sustained at some point during the fight. With all respect I’m not a particular fan of Mayweather or Pacquiao. I have no affiliation with either fighter or their promotion or management teams. I am not part of any entourage =) One could say the above put me in a neutral position. To my knowledge I don’t know any of you outside TSS forum (in real life). I’ll do my best to be upfront about any bias I might have here. At all times I’m open to your opinions – substantiated! – and happy to stand corrected or have my mind changed. And, all that said, I’ll call it how I see it. So now all the boring stuff is out of the way, my methodology for this task is as follows. I’ll give my opinion on who won the fight, how and why. I’ll look for evidence of any kind indicating Pac was hampered by a shoulder injury. To this end I’ll review the fight footage in the link previously posted by stormcentre: [URL="https://youtu.be/7yZG9w0j_1g">https://youtu.be/7yZG9w0j_1g[/URL] I’ll refer to time stamps therein wherever appropriate (i.e. for specific shots, interaction with coaches, etc.) I’ll post my analysis and opinions in this thread, and update within the same post as I progress with the footage and/or new information. P.S. to stormcentre, well noted about my diplomatic streak.


-Skibbz :

To stick my fork into it: Floyd won on the cards and in the fight. It was not the best performance any of us have seen, but he wanted to win and did it the best way he knew how and that's all there is to it. Pacquiao did his best, but against Floyd he was against a smarter and more experienced boxer and neither he nor his corner had the answers. All plaudits should go to Floyd for the victory and Pacquiao should be commended for his efforts in the fight. I don't think it's great to see people having a go at one another when you can just agree to disagree on a fact that will never change, almost reminds me of what it was like when "The Shadow" was active on the forums. Enjoy the rest of your weeks, Skibbz


-stormcentre :

Yep, Shadow got fed up with everybody ganging up on, and also bullying, him. It went on for quite a while. I was extremely surprised no-one from an administrative perspective ever stepped in. Lying and teaming up with others to do it, is usually one of the foundations of forum bullying; it certainly has been here. Lets see what SL delivers.
Storm. :) :) :)


-deepwater2 :

The shadow is al Haymon's driver now. He is at peace.


-Skibbz :

The shadow is al Haymon's driver now. He is at peace.
Can only imagine what that's like.. He'd take a bullet for his boss..


-stormcentre :

He took a few (unreasonable and unnecessary) bullets here too. Some authored by Deep. :) :) :)


-SuperLight :

Let's yet again begin dissecting the 2015 mega-fight that never was and yet refuses to die. Before the fight, I was barracking for Pacquiao, for several reasons, as I've probably stated before. He had built a legacy moving up in weight classes and fighting some big names. He was an exciting, aggressive, flurrying fighter at his best. He has a massive following worldwide and especially in S.E. Asia. In my opinion he's largely seen as a role model and "nice guy". A win for him would've been good for boxing as a sport. That doesn't mean I predicted his win. In fact, I was partly going for the underdog. As great as Manny is and was, I've seen Mayweather neutralise or dismantle some serious fighters, including those that could supposedly KO him if they could get to him. And that is the thing: Few could get to him. When he's been touched it hasn't bothered him. His head and body movement is amazing, and he knows how to spoil very effectively. In my opinion it would take a very special fighter indeed to beat him - simultaneously patient, decisive, sharp and aggressive, and definitely with knowledge of how to cut off the ring and to effectively work in the pocket. I believe the above attributes are essential, among others, to formulate an effective strategy for any chance of beating Mayweather. It's not enough to have power and "go for a KO", or to throw many and/or fast punches. Keeping busy might be positive, but the key is effective aggression and effective work. Remember this when I tell what I saw in Manny during the May-Pac fight. As some have noted, including myself, Mayweather won on the cards, and it looked like he won from the fans' perspective. Of course not all viewers agree with the result, which is their prerogative. When I first watched the bout (live) I recall thinking Manny couldn't find his range or rhythm. I remember seeing one round where his aggression was turned up and quite effective, and would have awarded that round his way. But for the rest of the fight, he looked like we was a bit lost, and certainly not going for a KO as was implied by Roach beforehand. I saw Mayweather evading, using lateral movement, luring Pacquiao to the ropes and using lateral movement to escape, or clinching to stifle any close-range attacks, all as predicted. The question is why would Manny not do something more effective about all this? There was little to no assertion in cutting off the ring, not much capitalising when Floyd was by the ropes, nor fighting out of the clinches. He gave one round of proper attacking, a glimpse of the Manny we had come to expect, but what happened before and after? I expected him to be outclassed by a defensive fighter like Mayweather, but it's like he was not present. Was he on something? Or off something? Or could an injury have been hampering him? Let's not discount the latter, but give it its proper due when analysing round-by-round. To re-cap, the first time I watched, Manny looked to be fighting with little to no strategy, or certainly not an effective one. Remember Roach's pre-fight talk of going for a KO. Whether we take it at face value or as a ruse to intimidate Mayweather, all well and good, but here we should not confuse award-winning Freddie with miracle-working Freddie, because the latter doesn't exist. It looks like this plan A was abandoned in favour of, let's call it a damage-control plan at best or nothing at worst, or else there was no plan B in the first place. I next viewed some footage from the fight when stormcentre posted the link in this thread (2016-08-12 or thereabouts) and watched into the beginning of round 5. I wasn't counting or tabulating anything on that occasion, simply getting an overall impression of what each fighter was and wasn't doing. [URL="https://youtu.be/7yZG9w0j_1g">https://youtu.be/7yZG9w0j_1g[/URL] My impression of Mayweather didn't change much or at all. A fair bit of clinching, a fair bit of willingly backing toward the ropes, lateral movement to get away, head movement, all pretty much neutralising Pac's efforts. Pac seemed not quite himself for the first 3 rounds. It looked like he was out of his depth or his comfort zone, as I had previously observed. He wan't really capitalising on a May near the ropes or doing anything about the clinches. He was throwing punches, not landing anything big. I noted he was throwing straight shots with both hands, hooks to the head, and body shots. I didn't note uppercuts or anything more esoteric, which I shall do next time I watch to break it down properly. The important thing is I didn't see any type of shot or angle that was obviously troubling Pac, up to and including round 4. Next time I watch more closely, I'll update this post inline - with timestamp references and date added. Expect slow but steady progress here, and as thorough as I can be. 2016-08-19 update: Let's look at round 1. Around 6:19 in the clip, Pac throws straight shots (1-2) with full extension, hitting air as May steps back and then counters with his lead hand. ~6:28, after a slipping couple of jabs inside, Pac attempts a long right hook to head (I think) and eats a straight right counter. ~8:20, Pac throws at least 2 body rips (looks like one from each hand, but partly obscured). Mayweather clinches and throws one shot. No more action until the bell. My overview of this round: Pacquiao used head movement, followed Mayweather to some extent, but overall looked somewhat tentative. He threw some jabs and used head and foot feints, but most of the jabs had nothing to dissuade Floyd. He threw shots with each hand, but those thrown with commitment were easily evaded and/or countered. 2016-08-30 update: From the start of round 2 we see Pacquiao pushing forward, stepping in with the jab, and even lunging in at least one case. Mayweather's response is to step backward, circle left or come in for a clinch and proceed with body rips. Of course there's a few straight shot counters, and stiff jabs to keep Manny off him. Manny looks to land a couple clean to the body. Initial impresison is Pac is still being frustrated by May. 10:52, 11:04, we see from Manny a few hooks and rips (head and body), including a clean left hook to Floyd's head and, at 11:07, a combo of 3 hooks by my count. After this we see Floyd keep more distance, mainly using straight shots whether advancing or retreating. There's a couple of long right hooks in there, and a left hook that hits air before Floyd hold onto Manny's head. After this, Manny returns to advancing with the jab, and Floyd evading or countering. There's also a lead right from Mayweather that lands flush. At 12:12, Pac leads with a jab that misses and throws another 3 in mid to close range we can hear connecting. Mayweather circles right and away, seemingly not bothered. That takes us almost to the table-knocking, and both guys paw and feint until Pac lunges and wildly swings just before the bell. Impressions of this round: Manny didn't have any obvious physical problem. He's thrown straight shots, hooks and rips, and perhaps one uppercut I noticed. He pushed the action as much as possible but was mostly frustrated by Floyd. Nothing surprising yet. Let's see what we find the longer and deeper we dig.


-stormcentre :

You're doing fine SL. Go forth my friend. Continue to set an example by using only the unedited, full length, and reliable versions, of the available MayPac fight-video-data. Continue to set an example by standing on your own 2 feet. Continue to set an example by rejecting any notion of throwing out excuses as a means to evade explaining and/or avoiding the task at hand. Continue to move forward, seek the truth, and . . . Step where Queens fear to tread.
Storm. :) :) :)


-Radam G :

The shadow is al Haymon's driver now. He is at peace.
Hehehe! You got jokes! Classic! The Shadow was hoping to get employed by tsAH. Holla!


-SuperLight :

Lads and lasses, I finally had a good look at round 2. Please feel free to offer your thoughts. Note I couldn't hear much of the coaches between rounds thanks to our commentators.


-Radam G :

Let's yet again begin dissecting the 2015 mega-fight that never was and yet refuses to die. Before the fight, I was barracking for Pacquiao, for several reasons, as I've probably stated before. He had built a legacy moving up in weight classes and fighting some big names. He was an exciting, aggressive, flurrying fighter at his best. He has a massive following worldwide and especially in S.E. Asia. In my opinion he's largely seen as a role model and "nice guy". A win for him would've been good for boxing as a sport. Impressions of this round: Manny didn't have any obvious physical problem. He's thrown straight shots, hooks and rips, and perhaps one uppercut I noticed. He pushed the action as much as possible but was mostly frustrated by Floyd. Nothing surprising yet. Let's see what we find the longer and deeper we dig.
Wow! If you knew boksing, and a bit about adrenaline, you'd know that Da Manny was not supposed to show any signs of a "physical problem." Real scraping pugs are not weak, soft bytches showing sign of even a bullet wound. Don't stereotype how one suppose to act because of a torn rotator. Melodrama syet is for the Big Screen. Great pugs are for playing great possums. The super-great Larry Holmes beat the late, great Kenny Norton for 12 intensed rounds with a torn rotator. Big Larry showed no sign of a physical problem. He raised both arms before and after the fight. And then just into a swimming pool to celebrate his victory. Holla at the film/video. I went way back before we were born just to show you that great pugs have never been fake bytches full of bulljive excuses. Lil Floyd barely beat a one-armed pug. And he doesn't need anybody to talk propaganda about da haps because he knew Da Manny's condition a month ahead of time. Let it go, mate! Lil Floyd won Bout I, and Bout II will be in 2017. Holla!


-stormcentre :

Wow! If you knew boksing, and a bit about adrenaline, you'd know that Da Manny was not supposed to show any signs of a "physical problem." Real scraping pugs are not weak, soft bytches showing sign of even a bullet wound. Don't stereotype how one suppose to act because of a torn rotator. Melodrama syet is for the Big Screen. Great pugs are for playing great possums. The super-great Larry Holmes beat the late, great Kenny Norton for 12 intended rounds with a torn rotator. Big Larry showed no sign of a physical problem. He raised both arms before and after the fight. And then just into a swimming to celebrate his victory. Holla at the film/video. I went way back before we were born just to show you that great pugs have never been fake bytches full of
bulljive excuses. Lil Floyd barely beat a one-armed pug. And he doesn't need anybody to talk propaganda about da haps because he knew Da Manny's condition a month ahead of time. Let it go, mate! Lil Floyd won Bout I, and Bout II will be in 2017. Holla!
Not sure that the claimed injury you attribute to Holmes' (as a means of explaining the widespread fear of stepping us through the MayPac fight and/or substantiating Pac's injury) was completely substantiated and/or as you describe. But, as you state above, bulljive excuses are not new are they? Cooney fought Holmes in 1982 with a torn rotator cuff and he was taken to hospital shortly after the fight. This serves as an indictor as to how serious rotator cuff injuries are and can be; especially after they are worked and/or ignored. Most reports state that Holmes had a torn bicep (not rotator cuff) before the Norton fight. A bicep muscle injury - whilst serious - is less important and less significant than a rotator cuff muscle injury. Not in the least, as the bicep muscle mostly facilitates only movement of the elbow joint in 1 plane and is - especially by comparison to the rotator cuff (Supraspinatus muscle and tendons) - reasonably isolated from nearby and possible shoulder related movement; whether that movement be direct or sympathetic.

This largely due to the fact that the bicep muscle really only controls the elbow joint and therefore it is only involved with the following 3 ranges of movement; (elbow) Flexion, (elbow) Extension, and (forearm) Supination.

Whereas the rotator cuff (Supraspinatus muscle and tendons) itself is far more difficult to isolate from (direct or sympathetic) shoulder related movement, and therefore it is easy to aggravate and become seriously *problematic when any *actions pertaining to the shoulder and its *surrounding areas are involved And boxing related movements involve many of these above-mentioned *actions - even when the arm that the shoulder is connected to is not active.

This is largely due to the fact that the shoulder joint is involved with the following 5 ranges of movement; Flexion, Extension, Adduction, Abduction and Medial Rotation.

This wider range of movement that the shoulder exhibits (which the rotator cuff {Supraspinatus muscle and tendons} facilitates and/or is a part of) means that it is far more difficult to prevent a rotator cuff injury from being aggravated and exacerbated when it and/or its surrounding (opposite shoulder) areas are being used. What all this means is that (and this is why the MayPac video is lonely) very, very, rarely will anyone have a significant rotator cuff (Supraspinatus muscle and tendons) injury - especially one that requires an injection and one that also forms as the basis for a PacLossExcuse - and still with it all be able to engage in any vigorous sporting activity (let alone combat sports) for 45 minutes and . . . . both during and also at the end of that violent activity show absolutely no signs of difficulty and/or the injury itself. Yet Pac did all this, and then - seemingly - also disregarded all normal rehabilitation methods too; SaltWaterJesus. Amazing eh? :) Furthermore, Holmes' doctor (whom provided both medical assistance/treatment to Holmes prior to the Norton V Holmes fight) wanted to stop/postpone the bout. That is what any professional practitioner would do/say had they been presented with a rotator cuff injury by a competing boxer. Clearly though (and this is where the comparison between Holmes and Pac - for the purpose of explaining why the PacLossExcuse and all its satellite excuses can't be explained - falls apart even further) Holmes - unlike Pac - did not simply withhold his bicep injury - then claim he required an injection for it just prior to the Norton V Holmes fight - only to fail to receive the requested injection - but nonetheless still go on to perform within the fight as if the requested injection were not ever really required - by (as Pac did) displaying absolutely no signs of ever having the injury. Nope, Holmes did not do this. In fact, not even when Holmes' opponent (Cooney) leaned on him and/or the injury (as was the case for Pac within the MayPac fight), which - for a rotator cuff injury - would be a certain cause for visible pain and discomfort . . . . did Holmes ever show absolutely no signs of the injury being aggravated by it being directly impacted. Yet, this was the case when Pac was leaned on by Floyd within the MayPac fight. You see . . . (one of) the (many) problems with the PacLossExcuse is not just how it is endlessly furnished with new excuse after misdirecting new excuse - nor is it how obvious those subscribing to the PacLossExcuse can't explain it, themselves, and/or the requirement for all the excuses . . . . It's the fact that if the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (it didn't receive) prior to using the injury . . . . . Then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage. Remember, it was so bad Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that he committed fraud. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney after his fight; a trip to hospital and all details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen did it? So, even if Holmes had torn a rotator cuff (which was not the case) the comparison Random seeks to make (and we all know why he seeks to make it) would probably fall apart for all the above reasons. However none of that happened for SaltWaterJesus. And subsequently all we are left with is (as proven by Random's last post) an endless stream of PacQueen excuses as to why such a significant injury - and one attributed to being the reason for a PacLoss - cant be identified. Not in any reasonable sense of the word. Please also note that Holmes' injury (unlike Pac's) was not claimed to be a reason for a loss. Yet, (unlike Pac) Holmes' substantiated his injury both before and after the Norton fight. Even to date - as far as substantiating his PacLossExcuseInjury - all Pac has done is . . . . . . Nothing. Zip. Nada. OK . . . With all that said, the last sentence/paragraph of your post does make sense.

""Let it go, mate! Lil Floyd won.""

Especially if no-one can meaningfully explain/answer as to why all we have is hunches, feelings, an endless stream of excuses, and an obvious fear of substantiation, in relation to this PacLossExcuseInjury matter and the lonely MayPac video.
Storm. :) :)


-KO Digest :

It was never a real retirement to begin with. Manny Pacquiao is the world welterweight champion. He (#1) beat (#2) Bradley to fill the vacancy of Floyd, who really retired.


-SuperLight :

Let it go, mate! Lil Floyd won Bout I, and Bout II will be in 2017. Holla!
I won't be leaving it alone. I'll do my part to find the truth, thanks very much. If there's a rematch, all the best to Manny. I don't predict much different next time around.


-stormcentre :

When Marsellus was startled by Butch in a certain scene of Pulp Fiction, he uttered a phrase that cannot be printed here. Just imagine that "MF" word in Ving Rhames's voice, because that was my first thought. So back to the MayPac debacle, I don't know which muscle, tendon or ligament Pac was supposed to have injured. I can only say from experience I did one of my own, and could barely lift my arm at a certain angle, let alone shoot a jab. I did a couple of sessions with my coach in that state, and it still hurt like mad afterwards. It took time and a lot of care to get it back. I imagine "spirited" sparring, let alone a bout the import of one against Mayweather, would cause a deal of pain. I won't be leaving it alone. I'll do my part to find the truth, thanks very much. If there's a rematch, all the best to Manny. I don't predict much different next time around.
You're doing fine SL. Good job for stepping up to the plate. It's a lot harder to wade through the video and produce a narrative (whether it be controversial or not) based on fact, than it is to throw out a claim, giggle and run. If anyone wants to discredit or critique your (or my) efforts then as far as I am concerned they are welcome to, but unless they can assess the MayPac video themselves and explain their concerns about your interpretations of it within that (referenced) context, then it's just the same background noise. Cheers,
Storm. :) :)


-Radam G :

When Marsellus was startled by Butch in a certain scene of Pulp Fiction, he uttered a phrase that cannot be printed here. Just imagine that "MF" word in Ving Rhames's voice, because that was my first thought. So back to the MayPac debacle, I don't know which muscle, tendon or ligament Pac was supposed to have injured. I can only say from experience I did one of my own, and could barely lift my arm at a certain angle, let alone shoot a jab. I did a couple of sessions with my coach in that state, and it still hurt like mad afterwards. It took time and a lot of care to get it back. I imagine "spirited" sparring, let alone a bout the import of one against Mayweather, would cause a deal of pain.
Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!


-KO Digest :

I can't hardly write with a hangnail let alone fight under those conditions!


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Norton fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Norton's and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Norton (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say they and Pac can, for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to. To recap; Norton tore his bicep - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a broken back. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Ken Norton (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Ken Norton substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Norton fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Norton's and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Norton (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say they and Pac can, for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to. To recap; Norton tore his bicep - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a broken back. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac (and now also the great Willie Pep) is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Ken Norton (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Ken Norton substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Norton fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Norton's and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Norton (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say they and Pac can, for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to. To recap; Norton tore his bicep - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a previously sustained broken back and/or serious rotator cuff injury. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac (and now also the great Willie Pep) is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Ken Norton (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Ken Norton substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Norton fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney (and his rotator cuff injury) after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Norton's and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Norton (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say they and Pac can, for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to. To recap; Norton tore his bicep - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a previously sustained broken back and/or serious rotator cuff injury. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac (and now also the great Willie Pep) is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Ken Norton (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Ken Norton substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Norton fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney (and his rotator cuff injury) after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest*, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Norton's and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Norton (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say they and Pac can, for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to. To recap; Norton tore his bicep - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a previously sustained broken back and/or serious rotator cuff injury. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac (and now also the great Willie Pep) is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Ken Norton (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Ken Norton substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Wow! You have never been at that uber level of greatness is my assumption. So you never be able to fight with a torn rotator cup like a late, great Vernon "Viper" Forrest or a Larry Holmes. Nor will you ever be able to fight with a broken jaw like a late, great GOAT Ali and tons of other greats. Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did. I can keep going, but I won't. My friend, you are apparently not a super human athlete. Super humans do exist, you know. Holla at YouTube and hit super humans, and you will find tons that do syet that no mere mortal like yourself can do. And you probably don't believe that. Holla!
So, does this mean you are still (aside from being unable to step us through the MayPac video and prove your PacLossExcuse point, whilst at the same time attacking others like SL that do have the stones to do so, and do so well) running with the fable that Holmes fought with a torn rotator cuff; when that was not the injury he had and what really happened is described in the below linked post #79?


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Does it also mean that you're skipping over the consideration that . . . . . If the PacLossExcuseInjury was so bad that it - without doubt - required an injection (that it didn't receive) prior to using the injury then one would reasonably expect the injury to manifest itself in use and/or as a visible disadvantage? Remember, it was (claimed to be) so bad that Pac needed an injection prior to performing and using it so desperately that Pac committed fraud to get that juice. So, in the very least one would expect that, after the injection requiring injury was used for 12 rounds (without the requested injection), the same thing might occur to Pac as did Cooney (and his rotator cuff injury) after his fight; a trip to hospital and all [sup]
~[/sup]details about the injury made public. But that didn't happen. Additionally, and in the true PacQueen form of galloping away from questionable claims, releasing gas, and also introducing an endless array of excuses and fantasy claims that trail in your wakes - where each claim disregards fact as much - if not more - than that which Queened before it; I see you have introduced yet another *fantasy "in-fight" rotator cuff injury. Rather than acknowledge all your previous oversights on this matter . . . . . Themselves all serving as a means to cover the inability to (actually do what SL is doing) and prove your point. Now let's look at your newly minted fantasy claim pertaining to;


A) Not only, facilitating the continuation of avoiding the provision of anything that remotely resembles a meaningful PacLossExcuse explanation with the provided MayPac video SL is using.
B) But also, the supposed newly minted theory pertaining to [sup]
~[/sup]Forrest*, and see whether (even if we accept it as you serve it up) it compares to Pac in the way you hope for - is not just another fictional fabrication - and/or whether Vernon visited a hospital and verified his injury and/or used it as a loss-excuse.

Needless to say, even at this point there is probably no point in asking . . .

""Can you please explain to us all what fight Vernon Forrest actually had that he went into with a torn rotator cuff (and injection requiring) injury and (despite not getting the injection) fought without any noticeable problem in""?

Yes, Forrest had a torn rotator cuff injury,
but he took two years off from fighting because of that injury How much time has Pac had off? Additionally, and as is well documented, Forrest had complete reconstructive surgery on his rotator cuff injury - which involved multiple surgeries on his shoulder and a proper/lengthy rehabilitation process. Where is the documentation related to Pac's (PacLossExcuse) injury, the resulting surgery, and the rehabilitation process, that you so regularly fail to (even begin to) explain; preferring instead to (always) furnish us with - not just one, but - several seriously lame, incomplete, and utterly transparent/misdirecting excuses after the other? Furthermore, has Forrest ever used his injuries as a means to explain a loss in a fight where he claimed he had no injuries? So, we see . . . . Forrest's story - like Holmes' and almost all those that you and Queens wheel out about this matter - is very, very, different to both how you have served it up, intend it to be used, and also that of (how you say, without ever properly explaining) Pac's PacLossExcuse supposedly is. As for your comments about . . . .

""Nor could you fight blinded in one eye like late greats Harry Greb, Smokin' Joe Frazier and Jimmy Ellis did. And don't even think about doing the darn thing totally blinded like the late, great Sam Langford did. And forget about scrapping a few months after you broke your back as Vinny Paz and the late, great Willie Pep did.""

They're laughable. They do not serve the context of the discussion in hand; not even in the way you hope they will. Everybody knows that sportsmen can withstand limitations and pain and still continue to perform. But the question is not about that Random. The question - aside from why PacQueens can't properly explain themselves and their PacLossExcuses nearly as good as they run from the issue and rely on an endless stream of atmospheric excuses - is, where is the evidence (as - contrary to your claims - is really the case with other fighter's similar injuries and circumstances) that Pac had this extreme injection requiring and loss explaining injury that was so bad that it;


A) Supposedly serves as a PacLossExcuse in the world's biggest boxing fight.
B) Urgently - in the context of fraud and multiple writs - required an injection beforehand; but didn't receive it.
C) Still, never visibly manifested itself before and throughout the whole fight, and also afterwards at the presser; despite never receiving the much needed injection.
D) Has never been substantiated.

To date, no Queen can meaningfully and directly answer these questions nearly as good as they run from them. And this is proven, not just by the history of this PacLossExcuse matter and how frequently (even just in this thread) almost all the excuses that are wheeled out are exposed and then almost immediately deserted as soon as questions arrive on the horizon - but also by how completely full of holes your above/latest (excuse riddled) post is; and fear not as that claim is something that I will substantiate within this very post of mine. So, please don't go anywhere. So . . . even if we (suspend logic and) accept your fictional Holmes (rotator cuff injury) and other (questionable) examples in the form that you laughably serve them up to us, the fact of the matter is (even without considering how you can never explain any of your excuses when they're scrutinized) they still don't align with and/or show us how someone can do the supposedly superhuman feats that you say - for the purpose of attributing all your PacLossExcuse actions to - that both they and Pac can. To recap; Holmes tore his bicep (actually it was bicep tissue) - not (as you claim) his rotator cuff; and this and how/why it matters is detailed within the below post of mine.


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Additionally, yes, Muhammad Ali did sustain a broken jaw within one of his fights. But, (unlike what is claimed of Pac's PacLossExcuse injury) Ali didn't go into the fight with a broken jaw; let alone after not receiving an injection for it that he requested. So, even if it was not an anatomically different part of the body to that which we're discussing; it's a completely different scenario. Furthermore, the broken jaw noticeably changed Ali's in-fight game-plan - it became visible as the fight wore on - and also the injury was later verified; all unlike Pac's claimed PacLossExcuseInjury that has never been witnessed and/or substantiated.
As far as your broken back examples are concerned; aside from them merely proving how little is understood about serious skeletal/muscular injuries, is there any chance you can you please elaborate to us all whom fought whom and went into, and/or sustained such an injury within, the fight with a broken back; whether or not they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested? I note you fail to detail these relevant points; preferring instead to (again) use loose and questionable claims/references to cover those before them. I know a lot about broken backs and torn rotator cuff injuries. I have extreme suspicions (more than those pertaining to a rotator cuff injury) about anyone going into a 10 round (or more) boxing fight (as you suggest Willie Pep did) and successfully completing the duration of that contest with a previously sustained broken back and/or serious rotator cuff injury. Let alone them doing it without any signs of the injury - as Pac (and now also the great Willie Pep) is claimed (by you) to have done !!!! Not even if the fighter consumed all the magical remedies and potions you cooked up on a campfire whilst donned with all your favorite feathered WitchDoctor headgear on, could anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. Let alone without showing some signs of limitation and pain and/or after they failed to receive an injection for it that was requested. In fact, I doubt there is such an injection that could be provided for anyone - with a truly broken vertebrae - that would enable them to enter into a championship boxing contest and reasonably compete in that contest. To do so would risk death and/or paraplegia. This is because, aside from thousands of nerves that (very effectively convey pain and) reside around your spine and vertebrae; your spinal cord runs right through a cavity within your spine and vertebrae.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Willie Pep In 1947, Willie Pep was involved in a plane crash around the New Jersey area that killed 3 people and injured just under 20. In that accident Pep is said to have broken two of his vertebrae, fractured his left leg and also sustained severe chest injuries. As a result Pep spent many months living inside of leg and a body casts. Once Pep had properly recovered he resumed his fighting career and cemented his place amongst the all-time greats. Because Pep - once he had properly recovered - won almost 30 fights in a row straight after the plane crash and because he did the first 7 fights in just under 70 days, sometimes these incredible feats became distorted, sensationalized, and taken out of context. Sound familiar Random? At the heights of these sensationalistic distortions wild stories were abound. As a result some foolishly claimed/thought that Pep achieved his recovery within the aforementioned 70 day time period (when it was only his first 7 victories that were achieved within that timeframe). Others allowed fiction to incorrectly illustrate that Pep also won all ~30 fights (after the plane crash) within the 70 day time period. Like many of your stories on this matter Random; very few of these sensationalistic distortions stand up to scrutiny and/or are true.

Pep therefore - unlike how your claims suggest;


1) Did not fight with a broken back - he fought "after" he had recovered from the back injury.
2) Is not an example that explains your PacLossExcuse theories and/or your inability to explain that excuse whilst instead preferring to offer lame excuse after lame excuse.
3) Unlike Pac; substantiated his injury.
4) Unlike Pac; rehabilitated his injury.
5) Unlike what Pac is said to have done; didn't enter into a boxing contest with a comparable (injection requiring) injury and (despite not receiving the injection still) compete in it without exhibiting any signs of discomfort whatsoever. In fact - and this goes directly to my above comments about how serious a broken back really is - just as much as it makes a mockery out of your related claims that suggest anyone could compete with a truly broken back within a 10 round fight and display no visible signs of the injury; some reports state that - even after Pep had recovered - he still showed signs of discomfort when performing/boxing. Such is the seriousness of a back injury.



Therefore, to suggest that anyone with a broken back could enter a professional boxing contest and compete within it without showing any signs of discomfort when performing; is - even for someone that conjures up fast-handed watermelon seed elixirs - simply barking at the moon wild. But to do that as a means of misdirecting away from all the already released wild PacLossExcuses and other fictional claims that are clearly designed to cover up the real reason why the fantasy claims before them cant be explained . . . . Well that's another addiction and story all together isn't it? Still, there are help lines for this kind of thing so all is not lost. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The rest of your claims that I have not directly addressed should all be considered in the same light as those I have above addressed. Basically you're full of stink on this matter Random. And I politely suggest that is why you prefer to serve up lame excuse after lame excuse and attack SL for doing what it is you're unable and unwilling to do; review the MayPac video and substantiate your longstanding and completely unsubstantiated PacLossExcuse claims. Still, this should come as no surprise. As, there is less shame in being caught out for continually wheeling out questionable claims - than that pertaining to you yourself explicitly confirming that you have designed and deeply invested in the same kinds of longstanding fraud that Pac himself used to either fake or exaggerate an injury; the infamous PacLossExcuse and all it really means. Therefore . . . . As I said within my post #9


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=101393&viewfull=1#post101393

And exposed here post #79. . . .


->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?272163214-Pacquiao-Retirement-Lasts-Less-Than-6-Months&p=102441&viewfull=1#post102441

Brilliant post. Incredibly imaginative piece of writing. Even incorporating his own selective interpretation and uncontrolled delusions into it !!!! Wow !!!! In summary;


A) Larry Holmes (contrary to your claims) didn't have a rotator cuff injury and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Larry Holmes substantiated his bicep muscle injury before/after the fight in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the bicep injury.
B) Willie Pep (contrary to your claims) didn't fight with a broken back and/or have an experience with his injury that compares with Pac in the way you PacLossExcuse want it to. Willie Pep substantiated his back injury before the fight (you fail to detail) in question - it was a different injury to the one that Pac and Queens use as a PacLossExcuse - and furthermore, none of the controversial and clandestine behaviors, such as that Pac has shown, was associated with the back injury.
C) Almost all of your other claims - including those pertaining to Forrest and Ali - are not applicable and/or questionable for all the above stated reasons.

Still gotta say . . . No-one writes stink, believes in it, and continually tries to pass it off as perfume and flowers, quite like you. I mean - despite always running and always being busted - you still never fail to really, really, portray the impression that you believe what you write; doesn't stink. Great skill. Thanks for the laughs. Best wishes,
Storm. :) :)


-Kid Blast :

Holy moley


-SuperLight :

Holy moley
Dang straight. Radam, I didn't claim to be a pro, let alone a superhuman. In fact, I've clearly stated my experience in this thread and possibly elsewhere. All I was saying is, from my experience, and what I've heard from others, a shoulder injury tends to be a big deal for a boxer. Stormcentre's elaborated far more eloquently and with more anatomical knowledge than I possess at the moment. There should be others here who know about it from a medical and/or training perspective. So if Pac's injury was severe enough to require some kind of drug, but not so severe to have an obvious effect on his fight, it smells like something... fish or schei?e, you take your pick. I'm still looking for evidence of a physical limitation, a change of game plan and/or intensity, a word from coach or a grimace during exertion as evidence of the injury in question. If anyone else finds it, please point it out with reference to time elapsed in the captioned vid. Otherwise bear with me and I'll continue the digging.


-Radam G :

Dang straight. Radam, I didn't claim to be a pro, let alone a superhuman. In fact, I've clearly stated my experience in this thread and possibly elsewhere. All I was saying is, from my experience, and what I've heard from others, a shoulder injury tends to be a big deal for a boxer. Stormcentre's elaborated far more eloquently and with more anatomical knowledge than I possess at the moment. There should be others here who know about it from a medical and/or training perspective. So if Pac's injury was severe enough to require some kind of drug, but not so severe to have an obvious effect on his fight, it smells like something... fish or schei?e, you take your pick. I'm still looking for evidence of a physical limitation, a change of game plan and/or intensity, a word from coach or a grimace during exertion as evidence of the injury in question. If anyone else finds it, please point it out with reference to time elapsed in the captioned vid. Otherwise bear with me and I'll continue the digging.
I was being facetious. And never said that you were a pro. And the troll is a POS and FOS. There are facilities in Hong Kong where you can meet live greats and boxing experts. And they will welcome you and school you. Even average pugs fight with and overcome injuries. Matter of fact, injuries are expected. Even Money May beat a pug when he -- Money May -- had a severely injured shoulder and hand early in his career. Real pugs do da syet, not bullsyet and troll on cyberspace. You are not going to find "evidence of a physical limitation" on film. Real boxers hide syet in dat squared jungle and are not trolling pu$$ies in cyberspace. Real boxers know when another pug is likely suffering from an injury. Don't expect for a bytch-arse troll to know syet, but his continuing fakery. I'm not trying to win you over for syet. But just know that real knows real. And steel sharpen steel. A troll is just a disturbed heel. Holla!


-Radam G :

BTW, Superlight. I hope you have your best rhymes together day and night. I will be starting my paid contest before long. So with your best poems, you will have to come strong. Pops Butterfly lives on. Holla!


-stormcentre :

I was being facetious. And never said that you were a pro. And the troll is a POS and FOS. There are facilities in Hong Kong where you can meet live greats and boxing experts. And they will welcome you and school you. Even average pugs fight with and overcome injuries. Matter of fact, injuries are expected. Even Money May beat a pug when he -- Money May -- had a severely injured shoulder and hand early in his career. Real pugs do da syet, not bullsyet and troll on cyberspace. You are not going to find "evidence of a physical limitation" on film. Real boxers hide syet in dat squared jungle and are not trolling pu$$ies in cyberspace. Real boxers know when another pug is likely suffering from an injury. Don't expect for a bytch-arse troll to know syet, but his continuing fakery. I'm not trying to win you over for syet. But just know that real knows real. And steel sharpen steel. A troll is just a disturbed heel. Holla!
I love you too Random. No donkey releases obnoxious gases like you, inhales it, enjoys it, and also continuously attempts to sell it to others as perfume and flowers; no matter how often he is caught out. You're a real fast learner. Lightening in a bottle Academia meets Einstein. That said, by God you're good value in the humor stakes though. . . Please remember though . . . . And I know (even if the subject is not getting busted for stretching the truth as often as you so regularly do) nonetheless you're still a real fast learner . . . . But . . . Remember . . . . If you don't like being exposed for the porky pies, then you can always stop lying and try the truth. :) Or to out it another way . . . . . People whom live in glass jaws should not open mouth without thinking (with single digit IQ?) and throw wild punches. "Cha-ching" There goes all that fine china. Even you should know better than to come to the finest boxing forum on the planet and expect to not to get your azz kicked for the porkies you have been selling. Particularly with (your track record and) those porkies you authored about the great Willie Pep. I am pi$$ing myself laughing as I type this. But . . . God you're good . . . Look, I don't smoke grass - but I reckon not much would come close - humorously that is - to sitting down - blowing a joint - and letting you believe that I believed in all your stories - and just watching and listening to you tell them over and over throughout the course of an evening.


-
Willie Pep fights with a broken back . . . yep !!!!!

Just leave out the fact that Pep was recovered before he fought though.


-
Holmes fights with a torn rotator cuff . . . yep !!!!!

Just leave out the fact it was not a rotator cuff injury and simply a bicep tissue tear that was, despite being misreported, substantiated.


-
Forrest fights with a torn rotator cuff . . . yep !!!!!

Just leave out the fact Forrest substantiated his injury, took 2 years of to have the rotator cuff injury addressed, and instead pretend Vernon fought with the injury in full swing.

All, just for the sake of an eternally drowning and obviously hopeless PacLossExcuse . . . . that you're obviously just too scared to even spend 1/100th of that time you spend on excuses, to properly substantiate.
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Watermelon juice that makes people punch faster; so long as you don't ask for proof.
-
ImAPacEntourage; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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DoubleWorldChampion; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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30 thousand times per minute cinnamon circulation; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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Moonlight that makes hair grow back; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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Glacial milk that cures cancer; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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Wallach's Credentials Speak 4 Themselves Thread; so long as you don't ask for proof.
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FloydGetKO'd by Pac.
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FloydSwimScared.
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FloydChopBadWood.
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ImAnAcademia2.
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iKnowEveryIotaOfBosking.

And the list goes on to way beyond 100 outrageous claims. That are all simply galloped away from just as much as they are both, swallowed up by those that assist you and also questionable examples of a never ending, but eternally hilarious, delusion; that I thank you for. God I love it . . . . You're a scream almost as much as you are a permanent stranger to the truth. Lots of love,
Storm :) :) :)