LOTIERZO LOWDOWN: “Cotto Beat An Empty Package in Geale”

Cotto’s Showing Against Geale Means Nothing For What’s Next

This past weekend lineal middleweight champ Miguel Cotto 40-4 (34) took apart former alphabet title holder Daniel Geale 31-4 (16) at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn New York.

Cotto looked terrific during the first three rounds of the fight boxing the taller Geale from the outside and then picking his spots and going on the offensive with his vaunted left hooks to the head and body. In the fourth round Miguel dropped Geale twice and you could see Daniel was visibly hurt and shook badly. Geale beat the count after the second knockdown, but once on his feet he told referee Harvey Dock that he’d had enough and willingly accepted that Cotto was the better man on this night.

The fight was contested at 157 pounds because team Cotto insisted upon it. During the week leading up to the fight there was some negative debate pertaining to catch-weight bouts, something that I relished hearing because I truly despise them. They’re a joke and prove nothing. However, prior to the start of the fight during the HBO preview, commentators Jim Lampley and Max Kellerman addressed how team Cotto felt about the negative connotation regarding the fight being contested at 157 instead of the 160 pound middleweight limit. Their attitude was after Miguel looks great demolishing Geale, and he did, everyone will be talking about how Cotto is back and a real threat to Saul “Canelo” Alvarez and WBA middleweight title holder Gennady Golovkin, and they are right. Today Cotto’s showing is the buzz.

Well here comes the cold water and reality check…

As most boxing fans know, Gennady Golovkin stopped Daniel Geale in the third round of their title bout 11 months ago. Only they fought at 160. For the Cotto bout, Geale weighed in at 157 and then on the day of the fight he scaled 182 with street clothes on. To most that doesn’t seem like much of a big deal, after-all, he was probably 176 when he stepped in the ring for the fight, and that’s well over the middleweight limit……Well, the big deal is Geale looked like a skeleton at the weigh in and everybody saw it. On fight night he was that same skeleton with 20 pounds of fluid. Daniel looked shopworn standing in the ring warming up. He certainly wasn’t the same fighter who fought Golovkin in July of last year.

For the fight with Cotto, Daniel Geale was a sacrificial lamb, and he knowingly accepted that role because of the middleweight title being on the line and the money on the table. However, he was an empty package in the ring and everybody saw it. Geale, even when at full strength, is not much of a puncher; against Cotto, not only was he even more feather-fisted than usual, but he had no rhythm or timing.

He looked totally out of sort from the onset. And once Miguel felt him a little bit and realized there was nothing to him physically, he raised the rent and picked up the aggression because there was nothing coming back at him that deterred him in the least. So the left hooks came more frequently with badder intentions. And when they started to crash land, Geale began to flinch more and Cotto fed off of that. By the fourth round Cotto was bringing the fight to an opponent who might as well been handcuffed, that’s how much he feared the weakened Geale. After going down twice, Geale realized that he had nothing physically and chose not to continue getting slaughtered and punched around for what probably wasn’t a king’s ransom regarding his purse.

Has anyone ever noticed that in these catch-weight bouts it’s usually the guy who went down in weight that loses? This is the sole intention of them. Yes, Miguel Cotto looked great taking apart Geale. He boxed beautifully from both inside and outside. His punches were crisp and carried explosive power when they landed. He didn’t have to hit Geale many times to grasp that Daniel wanted to be somewhere else instead of where he was.

The fight achieved the result it was supposed to. Cotto won and looked terrific. Now the fight with Canelo will be made and it’ll be a huge draw. It always is when the biggest Mexican star in boxing confronts the biggest Puerto Rican star in boxing. Cotto and Alvarez have been on a collision course for about two years now. And both have handled their business well and looked great in their last bouts winning by an impressive stoppage. However, I think Cotto’s showing is more of a mirage. And let me say I’m a huge Cotto fan. He’s a real fighter and has always been willing to fight the best of the best. At this stage of his career I don’t begrudge him for fighting as a businessman first – he’s earned that. But at the same time I have to call it like I see it. And this past weekend Cotto beat up a melted down middleweight who he matched up with perfectly.

Everybody knew going in that Cotto was the superior fighter and technician, which bore itself out a minute into the bout. The only advantage Geale had was presumed size and strength, which he was robbed of in the weeks before the fight trying to make 157. Again, once Cotto felt Geale had nothing physically, he went right in and closed the show impressively. Which of course was the desired result and why that particular fight was made.

On Sunday morning after the fight, Cotto is a real threat to Alvarez and Golovkin in the eyes of many and trainer Frdddie Roach is a miracle worker…well, I just don’t buy that. Cotto beat an empty package in Daniel Geale fighting a WWE sanctioned bout.

Mark my words, when Cotto faces Alvarez, he will get beat up like he did against Manny Pacquiao even with Freddie Roach in his corner. He can’t play the catch-weight game with Alvarez, who destroyed James Kirkland as a junior middleweight. Cotto’s lineal title will be on the line for Alvarez, which means they’ll fight between 154 and 157, which is perfect for Alvarez. And if for some reason Cotto and Alvarez don’t get together because they are both divas and will bicker over the purse, he’ll have to turn to Golovkin. And if that fight happens, Golovkin will put Cotto in the fourth row of the press sitting ringside. That is unless Golovkin has to come in at 156 or 157. Cotto is a manufactured middleweight and gamed the system against Geale.

As terrific as Cotto looked this past weekend fighting Daniel Geale, he didn’t show me he he has anything to better Alvarez or Golovkin.

Frank Lotierzo can be reached at GlovedFist@Gmail.com

PHOTO CREDIT: Tom Hogan – Hoganphotos/Roc Nation Sports/Miguel Cotto Promotions

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COMMENTS

-New York Tony :

Agree with every word, including "and" and "the."


-stormcentre :

Good, honest, and accurate article. About time someone shone a light on this scam. Roach has been doing this with some of his fighters for years, and given Roaches' health and the dangers of catch-weights I am surprised that Freddie thinks it's a neat trick. Still, money often allows some to push principles to one side; no matter how well understood they are. A good question may be; how can Cotto have delivered a great performance when he needed such an advantage? Even if it was not (disgracefully) Miguel's first middleweight title defence. Harry Greb (and many other modern middleweights) would - particularly if given the opportunity to talk freely and honestly - laugh at Cotto and all that think his achievement last weekend was special. And, I too picked up on the crass Roach is a miracle worker commentary after the fight; pleeeease. Roach has, worryingly, been using catch-weights for years now to promote; his, his fighters, the networks, and certain promoters' interests. And that - not Roaches' ability to develop fighters techniques into something spectacular (yeh right, like it's hard to get a guy that's as well schooled as Cotto to bring back his {lost?} left hook; which is really all that Freddy is said to have done with Cotto and been hailed for) - is really one of the main reasons Freddy is popular; along with the fact that in using catch-weights in this manner and doing "anything" necessary (regardless of the principles) to get the win means - to fighters - that Freddie is aligned with the right promoters, networks, and therefore "opportunities". Remember, we're talking the same guy that "set up" Mickey Rourkes' fight in Russia. Same guy that has extensively used catch-weights for Pac when he was also - as far as Roach and Arum themselves are concerned - on the juice. And that's just a small list of interesting considerations. All Roach has (mostly) done for Cotto is become a voice of authority within his training, preparation and fighting routines. Prior to Roach - but not before Miguel's father passed away - Cotto called the shots and corners were cut. Now that's changed. Cotto was the complete package - for his fighting style - when he walked in the door of the Wild Card gym. Just as an example; check out his style and particularly how beautiful his hooks were (and how he would step forward and into those that were perfectly timed against opponents; dramatically increasing their impact) in his fights with Carlos Maussa right through to Ricardo Torres. It's not that long ago that Cotto has forgotten, how much having to cut weight and meet the Roach designed catch-weight for Miguel's fight with Pacquaio, diminished and hurt him; providing Pacquaio with yet another win via catch-weights. I suggest that it is no accident that - now Cotto and Roach are together - using catch-weights has been - again - used to good effect; this time to benefit Miguel, Roach, Roc Nation, and HBO. Finally, it's an interesting coincidence that last night I was genuinely thinking that it's "funny" how - now that Roach and a few others using catch-weights is becoming really popular - it's almost always the guy that has to cut the weight and/or fight out of his comfort/weight zone/class that loses. Then, I log on to TSS today, and Frank had written the very same words. Action at a distance? ESP? MK Ultra?
StormCentre?
PS: you can buy boxing bags full of water, punch them with all the confidence in the world, and look good doing it too. Given the poundage that Geale's body swung between (~25 pounds in 5 days before the fight) and absorbed, it's highly debatable that Cotto (and Roach) did anything more than that. Happy to hear - from anyone - how this view is not fair, reasonable, and just.


-stormcentre :

Good, honest, and accurate article. About time someone shone a light on this scam. Roach has been doing this with some of his fighters for years, and given Roaches' health and the dangers of catch-weights I am surprised that Freddie thinks it's a neat trick. Still, money often allows some to push principles to one side; no matter how well understood they are. A good question may be; how can Cotto have delivered a great performance when he needed such an advantage? Even if it was not (disgracefully) Miguel's first middleweight title defence. Harry Greb (and many other modern middleweights) would - particularly if given the opportunity to talk freely and honestly - laugh at Cotto and all that think his achievement last weekend was special. And, I too picked up on the crass Roach is a miracle worker commentary after the fight; pleeeease. Roach has, worryingly, been using catch-weights for years now to promote; his, his fighters, the networks, and certain promoters' interests. And that - not Roaches' ability to develop fighters techniques into something spectacular (yeh right, like it's hard to get a guy that's as well schooled as Cotto to bring back his {lost?} left hook; which is really all that Freddy is said to have done with Cotto and been hailed for) - is really one of the main reasons Freddy is popular; along with the fact that in using catch-weights in this manner and doing "anything" necessary (regardless of the principles) to get the win means - to fighters - that Freddie is aligned with the right promoters, networks, and therefore "opportunities". Remember, we're talking the same guy that "set up" Mickey Rourkes' fight in Russia. Same guy that has extensively used catch-weights for Pac when he was also - as far as Roach and Arum themselves are concerned - on the juice. And that's just a small list of interesting considerations. All Roach has (mostly) done for Cotto is become a voice of authority within his training, preparation and fighting routines. Prior to Roach - but not before Miguel's father passed away - Cotto called the shots and corners were cut. Now that's changed. Cotto was the complete package - for his fighting style - when he walked in the door of the Wild Card gym. Just as an example; check out his style and particularly how beautiful his hooks were (and how he would step forward and into those that were perfectly timed against opponents; dramatically increasing their impact) in his fights with Carlos Maussa right through to Ricardo Torres. It's not that long ago that Cotto has forgotten, how much having to cut weight and meet the Roach designed catch-weight for Miguel's fight with Pacquaio, diminished and hurt him; providing Pacquaio with yet another win via catch-weights. I suggest that it is no accident that - now Cotto and Roach are together - using catch-weights has been - again - used to good effect; this time to benefit Miguel, Roach, Roc Nation, and HBO. Finally, it's an interesting coincidence that last night I was genuinely thinking that it's "funny" how - now that Roach and a few others using catch-weights is becoming really popular - it's almost always the guy that has to cut the weight and/or fight out of his comfort/weight zone/class that loses. Then, I log on to TSS today, and Frank had written the very same words. Action at a distance? ESP? MK Ultra?
StormCentre?
PS: you can buy boxing bags full of water, punch them with all the confidence in the world, and look good doing it too. Given the poundage that Geale's body swung between (~25 pounds in 5 days before the fight) and absorbed, it's highly debatable that Cotto (and Roach) did anything more than that. Happy to hear - from anyone - how this view is not fair, reasonable, and just.


-Radam G :

Nice putting it out there. Optical illusions are everywhere. That is how da game roll a lot of times. I'm glad that super pugilistic scribe F-Lo put it out there, because the same words would have gotten fakers and posers all up in my grill. And da suckas cannot climb a molehill. They need to holla at some dill. From the jump -- as I said -- Geale was going to get crushed like a pill. Dude fought like he was standing still. But somehow some claim that he was more energetic than an energy-making windmill. NYET! Geale was picked for the mission of an easy arse thrashing. How could anyone not see that he would be crashing? Also, he was picked to make M-Co look dashing. Holla!


-DaveB :

All we want is a fair one.


-amayseng :

Great write up Frank


-john Burns :

I must agree that Cotto beat a drained Geale which should concern every fight fan. Cotto claims to be the middleweight champion of the world but won't fight anyone at 160. If he won't fight at 160 he should be stripped of the middleweight title. He has no intention of getting anywhere near GGG and on the day the sanctioning body requires him to do so he will give up the title rather than make the fight.


-Radam G :

I must agree that Cotto beat a drained Geale which should concern every fight fan. Cotto claims to be the middleweight champion of the world but won't fight anyone at 160. If he won't fight at 160 he should be stripped of the middleweight title. He has no intention of getting anywhere near GGG and on the day the sanctioning body requires him to do so he will give up the title rather than make the fight.
One thing about being the champ, in any division, he dictates the agreed-upon weight. Pugs have always done that. So this is not a Cotto thing. It's boksing. And I think that fans and pundits are focus on so-called "catch weights" because the scribes had a slow day and use their genius to stir up something to get the fans and pundits to stick around and believe a new shady thing was happening in our shady sport. NYET! Coining that phrase "catch weight" has grab fans and pundits like white on rice. Holla!


-amayseng :

One thing about being the champ, in any division, he dictates the agreed-upon weight. Pugs have always done that. So this is not a Cotto thing. It's boksing. And I think that fans and pundits are focus on so-called "catch weights" because the scribes had a slow day and use their genius to stir up something to get the fans and pundits to stick around and believe a new shady thing was happening in our shady sport. NYET! Coining that phrase "catch weight" has grab fans and pundits like white on rice. Holla!
Understandable but at the same time if he avoids guys like GGG who is a true mw with belts looking to unify but can not because Cotto wont fight anyone at the 160 limit or a healthy weight then it is taking good fights away from us fans and hurting the sport. GGG can be a unified mw champion holding all the belts, that is both historic and an accomplishment I am sure he would be proud of but instead Cotto is holding that belt hostage fighting zombies who are B- fighters to begin with.


-Radam G :

Understandable but at the same time if he avoids guys like GGG who is a true mw with belts looking to unify but can not because Cotto wont fight anyone at the 160 limit or a healthy weight then it is taking good fights away from us fans and hurting the sport. GGG can be a unified mw champion holding all the belts, that is both historic and an accomplishment I am sure he would be proud of but instead Cotto is holding that belt hostage fighting zombies who are B- fighters to begin with.
It may take away from the fans, but it will never hurt the sports. There is a long history of this type of thing. Sugar Ray Robinson didn't hurt the sport one bit when he refused to fight any pug on the "Black Murder Row." The sport just made new sanctioning organizations. And as time marches on, the new set of fans don't know that because the scribes don't write that. Myths come about and are told as the truth until fans accept them as the truth. A few of those different times that SRR won the title, it was not the whole deal. Oh, YUP! Even the late, great SRR was a time or two an alphabet-sanctioning champ. Da game is full of optical illusions. They are everywhere like snakes under rocks. Holla!


-stormcentre :

I'd be interested in knowing how long the history is of "this type of thing". Particularly when "this type of thing" relates to champions both expecting and contracting for, their opponents to come in and fight at catch weights that are themselves below the weight limit for which the championship title itself is being contested. Forget for now that this was Cotto's first defence. Could you please give us some examples of the long history to which you refer, Radam? You can include SRR as well, if you like. That way we can begin to understand and know, who and where, not only the snakes - but also da optical illusions, are. Thanks in advance !!! :) :)
->http://www.thesweetscience.com/forums/showthread.php?21470-Cotto-Drops-Hammers-In-Round-Four-Blasts-Out-Geale-in-Brooklyn&p=83646&viewfull=1#post83646


-Absy71 :

[br] title="LOTIERZO LOWDOWN: Cotto Beat An Empty Package in Geale"[/br]Cotto's Showing Against Geale Means Nothing For What's Next This past weekend lineal middleweight champ Miguel Cotto 40-4 (34) took apart former alphabet title holder Daniel Geale 31-4 (16) at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn New York. Cotto looked terrific during the first three rounds of the fight boxing the taller Geale from the outside and then picking his spots and going on the offensive with his vaunted left hooks to the head and body. In the fourth round Miguel dropped Geale twice and you could see Daniel was visibly hurt and shook badly. Geale beat the count after the second knockdown, but once on his feet he told referee Harvey Dock that he'd had enough and willingly accepted that Cotto was the better man on this night. The fight was contested at 157 pounds because team Cotto insisted upon it. During the week leading up to the fight there was some negative debate pertaining to catch-weight bouts, something that I relished hearing because I truly despise them. They're a joke and prove nothing. However, prior to the start of the fight during the HBO preview, commentators Jim Lampley and Max Kellerman addressed how team Cotto felt about the negative connotation regarding the fight being contested at 157 instead of the 160 pound middleweight limit. Their attitude was after Miguel looks great demolishing Geale, and he did, everyone will be talking about how Cotto is back and a real threat to Saul "Canelo" Alvarez and WBA middleweight title holder Gennady Golovkin, and they are right. Today Cotto's showing is the buzz. Well here comes the cold water and reality check? As most boxing fans know, Gennady Golovkin stopped Daniel Geale in the third round of their title bout 11 months ago. Only they fought at 160. For the Cotto bout, Geale weighed in at 157 and then on the day of the fight he scaled 182 with street clothes on. To most that doesn't seem like much of a big deal, after-all, he was probably 176 when he stepped in the ring for the fight, and that's well over the middleweight limit......Well, the big deal is Geale looked like a skeleton at the weigh in and everybody saw it. On fight night he was that same skeleton with 20 pounds of fluid. Daniel looked shopworn standing in the ring warming up. He certainly wasn't the same fighter who fought Golovkin in July of last year. For the fight with Cotto, Daniel Geale was a sacrificial lamb, and he knowingly accepted that role because of the middleweight title being on the line and the money on the table. However, he was an empty package in the ring and everybody saw it. Geale, even when at full strength, is not much of a puncher; against Cotto, not only was he even more feather-fisted than usual, but he had no rhythm or timing. He looked totally out of sort from the onset. And once Miguel felt him a little bit and realized there was nothing to him physically, he raised the rent and picked up the aggression because there was nothing coming back at him that deterred him in the least. So the left hooks came more frequently with badder intentions. And when they started to crash land, Geale began to flinch more and Cotto fed off of that. By the fourth round Cotto was bringing the fight to an opponent who might as well been handcuffed, that's how much he feared the weakened Geale. After going down twice, Geale realized that he had nothing physically and chose not to continue getting slaughtered and punched around for what probably wasn't a king's ransom regarding his purse. Has anyone ever noticed that in these catch-weight bouts it's usually the guy who went down in weight that loses? This is the sole intention of them. Yes, Miguel Cotto looked great taking apart Geale. He boxed beautifully from both inside and outside. His punches were crisp and carried explosive power when they landed. He didn't have to hit Geale many times to grasp that Daniel wanted to be somewhere else instead of where he was. The fight achieved the result it was supposed to. Cotto won and looked terrific. Now the fight with Canelo will be made and it'll be a huge draw. It always is when the biggest Mexican star in boxing confronts the biggest Puerto Rican star in boxing. Cotto and Alvarez have been on a collision course for about two years now. And both have handled their business well and looked great in their last bouts winning by an impressive stoppage. However, I think Cotto's showing is more of a mirage. And let me say I'm a huge Cotto fan. He's a real fighter and has always been willing to fight the best of the best. At this stage of his career I don't begrudge him for fighting as a businessman first - he's earned that. But at the same time I have to call it like I see it. And this past weekend Cotto beat up a melted down middleweight who he matched up with perfectly. Everybody knew going in that Cotto was the superior fighter and technician, which bore itself out a minute into the bout. The only advantage Geale had was presumed size and strength, which he was robbed of in the weeks before the fight trying to make 157. Again, once Cotto felt Geale had nothing physically, he went right in and closed the show impressively. Which of course was the desired result and why that particular fight was made. On Sunday morning after the fight, Cotto is a real threat to Alvarez and Golovkin in the eyes of many and trainer Frdddie Roach is a miracle worker...well, I just don't buy that. Cotto beat an empty package in Daniel Geale fighting a WWE sanctioned bout. Mark my words, when Cotto faces Alvarez, he will get beat up like he did against Manny Pacquiao even with Freddie Roach in his corner. He can't play the catch-weight game with Alvarez, who destroyed James Kirkland as a junior middleweight. Cotto's lineal title will be on the line for Alvarez, which means they'll fight between 154 and 157, which is perfect for Alvarez. And if for some reason Cotto and Alvarez don't get together because they are both divas and will bicker over the purse, he'll have to turn to Golovkin. And if that fight happens, Golovkin will put Cotto in the fourth row of the press sitting ringside. That is unless Golovkin has to come in at 156 or 157. Cotto is a manufactured middleweight and gamed the system against Geale. As terrific as Cotto looked this past weekend fighting Daniel Geale, he didn't show me he he has anything to better Alvarez or Golovkin. Frank Lotierzo can be reached at [url=http://www.thesweetscience.com/mailto:GlovedFist@Gmail.com]GlovedFist@Gmail.com[url=http://www.thesweetscience.com/mailto:GlovedFist@Gmail.com] PHOTO CREDIT: Tom Hogan - Hoganphotos/Roc Nation Sports/Miguel Cotto Promotions
Agree with everything, I was shocked at how Geale looked at the weigh in, especially when he was on the scales trying to smile, his face would start twitching, his eyes when blinking, one eye would close before the other., totally out of it, vacant stare. I have seen many people in clubs looking like this from days of meth & ecstasy abuse. Geale never stood a chance.


-stormcentre :

Yep. (Anyone) try losing 10 pounds in a week, and the last thing you will feel like doing is a fight of any sort, let alone; A) A 12 round boxing contest. B) A 12 round boxing contest with a guy like Miguel Cotto. C) Doing "A" and "B" after swinging between ~25 pound in a week; as Geale was contracted to, and did. You could tell as Geale; prepared in the dressing room, walked out, and waiting in the ring for the fight to start; that he both, was nowhere near ready and knew what the "real deal" was. Successfully defending titles by ensuring your opponent is catch weight contracted to weigh in
under the contested title's weight limit is a relatively new and seriously alarming trend; emanating - at the moment - from a gym/trainer that has - to some extent- popularized and/or normalized catch weights as a means of stacking the WildCard deck for (some of) his fighters. It's a dangerous practice and I hope it will be seen for what it is, and treated accordingly (by sanctions, promoters, managers, and spectators) soon. Some of the fluid a fighter loses when he severely dehydrates (which does not always immediately recover when engaged in a "quicksilver" rehydration phase; like those fighters undertake after both losing weight and weighing in, and also just before a fight) are cerebrospinal fluids. Cerebrospinal fluids are colorless and clear body fluids that are commonly found around and in both the brain and spine. You need them to rest properly and to live - let alone to fight for 12 rounds and absorb punches in the head and body. Fighting without them is akin to playing Russian Roulette with your life.
Unless death is something you look forward to and something that makes you happy; this stuff is as serious as - if not more than - cancer. When you seriously dehydrate you not only lose cerebrospinal fluids but your blood becomes seemingly thicker and, at times, harder to pump; this is one reason why veins seem to be more pronounced on dehydrated fighters. If your blood becomes really hard to pump around you can get a blood clot. In turn, people can (and do) die and/or suffer severe brain injuries and/or blot clots from these above-mentioned boxing related practices and physiological conditions; Gerald McCLellan. Only a Jackass would attempt to normalize them and claim it's been happening for years.
Personally, I am happy to see the majority of TSS forum posters (reasonably) united on this issue, commenting accordingly, and seeing it for what it is . . . .
An unacceptable practice that screams and smacks of; ""We have not learnt our lesson from Gerald McCLellan and others that have fallen via similar fates"". If you can't defend a title in a championship contest at the designated, proper and appropriate weight (for all involved contestants) then, if the sanctions will not enforce what's right, you should not have that title and forfeit it. It's as simple as that; particularly for championship fights and defences. For fighter's safety; I would also like to see appropriately designed weight loss and gain thresholds before/after weight ins (or other designated times) for each division; placed within the appropriate sanctions rules too - but, whilst related, that's another story. :) :)


-stormcentre :

Yep. (Anyone) try losing 10 pounds in a week, and the last thing you will feel like doing is a fight of any sort, let alone; A) A 12 round boxing contest. B) A 12 round boxing contest with a guy like Miguel Cotto. C) As you wind up a 2 or 3 month heavy training camp that also asked you to starve as you exercised. D) Doing "A", "B" and "C" after/before swinging between ~25 pounds in the last week; as Geale was contracted to, and did. You could tell as Geale; prepared in the dressing room, walked out, and waiting in the ring for the fight to start; that he both, was nowhere near ready and knew what the "real deal" was. Successfully defending titles by ensuring your opponent is catch weight contracted to weigh in
under the contested title's weight limit is a relatively new and seriously alarming trend; emanating - at the moment - from a gym/trainer that has - to some extent- popularized and/or normalized catch weights as a means of stacking the WildCard deck for (some of) his fighters. It's a dangerous practice and I hope it will be seen for what it is, and treated accordingly (by sanctions, promoters, managers, and spectators) soon. Some of the fluid a fighter loses when he severely dehydrates (which does not always immediately recover when engaged in a "quicksilver" rehydration phase; like those fighters undertake after both losing weight and weighing in, and also just before a fight) are cerebrospinal fluids. Cerebrospinal fluids are colorless and clear body fluids that are commonly found around and in both the brain and spine. You need them to rest properly and to live - let alone to fight for 12 rounds and absorb punches in the head and body. Fighting without them is akin to playing Russian Roulette with your life.
Unless death is something you look forward to and something that makes you happy; this stuff is as serious as - if not more than - cancer. When you seriously dehydrate you not only lose cerebrospinal fluids but your blood becomes seemingly thicker and, at times, harder to pump; this is one reason why veins seem to be more pronounced on dehydrated fighters. If your blood becomes really hard to pump around you can get a blood clot. In turn, people can (and do) die and/or suffer severe brain injuries and/or blot clots from these above-mentioned boxing related practices and physiological conditions; Gerald McCLellan. Only a Jackass would attempt to normalize them and claim it's been happening for years.
Personally, I am happy to see the majority of TSS forum posters (reasonably) united on this issue, commenting accordingly, and seeing it for what it is . . . .
An unacceptable practice that screams and smacks of; ""We have not learnt our lesson from Gerald McCLellan and others that have fallen via similar fates"". If you can't defend a title in a championship contest at the designated, proper and appropriate weight (for all involved contestants) then, if the sanctions will not enforce what's right, you should not have that title and forfeit it. It's as simple as that; particularly for championship fights and defences.

Please watch the whole video everyone, remember back, and notice also the comments about Gerald's strange (in fight) behavior, including his blinking eyes (like Geale), mouth guard pushed out, and Gerald taking a knee and/or looking for a break (like Geale). Please also note the professional and qualified commentary related to dehydration, and that also made specifically on Gerald's dehydrated brain and the punishment that it obviously took over the course of the fight; courtesy of a neurosurgeon that had just operated on Gerald McCLellan. For fighter's safety; I would also like to see appropriately designed weight loss and gain thresholds before/after weight ins (or other designated times) for each division; placed within the appropriate sanctions rules too - but, whilst related, that's another story. Cotto, Roach, and all others involved in last weekend's Cotto V Geale "middleweight title defence" - for which Geale was contracted to weigh less than the lower middleweight limit - should be ashamed. I don't know what the numbers where that Gerald's weight swung between, before he fought Benn. But I would take a bet that, if it was more (highly doubtable), it was not too much more than Geale's did before he fought Cotto. :) :)


-kidcanvas :

Geale was a paycheck thats for sure.. i like cotto as a fighter and as a person but at this stage of his career he will get plastered to the canvas if he fights alvarez or glovotkin


-Kid Blast :

It takes two to Tango


-Absy71 :

Yep. (Anyone) try losing 10 pounds in a week, and the last thing you will feel like doing is a fight of any sort, let alone; A) A 12 round boxing contest. B) A 12 round boxing contest with a guy like Miguel Cotto. C) As you wind up a 2 or 3 month heavy training camp that also asked you to starve as you exercised. D) Doing "A", "B" and "C" after/before swinging between ~25 pounds in the last week; as Geale was contracted to, and did. You could tell as Geale; prepared in the dressing room, walked out, and waiting in the ring for the fight to start; that he both, was nowhere near ready and knew what the "real deal" was. Successfully defending titles by ensuring your opponent is catch weight contracted to weigh in
under the contested title's weight limit is a relatively new and seriously alarming trend; emanating - at the moment - from a gym/trainer that has - to some extent- popularized and/or normalized catch weights as a means of stacking the WildCard deck for (some of) his fighters. It's a dangerous practice and I hope it will be seen for what it is, and treated accordingly (by sanctions, promoters, managers, and spectators) soon. Some of the fluid a fighter loses when he severely dehydrates (which does not always immediately recover when engaged in a "quicksilver" rehydration phase; like those fighters undertake after both losing weight and weighing in, and also just before a fight) are cerebrospinal fluids. Cerebrospinal fluids are colorless and clear body fluids that are commonly found around and in both the brain and spine. You need them to rest properly and to live - let alone to fight for 12 rounds and absorb punches in the head and body. Fighting without them is akin to playing Russian Roulette with your life.
Unless death is something you look forward to and something that makes you happy; this stuff is as serious as - if not more than - cancer. When you seriously dehydrate you not only lose cerebrospinal fluids but your blood becomes seemingly thicker and, at times, harder to pump; this is one reason why veins seem to be more pronounced on dehydrated fighters. If your blood becomes really hard to pump around you can get a blood clot. In turn, people can (and do) die and/or suffer severe brain injuries and/or blot clots from these above-mentioned boxing related practices and physiological conditions; Gerald McCLellan. Only a Jackass would attempt to normalize them and claim it's been happening for years.
Personally, I am happy to see the majority of TSS forum posters (reasonably) united on this issue, commenting accordingly, and seeing it for what it is . . . .
An unacceptable practice that screams and smacks of; ""We have not learnt our lesson from Gerald McCLellan and others that have fallen via similar fates"". If you can't defend a title in a championship contest at the designated, proper and appropriate weight (for all involved contestants) then, if the sanctions will not enforce what's right, you should not have that title and forfeit it. It's as simple as that; particularly for championship fights and defences.
Please watch the whole video everyone, remember back, and notice also the comments about Gerald's strange (in fight) behavior, including his blinking eyes (like Geale), mouth guard pushed out, and Gerald taking a knee and/or looking for a break (like Geale). Please also note the professional and qualified commentary related to dehydration, and that also made specifically on Gerald's dehydrated brain and the punishment that it obviously took over the course of the fight; courtesy of a neurosurgeon that had just operated on Gerald McCLellan. For fighter's safety; I would also like to see appropriately designed weight loss and gain thresholds before/after weight ins (or other designated times) for each division; placed within the appropriate sanctions rules too - but, whilst related, that's another story. Cotto, Roach, and all others involved in last weekend's Cotto V Geale "middleweight title defence" - for which Geale was contracted to weigh less than the lower middleweight limit - should be ashamed. I don't know what the numbers where that Gerald's weight swung between, before he fought Benn. But I would take a bet that, if it was more (highly doubtable), it was not too much more than Geale's did before he fought Cotto. :) :)
I'm glad you broke it down Storm, I have watched that fight many times, so sad, Gman & Benn deserved better.


-Absy71 :

It takes two to Tango
Agree, Geale signed the contract, should be nuff said, there is always a but, then the truth will set you free


-stormcentre :

A QQ (quick question) if you please; do you have to own the truth first, before it can set you free? Or will it just do so upon first inspection? Or is it like love - where if you have it and then set if free - and only then if it comes back, do you really know it was yours to start with? Far out man; I have no idea what the answer really is - seriously. All I know is that some folk - especially if it doesn't align with their views and or exposes them - don't always like the truth; in boxing and life. :) Back to Geale and how it was seemingly his fault (or part thereof) because he signed the contract. Sometimes - if we really want to solve problems and reduce both dangers and death - it is better to deal with problems right at their source. Rather than being symptomatic, and (always) looking at the tail end of the issue, and saying; ""gee whiz how did that (fatality) happen""? I mean if the wheel squeaks for a year, and all you do is oil it through the hub, as you need the car for work; is last year's mechanic exempt from any responsibility when your family goes on annual holidays and dies from the car veering off the road and down a cliff? After all you heard and knew of the squeak. Imagine the mechanic saying that to your relatives. What a catch-weight and dehydration clause (related to a swing of ~25 pounds in a few days; before a 12 round fight) is not the same you say? :) Let's be real here with what happened to Geale; we are (potentially) talking life and death here too. Just this time it's purposely designed - as a risk - into a contract for (what?) a sporting event. Imagine telling your family you want to drastically reduce the cerebral fluid around your brain, and then fight a 12 round boxing fight against a really good professional fighter; but that's not enough risk - because you also want to do with the majority of your faculties impaired. Clever move eh? Imagine the response you would get? This is - effectively - what these cleverly designed and sometimes deliberately ambiguous contractual clauses constitute and do. It's time for the sport to smarten up on this issue. We don't need championship bouts that are - allowed by authorities and sanctions, and also contracted for - that not only explicitly stipulate the above risks should happen - but that fighters must weigh less than the weight that the championship bout is actually contested for. Why do we need this? If we remove the obvious reasons and the distinct objective related to how it clearly allows one fighter an unfair advantage (which is against the spirit of boxing and sport anyway) over the other fighter - the other fighter usually being the one that is not required to starve and dehydrate/rehydrate as much; then what possible reason can there be for such a clause/contract? Oh yes, that's right Cotto is not really a middleweight yet he holds the middleweight title. Clearly then, if he (or anyone else) does not defend the middleweight title in a manner where he defeats proper middleweights, then he can't really be the middleweight champion and/or expect to defend the middleweight title; can he? Is that so hard for sanctions and authorities to understand? Or do we need another Gerald McCLellan incident? Yes, I know CottoRoach claim that because Miguel was under the middleweight limit that means it is not fair to Cotto unless Geale comes in at 157. This is a flawed argument that - by way of providing the (false) appearance that the heavier fighter being required to starve and dehydrate/rehydrate more than the lighter fighter, is merely a "precaution" that's required in order to make is fairer and safer for the lighter fighter - as much overlooks the fact that; 1) One fighter (Geale) is not required to starve and dehydrate/rehydrate as much as the other. 2) Significantly starving and dehydrating/rehydrating introduces a raft of dangerous and other concerning issues that not only skew the outcome of the fight to (almost always) favor the fighter not is not, as much as the other fighter, starving and dehydrating/rehydrating - but also serve notice as to why there are weight division to start with. 3) If a fighter that can't or won't weigh in at or over the lower threshold of the championship title he wishes to contest or defend, his options then should be to relinquish the title or fight an appropriately weighted opponent (that is truly representative of the weight at which the championship title is designated) whilst he himself is at his current (lighter) weight. 4) If a fighter can't or won't weigh in at or over the lower threshold of the championship title he wishes to contest or defend, but he wishes to defend/contest it anyway, then the risk (of the weight gap) should be his. The risk for such a title fight should be laid upon the fighter whom weighs within the official upper and lower weight thresholds for the championship title in question. 5) The health and other risks, and also the physical/competitive impairment of a fighter that can't or won't weigh in at or over the lower threshold of the championship title that he wishes to contest or defend anyway, is - in most cases - far less than that associated with a fighter that is required to starve and dehydrate/rehydrate, as much as Geale was. 6) Fighters can and have died from doing what CottoRoach contracted and expected of their middleweight opponent. Which surely came about as a result of the fact that Cotto is not really a middleweight, as well as the fact that it was also so important that Cotto retain his middleweight title in his first defence of it, that the opponent's (or Geale's) health and safety was a secondary consideration. Sure, yes, Geale signed the contract. Remember though, boxing is not a sport like top level (Aussie rules) football, American football, rugby, soccer, and basket ball; where all players earn a decent enough salary so they can take the time to consider and reject defective and dangerous offers. Many fighters, even top level ones, are desperate for a payday. Geale was. And my bet it that CottoRoach - along with the fact that Geale, when last performing at the top level as a middleweight, was knocked out (potentially further increasing his likelihood of suffering adverse effects from dehydration and rapid rehydration) - knew it. So, given the above factors, many fighters - including possibly also Geale - are therefore compromised when a contract - detailing risks such as those mentioned above - is put in front of them. Conversely, and extrapolating all the above facts and known risks then; it's fair to say that the introduction of such a contract is then therefore both a willfully dangerous and opportunistic act, executed by those whom design such risk and danger prone clauses into them. This is even more staggeringly breathtaking when one considers that, in some cases, those facilitating and designing such clauses/contracts, are themselves already suffering from the risks/dangers of boxing; as Roach is? I hope you're as astounded as I am about this. Is it not just an unfair and unnecessary risk? Particularly in championship fights where the champion himself simply can't even hope to make the lower weight limit of the contested title; Cotto? If not, then why? Sure Geale signed the contract. But would he have signed the contract if he was - like the top level sportsmen of the above-mentioned sporting codes - always earning enough money to live, get ahead, and feed his family? Perhaps more importantly and also far less risky and symptomatic is the thought that Geale would never have risked his brain, consciousness, life, and also both his and his families future - as Gerald McCLellan fatefully did - if the contract and clauses in question where - in the first place - not there. Seasoned boxers and savvy boxing lovers whom visit this website and know how to both smell a rat and not always react subjectively it; that is the crux of the issue. This is why it is illegal to sell alcohol to impaired people and minors. Because - history and the fatalities consistently show us - it is just not good enough - especially when life threatening risks are at play - to simply wash our hands of it all and say . . ""ah well they knew the risks - he signed the contract"". It's always better to remove the source of the life threatening risks, to start with. An ounce of prevention is always worth pound of cure. :) :)