Heavy-Hitting Trash Talk From Deontay Wilder

Deontay Wilder is a world-class trash talker, but is he a world-class fighter? The undefeated heavyweight challenges WBC heavyweight champion Bermane Stiverne on Saturday night at the MGM in Las Vegas. The bout will air live on Showtime Championship Boxing.

Wilder has knocked out every opponent he’s faced so far in his professional career. If he does that to Stiverne, he might just be the next great American heavyweight.

And Wilder predicts exactly that to happen on Saturday.

“I’ve got so much power that it’s even scary for me. One thing I really feel is that I’m going to hit somebody, and it’s going to really hurt them. I think this fight is going to be the start of it, because I really want to hurt him. Like I said, I want to beat him to within an inch of his life. No, I don’t want to kill him, but I do want to beat him to the end of it. I want him to feel like he went there and then came back.”

Sheesh. This Wilder guy can talk.

But the 29-year-old can punch, too. He’s separated all 32 opponents from their senses since turning professional in 2008. I don’t care who you’re fighting. If you can knock 32 people in a row out, all within four rounds I might add, you can freaking punch.

Wilder won the 2008 Olympic bronze medal. He calls himself “The Bronze Bomber” and said his alter-ego is a knockout machine.

“On the outside, I’m Deontay Wilder. I’m calm, cool and collected. But on the inside, I’m the Bronze Bomber. He’s not in there to make friends. He’s in there to take somebody’s head off.”

Wilder said he knows how to transform from the nice guy he is outside of the ring to the ruthless mercenary he becomes once the bell rings. If you’ve watched Wilder fight in the past, you’ve seen him demolish his opponents seemingly at will, almost as if a switch goes off inside of him.

“I transform into something else, something not nice—something real evil. And when I win, I come back with that million dollar smile.”

Wilder is the likeable sort. Even though he says outrageous things, he does so with good humor. You can almost hear him smiling through the phone at you as he comes up with these crazy things.

But Stiverne doesn’t like him. When I talked to him a couple of months ago, he told me “trash belongs in the trash,” implying that both Wilder and his trash talk belong in the garbage can.

Whatever the case, Saturday’s fight is the most intriguing heavyweight battle in recent memory. Stiverne is an accomplished and battle-tested veteran who can punch. Wilder is a talented phenomenon who might be the next big thing in boxing.

Wilder dismissed the idea that he’s never been punched by someone with as heavy hands as Stiverne. He said he’s sparred with lineal champion Wladimir Klitschko, among others, and took shots from the world’s best on numerous occasions. He’s not worried about Stiverne’s power.

“This is the heavyweight division. All the heavyweights have power. There are just different levels of power. Not everybody is going to have that extremely explosive power.”

Wilder believes he has the kind of power and athleticism Stiverne has never seen and can’t prepare for.

“I think my level is at the top of it. Whatever power he has, I’m not intimidated by it. Look, I’ve been in the ring with some of the best guys in sparring and training camps and stuff like that. Whether he has power or not, that’s none of my concern. For one thing, you might have power, but you have to hit me. He’s going to find real soon that my athletic skills alone are going to win the fight.”

Wilder said his speed and movement will be too much for Stiverne. He said he’s been an athlete his entire life and that what he does in the ring on fight night cannot be recreated in the gym with sparring partners.

“He’s never, ever, ever been in the ring with a guy like me. They can’t train for me. Who do they have to train for me? They can’t. The only thing they can do is train for how to get knocked out and how to manage my height. There’s nobody out there like me. I’m different.”

It’s hard to tell just how good Wilder might be on film. He obviously has power, but he’s yet to be in a fight where his skill level was tested. He’s yet to show he’s a complete fighter simply because no one he’s faced has made him do so.

Wilder said that theories about how to beat him that are not based on any actual evidence.

“Even on video, you can’t really see anything because none of my fights have gone past four rounds. People think they can hit me on the chin and maybe I’ll go down. But these are all assumptions about me.  You can’t prepare for the unknown. That’s the scariest part for [Stiverne] and his camp. How do you prepare for Deontay Wilder?”

It’s a fair question. He’s certainly an imposing physical specimen, and whatever one might believe about his boxing ability, there’s no doubt that he has concussive power.

Moreover, Wilder is always lean and muscular. Like former heavyweight champion Evander Holyfield, or current lineal champion Klitschko, Wilder takes boxing seriously and always remains in shape.

“One thing about me is that you’ll never find me out of shape. I’m in shape. I’m always at the gym. I consider the gym my job. It’s my nine-to-five. Most heavyweights only get to the gym when they have a fight coming up.”

Wilder said he was at the gym year-round and that Stiverne wasn’t the same type. He believes his dedication to staying in peak condition at all times will also give him an edge on fight night.

“I’ve heard many times, even from the people coaching him, that Bermane is a lazy guy.”

Man, this guy can trash talk. Wilder told me Stiverne would realize once they got in the ring together just how much trouble the WBC titlist had gotten himself into by taking the fight.

“But then it’s too late.”

And what of the naysayers, those who believe Wilder is only a world-class trash talker? That he doesn’t have the talent and ability to back up all these things he says?

“I’m super anxious! Come January 17, I’m looking forward to proving them wrong.”

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COMMENTS

-brownsugar :

Nice show of bravado by Wilder... The article is pretty accurate, how do you know how well Wilder performs against a boxer who can stay with him long enough to deliver his own offence? I saw a video where Wilder and Haye were in a heated sparring session and Haye was able to do some damage by staying inside Wilders looping punches and countering whenever Wilder missed. But Haye is smaller than Stiverne and has excellent upper body movement. So he could hide in the blind spots......Whose to say Stiverne couldnt benefit from the same tactics? When Wilder went 4 rounds with Firtha , he was actually getting stronger and more loosened up as the fight wore on. Hopefully Wilder can put up a decent effort at the least.... and execute a stunning upset at best.


-The Commish :

"...and the NEW..." -Randy G.


-deepwater2 :

Nice show of bravado by Wilder... The article is pretty accurate, how do you know how well Wilder performs against a boxer who can stay with him long enough to deliver his own offence? I saw a video where Wilder and Haye were in a heated sparring session and Haye was able to do some damage by staying inside Wilders looping punches and countering whenever Wilder missed. But Haye is smaller than Stiverne and has excellent upper body movement. So he could hide in the blind spots......Whose to say Stiverne couldnt benefit from the same tactics? When Wilder went 4 rounds with Firtha , he was actually getting stronger and more loosened up as the fight wore on. Hopefully Wilder can put up a decent effort at the least.... and execute a stunning upset at best.
I see the Wilder vs Firtha fight from a different viewpoint. Did Wilder get stronger as the fight went on or did Firtha gas out? I would say Firtha was out of shape and gassed out. Wilder was staggered with the first punch of the fight. He was staggered again at the 1 minute mark. Firtha landed a lot of punches exposing the holes in Wilder's game.I think he landed around 30%. Wilder has a powerful right hand but he loops it too much and he admires it too much while keeping his hands too low. Wilder was also rushing in too much and smothers his punches. Wilder has a weak inside game and is able to push more than he punches on the inside. Is Wilder a heavyweight Broner about to be taught a lesson? Tony Weeks is a good ref(except the Garcia Lucas M fight). I would like to say Stiverne will get inside and teach Wilder some hard lessons in this fight but I would not put any money on this. Sam Watson might distract Stiverne with his kissy faces and thats will be the end of the fight. Even though The commish was wrong on the Manny vs Chris fight I wouldn't bet against him on this one.


-Domenic :

Gun to my head I'm taking Stiverne. The heavyweight division would detonate a bit with a Wilder win though. Boxing is healthier when the heavyweights matter, and we may be on the precipice of that again.


-Froggy :

Gun to my head I'm taking Stiverne. The heavyweight division would detonate a bit with a Wilder win though. Boxing is healthier when the heavyweights matter, and we may be on the precipice of that again.
I'm with you on that Domenic, but how much did you want to bet on Manny and Floyd not happening ?


-Domenic :

I hope I'm wrong. But after what, 6 or 7 years of endless speculation, with the HBO and Showtime barrier, purse split issues, drug testing, the date uncertain, promotional snags, and more, I just don't see it happening. I would love to be wrong, but it's like the adage how many times are you gonna step on the same rake?


-Froggy :

I hope I'm wrong. But after what, 6 or 7 years of endless speculation, with the HBO and Showtime barrier, purse split issues, drug testing, the date uncertain, promotional snags, and more, I just don't see it happening. I would love to be wrong, but it's like the adage how many times are you gonna step on the same rake?
I tend to agree with you and I also hope you are wrong, like everyone else ! But I am hopeful enough to bet, or maybe just wishful thinking !


-oubobcat :

Funny story about the Wilde-Firtha fight and the statement you made above about Firtha getting gassed out. I made the drive to Atlantic City for that fight card and attended the weigh in. I saw Firtha standing in the lobby and went over to tell him that I was also from Northeast Ohio and had attended some of his fights in the area. He was very personable and we chatted it up for a little bit about some of those fights in Ohio. I went back in amongst the crowd after talking with him. A few minutes passed and I got a tap on my shoulder. It was Firtha. He said to me that he was here to win (at the weigh in their were some chuckles when he got on the scale and at the stare down which I think got to him a little) and it would not be by decision. He then told me he was going to give it a go early and that the fight would last at most four rounds. Well, he laid it on the line and got stopped in the 4th. I don't think he had any intention of being involved in a long fight with Wilder and figured he empty his tank early trying to hit a home run. I have to give it to him though, he did come to win and not to survive. He tried hard for that KO, had some moments and gave us a fun little scrap.


-oubobcat :

As for Stiverne-Wilder, I have finally made a decision on who I am picking. I am picking Stiverne to win by KO and do so early. Here is why... I have read some things about Stiverne possible having a weak chin and that Wilder's power will get to him. And some people point out the fact that Stiverne was stopped once in his career by a non-descript journeyman in Demetrice King. So I thought lets go watch that fight and see what actually happened. And here is what happened. Stiverne was in control and got caught with a good shot. He went back to a corner and King throw a volley of punches. Stiverne was clear eyed and slipping most shots when the referee came in to stop the fight. To say that it was a bad stoppage is an under statement to say the least. It was a deplorable call by the referee. Its on youtube (round 4 of the fight), judge for yourself. Wilder has fought nobody and I think this will be a major problem for him when he faces Stiverne. Wilder has never been remotely pushed or faced any real adversity inside the ring. Remember what happened to Gary Russell when he went into the deep end of the pool the first time against Lomachenko after swimming in the kiddie pool for years. Russell did not know what hit him or how to adjust when facing adversity. And he decisively lost. In fighting all those bad opponents, Wilder has developed some bad habits. He pulls straight back with his hands down and chin exposed a lot. He relies on his athletic ability to avoid punches. But when you are fighting the likes of Nicolai Firtha, Matthew Greer, Damon McCreary, etc you can easily avoid punches from those much less athletic foes. And if you do get caught, well they were not big punchers so no harm in those fights. In addition to that flaw, Wilder also throws a lazy jab a lot and does not bring it back in a timely manner. This can be timed by a better fighter with a right hand. Guess who throws a pretty good right hand? Well that's Bermaine Stiverne. Stiverne has been through some battles. He has faced adversity and overcome difficult situations. And gotten better having faced those difficulties. He is not the fighter that faced Demetrice King or Ray Austin. He learned and has become a more complete heavyweight. My prediction is that Wilder folds here early when he faces adversity for the first time. Stiverne is going to make him pay for his flaws unlike those past opponents for Wilder. A lazy jab will be timed by a hard right hand at some point. When Wilder pulls straight back with hands down and chin up, he will get caught. Wilder will face real adversity and will not know how to respond much like Russell against Lomachenko. Only difference, Wilder gets ko'd.


-Radam G :

The mouth of the south ought to shut da double fudge up. He is going to get beat down like a nail. B-Ware's shots are going to rain on him like hail. Coming to a a sudden end will be D-Wild's Fairy Tail. He has not gotten the memo or the mail. No longer will his ship sail. All of D-Wild's loyal followers ought to abandon ship. And take my tip. Bet your money on B-Ware. Being the heavyweight champion of the world with Doc Wladimir K, he will continue to share. Holla!


-Buzz Murdock :

I'm excited by this fight.Wilder's wild claims of invincibility, vs. Stiverne's irony. Wilder has a Primo Canera hora about him with loopholes in his game which belie his athletic whatever... Isn't Stiverne an athlete too? Wilder doesn't need Stiverne. Stiverne could use the commodity of Wilder to build his own brand. Stiverne by knock-out...Though I picked Algieri to stop Pacquiao. STOP HIM. So obviously my poor soul is looking for redemption.


-dino da vinci :

As for Stiverne-Wilder, I have finally made a decision on who I am picking. I am picking Stiverne to win by KO and do so early. Here is why... I have read some things about Stiverne possible having a weak chin and that Wilder's power will get to him. And some people point out the fact that Stiverne was stopped once in his career by a non-descript journeyman in Demetrice King. So I thought lets go watch that fight and see what actually happened. And here is what happened. Stiverne was in control and got caught with a good shot. He went back to a corner and King throw a volley of punches. Stiverne was clear eyed and slipping most shots when the referee came in to stop the fight. To say that it was a bad stoppage is an under statement to say the least. It was a deplorable call by the referee. Its on youtube (round 4 of the fight), judge for yourself. Wilder has fought nobody and I think this will be a major problem for him when he faces Stiverne. Wilder has never been remotely pushed or faced any real adversity inside the ring. Remember what happened to Gary Russell when he went into the deep end of the pool the first time against Lomachenko after swimming in the kiddie pool for years. Russell did not know what hit him or how to adjust when facing adversity. And he decisively lost. In fighting all those bad opponents, Wilder has developed some bad habits. He pulls straight back with his hands down and chin exposed a lot. He relies on his athletic ability to avoid punches. But when you are fighting the likes of Nicolai Firtha, Matthew Greer, Damon McCreary, etc you can easily avoid punches from those much less athletic foes. And if you do get caught, well they were not big punchers so no harm in those fights. In addition to that flaw, Wilder also throws a lazy jab a lot and does not bring it back in a timely manner. This can be timed by a better fighter with a right hand. Guess who throws a pretty good right hand? Well that's Bermaine Stiverne. Stiverne has been through some battles. He has faced adversity and overcome difficult situations. And gotten better having faced those difficulties. He is not the fighter that faced Demetrice King or Ray Austin. He learned and has become a more complete heavyweight. My prediction is that Wilder folds here early when he faces adversity for the first time. Stiverne is going to make him pay for his flaws unlike those past opponents for Wilder. A lazy jab will be timed by a hard right hand at some point. When Wilder pulls straight back with hands down and chin up, he will get caught. Wilder will face real adversity and will not know how to respond much like Russell against Lomachenko. Only difference, Wilder gets ko'd.
Ladies and Gentlemen, it is with great pride I introduce OU Bobcat...


-Froggy :

Bermane Stiverne began his professional career in Montreal, like many newcomers from Haiti, can anyone tell me why another Montrealer, trainer Russ Anber is in Wilders corner and might it make a difference ?


-Radam G :

Hype and humans' weakness for it never surprises me. D-Wild hasn't done Jack nothing but rumbled in set up bouts of softies, marshmallows, bums, cadavers and tomato can. He is going to look like a bronze cartoon clown. A couple of times, he will get knock down. And then quit with one big ugly ugly frown. After the fight, he is going into hiding and sneak out town. Holla!


-The Commish :

As for Stiverne-Wilder, I have finally made a decision on who I am picking. I am picking Stiverne to win by KO and do so early. Here is why... I have read some things about Stiverne possible having a weak chin and that Wilder's power will get to him. And some people point out the fact that Stiverne was stopped once in his career by a non-descript journeyman in Demetrice King. So I thought lets go watch that fight and see what actually happened. And here is what happened. Stiverne was in control and got caught with a good shot. He went back to a corner and King throw a volley of punches. Stiverne was clear eyed and slipping most shots when the referee came in to stop the fight. To say that it was a bad stoppage is an under statement to say the least. It was a deplorable call by the referee. Its on youtube (round 4 of the fight), judge for yourself. Wilder has fought nobody and I think this will be a major problem for him when he faces Stiverne. Wilder has never been remotely pushed or faced any real adversity inside the ring. Remember what happened to Gary Russell when he went into the deep end of the pool the first time against Lomachenko after swimming in the kiddie pool for years. Russell did not know what hit him or how to adjust when facing adversity. And he decisively lost. In fighting all those bad opponents, Wilder has developed some bad habits. He pulls straight back with his hands down and chin exposed a lot. He relies on his athletic ability to avoid punches. But when you are fighting the likes of Nicolai Firtha, Matthew Greer, Damon McCreary, etc you can easily avoid punches from those much less athletic foes. And if you do get caught, well they were not big punchers so no harm in those fights. In addition to that flaw, Wilder also throws a lazy jab a lot and does not bring it back in a timely manner. This can be timed by a better fighter with a right hand. Guess who throws a pretty good right hand? Well that's Bermaine Stiverne. Stiverne has been through some battles. He has faced adversity and overcome difficult situations. And gotten better having faced those difficulties. He is not the fighter that faced Demetrice King or Ray Austin. He learned and has become a more complete heavyweight. My prediction is that Wilder folds here early when he faces adversity for the first time. Stiverne is going to make him pay for his flaws unlike those past opponents for Wilder. A lazy jab will be timed by a hard right hand at some point. When Wilder pulls straight back with hands down and chin up, he will get caught. Wilder will face real adversity and will not know how to respond much like Russell against Lomachenko. Only difference, Wilder gets ko'd.
Bobcat, bobcat. bobcat. I can actually see your point of vies, as well as all the other 50% who are picking Stiverne. While I do agree that Wilder's opponents since he turned pro in 2008 have been less-than-world-class, I really don't see a world-class list on Stiverne's record, either. But I spelled this out on my post "Why Deontay Wilder Will Beat Bermane Stiverne." Cris Arreola was the one "name Stiverne fought. And beat. Twice. The first time, he pounded on, beat on, whupped on an out-of-shape Arreola. Knocked him down. Broke his nose. Battered him. Puffed him up. Yet, he couldn't stop him. Thehe faced Arreola in a rematch. Go figure. Arreola came into the fight in better shape and even rocked Stiverne a few times with right hands, some which weren't even flush, before Stiverne stopped him. Hey, these are the heavyweights and every one of them can punch. But Stiverne is going to quickly fight out the right hand which he just got hit with is not the right of Demetrius King, who landed one dozen rights before stopping Stiverne. Forget the fact that the stoppage was an awful one and one I now use in my Referees' Seminars. Can you see Wilder landing 12 right hands? Twelve?? Maybe one. Or a follow-up, tuck-him-in right. But 12? Uh-uh. Nor will Wilder's vastly-improved jab feel like a 17-17-1 Charles Davis' jab. Yes, the same Charles Davis who took Stiverne to an eight-round majority draw in 2009. Or will Wilder's left hook, which has been dropping sparring partners throughout training camp, feel like anything Stiverne has ever tasted. I have no question Wilder will be able to go the 12-round distance. I don't believe he wants to do that. I believe--check that, I KNOW--he wants to get this over with very fast, and is willing to trade shots if he has to. I think I'm correct in stating that neither man has been on the floor as a pro. That will change on Saturday. But I don't think Stiverne will be counted out. After he gets dropped a few times and realizes what Malik Scott, Sergei Liakhovich and 30 other opponents have realized--that Deontay Wilder's power is real, that it's bonafide, Grade A heavyweight championship power--the referee will mercifully move in and halt the contest. This will not be a stoppage like the Demetrius King stoppage, where fans screamed at the ref, "Why are you stopping it?" Instead, they'll be screaming for referee Tony Weeks to get in there and "Stop it before the guy gets killed!" "...and NEW..." -Randy G.


-King Beef :

Commish, I wanna roll with Wilder, but I am wondering how he takes a punch from decent heavyweight, and how is he gonna react if Stiverne takes his best and keeps coming. I am with ya as far as their records go; besides Areola, Stiverne doesnt have a stellar resume either.


-dino da vinci :

Try this. Wilder's best win. The best fighter that fighter defeated. The best fighter that fighter faced. Stiverne's best win. Same as above. An embarrassingly wide gulf. Wilder should not even be allowed to compete for anything that resembles a title with the amount of risk he subjected himself to. If he is still standing at the end of three, he'll have been hit, and he may not like it.


-Radam G :

Bobcat, bobcat. bobcat. I can actually see your point of vies, as well as all the other 50% who are picking Stiverne. While I do agree that Wilder's opponents since he turned pro in 2008 have been less-than-world-class, I really don't see a world-class list on Stiverne's record, either. But I spelled this out on my post "Why Deontay Wilder Will Beat Bermane Stiverne." Cris Arreola was the one "name Stiverne fought. And beat. Twice. The first time, he pounded on, beat on, whupped on an out-of-shape Arreola. Knocked him down. Broke his nose. Battered him. Puffed him up. Yet, he couldn't stop him. Thehe faced Arreola in a rematch. Go figure. Arreola came into the fight in better shape and even rocked Stiverne a few times with right hands, some which weren't even flush, before Stiverne stopped him. Hey, these are the heavyweights and every one of them can punch. But Stiverne is going to quickly fight out the right hand which he just got hit with is not the right of Demetrius King, who landed one dozen rights before stopping Stiverne. Forget the fact that the stoppage was an awful one and one I now use in my Referees' Seminars. Can you see Wilder landing 12 right hands? Twelve?? Maybe one. Or a follow-up, tuck-him-in right. But 12? Uh-uh. Nor will Wilder's vastly-improved jab feel like a 17-17-1 Charles Davis' jab. Yes, the same Charles Davis who took Stiverne to an eight-round majority draw in 2009. Or will Wilder's left hook, which has been dropping sparring partners throughout training camp, feel like anything Stiverne has ever tasted. I have no question Wilder will be able to go the 12-round distance. I don't believe he wants to do that. I believe--check that, I KNOW--he wants to get this over with very fast, and is willing to trade shots if he has to. I think I'm correct in stating that neither man has been on the floor as a pro. That will change on Saturday. But I don't think Stiverne will be counted out. After he gets dropped a few times and realizes what Malik Scott, Sergei Liakhovich and 30 other opponents have realized--that Deontay Wilder's power is real, that it's bonafide, Grade A heavyweight championship power--the referee will mercifully move in and halt the contest. This will not be a stoppage like the Demetrius King stoppage, where fans screamed at the ref, "Why are you stopping it?" Instead, they'll be screaming for referee Tony Weeks to get in there and "Stop it before the guy gets killed!" "...and NEW..." -Randy G.
Wow! Commish, don't forget that B-Ware is fighting your boy D'Wild. What happened with any other fighters doesn't apply. I don't have a clue why you are some caught up what was done to B-Ware by fighters A, B,C and D. He is fighting fighter F. Who is going to be easy breezy. If there is no fix in, Tony Weeks will indeed be stopping it "before the guy gets killed." And that guy will be the self-proclaimed "ordained by God to be heavyweight champion of the world" Deontay Wilder on the verge of getting killed. Isn't he the first pro pug in history to get a shot at the crown, and never been more than four rounds with a top contender? I'm waiting for his speech after the scrap. Maybe he will say that God Was Watching some scrap else and forgot about him getting his arse tore by B-Ware. Holla!


-King Beef :

Try this. Wilder's best win. The best fighter that fighter defeated. The best fighter that fighter faced. Stiverne's best win. Same as above. An embarrassingly wide gulf. Wilder should not even be allowed to compete for anything that resembles a title with the amount of risk he subjected himself to. If he is still standing at the end of three, he'll have been hit, and he may not like it.
Don't even need to look that deep, Stiverne has Areolla and 24 "hey who's that guy" and you can probably throw Austin in there for the regular boxing viewer; and 1 of those "hey who's that guy" stopped Stiverne. Wilder on the other hand has 32 "hey who's that guys" I guess you could say Malik Scott is a name, but his record was padded just as well as Wilder's is, and Liakhovich beat Brewster some yrs back for the WBO strap. Stiverne has the experience edge, but I don't think its as wide a gulf as you want it to be. My head is saying Stiverne, because I think if he can get inside and get some touches on Wilder's untested chin, its a wrap.


-dino da vinci :

Don't even need to look that deep, Stiverne has Areolla and 24 "hey who's that guy" and you can probably throw Austin in there for the regular boxing viewer; and 1 of those "hey who's that guy" stopped Stiverne. Wilder on the other hand has 32 "hey who's that guys" I guess you could say Malik Scott is a name, but his record was padded just as well as Wilder's is, and Liakhovich beat Brewster some yrs back for the WBO strap. Stiverne has the experience edge, but I don't think its as wide a gulf as you want it to be. My head is saying Stiverne, because I think if he can get inside and get some touches on Wilder's untested chin, its a wrap.
No,no no, no. It's that wide. It's from where I'm sitting to where you are right now. The moment that Wilder realizes he's not in Kansas anymore it's going to become amateur hour. He's an arm puncher in spots, and will have zero gauge if thing starts to go any rounds. Can Wilder win? Sure, underdogs win fairly often enough. But Wilder is favored. Think about that for a minute. Doesn't possess one quality win and may close a two to one favorite. Told you all that God is a boxing fan. As for the guy that stopped Stiverne, it would have been nice to see what might of happened if a real referee was overseeing the bout. Stiverne, if nothing else, showed he could find his way past Arreolla twice. Malik Scott? Had Malik Scott showed up with a deep desire to win, it wouldn't have meant much, but that didn't happen either.


-stormcentre :

Try this. Wilder's best win. The best fighter that fighter defeated. The best fighter that fighter faced.
And that would be (for Wilder) either Scott or Liakhovich. Going into his fight with Wilder;
A)
Malik Scott - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 1, drew 1, and * won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Deontay Wilder,
Malik Scott fought
Grover Young (7-12-1 going in) and
Dereck Chisora (16-4-0 going in).
Grover Young was dispatched by TKO in the second round of a 6 round fight, and
Dereck Chisora handed
Scott a TKO loss in the sixth round of a 10 round dance.
Grover Young - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 5 straight (mostly 6 and 4 round) fights in a row via every permutation that a loss can occupy.
Derek Chisora - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 4 fights out of his previous 6. Those
Chisora wins came against Hector Alfredo Avila (20-12-1 going in) and Remigijus Ziausys (18-43-3 going in) in what were, respectively,
Chisora's 1st and 5th fights before facing
Scott.
Chisora both; TKO'd Hector Alfredo Avila in the 9th round of a 10 round fight, whereas Remigijus Ziausys was defeated on points over 6 rounds The 4 losses
Derek Chisora encountered before facing
Malik Scott came against Tyson Fury (14-0-0 going in), Vitali Klitschko (43-2-0 going in), Robert Helenius (16-0-0 going in), and David Haye (25-2-0 going in). All these losses - except for David Haye - were points losses over 12 rounds. Haye stopped
Chisora in 5 rounds of a scheduled 10, in what was
Chisora's 2nd most previous fight before meeting
Malik Scott. Before
Derek Chisora, Malik Scott fought;
Vyacheslav Glazkov, Bowie Tupou, Alvaro Morales, and Kendrick Releford. Aside from
Vyacheslav Glazkov (14-0-0 going in) - whom
Scott fought a 10 round split decision draw with -
Scott defeated
Bowie Tupou (22-1-0 going in),
Alvaro Morales (6-10-6 going in), and
Kendrick Releford (22-15-2 going in) in either 6 or 8 round contests, and these wins account for the 4 *above-mentioned successful fights
Malik Scott had before meeting
Deontay Wilder.
Malik Scott dispatched both
Alvaro Morales and
Kendrick Releford via decision wins - whereas
Tupou was TKO'd in round 8 of a scheduled 8 round fight. Looking at the state of their records as they headed in with
Malik Scott,
Bowie Tupou's was approaching - but not quite - eyebrow raising; despite the fact there was only 1 loss on his ledger. As for both
Morales and
Releford's records as they headed in with
Malik Scott, well you can see for yourself from what I have pinned to this piece above. Their losses were not too far in the rear vision mirror of their careers, such that when they met
Scott they had no bearing on their threshold of performance, pain, and the fight in question. Perhaps this is not entirely
Malik Scott's fault though, as he turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said, it provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Malik Scott.
B)
Siarhei Liakhovich - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 4 and won 2. The 2 fights before Wilder, Liakhovich fought
Robert Helenius (15-0-0 going in) and then
Bryant Jennings (12-0-0 going in) just before stepping in with Deontay. Both those fights didn't go past 9 rounds, as
Bryant retired
Liakhovich in 9 rounds, and
Helenius TKO'd
Liakhovich in the same amount of rounds; 9. Before, the
Robert Helenius and
Bryant Jennings losses (for Liakhovich) came
Evans Quinn (22-16-1 going in) and
Jeremy Bates (22-16-1 going in); whom
Liakhovich beat both by stoppage -
Bates in 1 round, and
Quinn in round 9. Of those two
Liakhovich wins over Quinn and Bates the following information is associated; Before going in with
Liakhovich,
Quinn had drawn with Luis Andres Pineda (21-8-0 going in) over 8 rounds and dropped a 6 round decision to Harvey Jolly (8-10-1 going in). Prior to Pineda and Jolly Quinn had enjoyed some success with mediocre and varied opposition as (at least) his prior 10 fights were all wins. Before going in with
Siarhei Liakhovich, out of 7 fights
Bates had lost 6 fights. With the exception of Kevin Rainey (whom Bates actually beat); Ray Austin, Evander Holyfield, Guillermo Jones, Andrew Golota, Odlanier Solis, and Kali Mehan constituted the other 6 fight losses, and they had all stopped
Bates before 4 rounds; in either 8 or 10 round fights. However, as mentioned above,
Bates did manage to defeat Rainey via a unanimous decision over 4 rounds, in what was a 4 round fight somewhere in Kentucky - perhaps where fat men make Chevrolet corvettes. Unfortunately though, Kevin Rainey was (2-25-0) going into that fight with
Bates. Nuff said on that. Prior to
Bates and
Quinn for
Liakhovich was
Nikolay Valuev (47-1-0 going in) and
Shannon Briggs (47-4-1 going in). Both defeated
Siarhei Liakhovich in 12 round fights - although these fights probably mark the last time when
Liakhovich was a live dog and seriously committed to the sport. Like with Malik Scott, perhaps
Liakhovich's opponent's records are not all the fault of
Siarhei Liakhovich himself. Perhaps
Siarhei Liakhovich's manager/promoter had no knowledge of his opponent's records and/or didn't chase guys that looked like that, and perhaps
Liakhovich (as Scott did) simply turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said and as with Malik Scott, the above provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Siarhei Liakhovich.


-stormcentre :

Try this. Wilder's best win. The best fighter that fighter defeated. The best fighter that fighter faced.
And that would be (for Wilder) either Scott or Liakhovich. Going into his fight with Wilder;
A)
Malik Scott - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 1, drew 1, and * won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Deontay Wilder,
Malik Scott fought
Grover Young (7-12-1 going in) and
Dereck Chisora (16-4-0 going in).
Grover Young was dispatched by TKO in the second round of a 6 round fight, and
Dereck Chisora handed
Scott a TKO loss in the sixth round of a 10 round dance.
Grover Young - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 5 straight (mostly 6 and 4 round) fights in a row via every permutation that a loss can occupy.
Derek Chisora - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 4 fights out of his previous 6. Those
Chisora wins came against Hector Alfredo Avila (20-12-1 going in) and Remigijus Ziausys (18-43-3 going in) in what were, respectively,
Chisora's 1st and 5th fights before facing
Scott.
Chisora both; TKO'd Hector Alfredo Avila in the 9th round of a 10 round fight, whereas Remigijus Ziausys was defeated on points over 6 rounds The 4 losses
Derek Chisora encountered before facing
Malik Scott came against Tyson Fury (14-0-0 going in), Vitali Klitschko (43-2-0 going in), Robert Helenius (16-0-0 going in), and David Haye (25-2-0 going in). All these losses - except for David Haye - were points losses over 12 rounds. Haye stopped
Chisora in 5 rounds of a scheduled 10, in what was
Chisora's 2nd most previous fight before meeting
Malik Scott. Before
Derek Chisora, Malik Scott fought;
Vyacheslav Glazkov, Bowie Tupou, Alvaro Morales, and Kendrick Releford. Aside from
Vyacheslav Glazkov (14-0-0 going in) - whom
Scott fought a 10 round split decision draw with -
Scott defeated
Bowie Tupou (22-1-0 going in),
Alvaro Morales (6-10-6 going in), and
Kendrick Releford (22-15-2 going in) in either 6 or 8 round contests, and these wins account for the 4 *above-mentioned successful fights
Malik Scott had before meeting
Deontay Wilder.
Malik Scott dispatched both
Alvaro Morales and
Kendrick Releford via decision wins - whereas
Tupou was TKO'd in round 8 of a scheduled 8 round fight. Looking at the state of their records as they headed in with
Malik Scott,
Bowie Tupou's was approaching - but not quite - eyebrow raising; despite the fact there was only 1 loss on his ledger. As for both
Morales and
Releford's records as they headed in with
Malik Scott, well you can see for yourself from what I have pinned to this piece above. Their losses were not too far in the rear vision mirror of their careers, such that when they met
Scott they had no bearing on their threshold of performance, pain, and the fight in question. Perhaps this is not entirely
Malik Scott's fault though, as he turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said, it provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Malik Scott.
B)
Siarhei Liakhovich - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 4 and won 2. The 2 fights before Wilder, Liakhovich fought
Robert Helenius (15-0-0 going in) and then
Bryant Jennings (12-0-0 going in) just before stepping in with Deontay. Both those fights didn't go past 9 rounds, as
Bryant retired
Liakhovich in 9 rounds, and
Helenius TKO'd
Liakhovich in the same amount of rounds; 9. Before, the
Robert Helenius and
Bryant Jennings losses (for Liakhovich) came
Evans Quinn (22-16-1 going in) and
Jeremy Bates (22-16-1 going in); whom
Liakhovich beat both by stoppage -
Bates in 1 round, and
Quinn in round 9. Of those two
Liakhovich wins over Quinn and Bates the following information is associated; Before going in with
Liakhovich,
Quinn had drawn with Luis Andres Pineda (21-8-0 going in) over 8 rounds and dropped a 6 round decision to Harvey Jolly (8-10-1 going in). Prior to Pineda and Jolly Quinn had enjoyed some success with mediocre and varied opposition as (at least) his prior 10 fights were all wins. Before going in with
Siarhei Liakhovich, out of 7 fights
Bates had lost 6 fights. With the exception of Kevin Rainey (whom Bates actually beat); Ray Austin, Evander Holyfield, Guillermo Jones, Andrew Golota, Odlanier Solis, and Kali Mehan constituted the other 6 fight losses, and they had all stopped
Bates before 4 rounds; in either 8 or 10 round fights. However, as mentioned above,
Bates did manage to defeat Rainey via a unanimous decision over 4 rounds, in what was a 4 round fight somewhere in Kentucky - perhaps where fat men make Chevrolet corvettes. Unfortunately though, Kevin Rainey was (2-25-0) going into that fight with
Bates. Nuff said on that. Prior to
Bates and
Quinn for
Liakhovich was
Nikolay Valuev (47-1-0 going in) and
Shannon Briggs (47-4-1 going in). Both defeated
Siarhei Liakhovich in 12 round fights - although these fights probably mark the last time when
Liakhovich was a live dog and seriously committed to the sport. Like with Malik Scott, perhaps
Liakhovich's opponent's records are not all the fault of
Siarhei Liakhovich himself. Perhaps
Siarhei Liakhovich's manager/promoter had no knowledge of his opponent's records and/or didn't chase guys that looked like that, and perhaps
Liakhovich (as Scott did) simply turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said and as with Malik Scott, the above provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Siarhei Liakhovich.


-stormcentre :

Try this. Wilder's best win. The best fighter that fighter defeated. The best fighter that fighter faced.
And that would be (for Wilder) either Scott or Liakhovich. Going into his fight with Wilder;
A)
Malik Scott - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 1, drew 1, and * won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Deontay Wilder,
Malik Scott fought
Grover Young (7-12-1 going in) and
Dereck Chisora (16-4-0 going in).
Grover Young was dispatched by TKO in the second round of a 6 round fight, and
Dereck Chisora handed
Scott a TKO loss in the sixth round of a 10 round dance.
Grover Young - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 5 straight (mostly 6 and 4 round) fights in a row via every permutation that a loss can occupy.
Derek Chisora - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 4 fights out of his previous 6. Those
Chisora wins came against Hector Alfredo Avila (20-12-1 going in) and Remigijus Ziausys (18-43-3 going in) in what were, respectively,
Chisora's 1st and 5th fights before facing
Scott.
Chisora both; TKO'd Hector Alfredo Avila in the 9th round of a 10 round fight, whereas Remigijus Ziausys was defeated on points over 6 rounds The 4 losses
Derek Chisora encountered before facing
Malik Scott came against Tyson Fury (14-0-0 going in), Vitali Klitschko (43-2-0 going in), Robert Helenius (16-0-0 going in), and David Haye (25-2-0 going in). All these losses - except for David Haye - were points losses over 12 rounds. Haye stopped
Chisora in 5 rounds of a scheduled 10, in what was
Chisora's 2nd most previous fight before meeting
Malik Scott. Before
Derek Chisora, Malik Scott fought;
Vyacheslav Glazkov, Bowie Tupou, Alvaro Morales, and Kendrick Releford. Aside from
Vyacheslav Glazkov (14-0-0 going in) - whom
Scott fought a 10 round split decision draw with -
Scott defeated
Bowie Tupou (22-1-0 going in),
Alvaro Morales (6-10-6 going in), and
Kendrick Releford (22-15-2 going in) in either 6 or 8 round contests, and these wins account for the 4 *above-mentioned successful fights
Malik Scott had before meeting
Deontay Wilder.
Malik Scott dispatched both
Alvaro Morales and
Kendrick Releford via decision wins - whereas
Tupou was TKO'd in round 8 of a scheduled 8 round fight. Looking at the state of their records as they headed in with
Malik Scott,
Bowie Tupou's was approaching - but not quite - eyebrow raising; despite the fact there was only 1 loss on his ledger. As for both
Morales and
Releford's records as they headed in with
Malik Scott, well you can see for yourself from what I have pinned to this piece above. Their losses were not too far in the rear vision mirror of their careers, such that when they met
Scott they had no bearing on their threshold of performance, pain, and the fight in question. Perhaps this is not entirely
Malik Scott's fault though, as he turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said, it provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Malik Scott.
B)
Siarhei Liakhovich - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 4 and won 2. The 2 fights before Wilder, Liakhovich fought
Robert Helenius (15-0-0 going in) and then
Bryant Jennings (12-0-0 going in) just before stepping in with Deontay. Both those fights didn't go past 9 rounds, as
Bryant retired
Liakhovich in 9 rounds, and
Helenius TKO'd
Liakhovich in the same amount of rounds; 9. Before, the
Robert Helenius and
Bryant Jennings losses (for Liakhovich) came
Evans Quinn (18-3-1 going in) and
Jeremy Bates (22-16-1 going in); whom
Liakhovich beat both by stoppage -
Bates in 1 round, and
Quinn in round 9. Of those two
Liakhovich wins over Quinn and Bates the following information is associated; Before going in with
Liakhovich,
Quinn had drawn with Luis Andres Pineda (21-8-0 going in) over 8 rounds and dropped a 6 round decision to Harvey Jolly (8-10-1 going in). Prior to Pineda and Jolly Quinn had enjoyed some success with mediocre and varied opposition as (at least) his prior 10 fights were all wins. Before going in with
Siarhei Liakhovich, out of 7 fights
Bates had lost 6 fights. With the exception of Kevin Rainey (whom Bates actually beat); Ray Austin, Evander Holyfield, Guillermo Jones, Andrew Golota, Odlanier Solis, and Kali Mehan constituted the other 6 fight losses, and they had all stopped
Bates before 4 rounds; in either 8 or 10 round fights. However, as mentioned above,
Bates did manage to defeat Rainey via a unanimous decision over 4 rounds, in what was a 4 round fight somewhere in Kentucky - perhaps where fat men make Chevrolet corvettes. Unfortunately though, Kevin Rainey was (2-25-0) going into that fight with
Bates. Nuff said on that. Prior to
Bates and
Quinn for
Liakhovich was
Nikolay Valuev (47-1-0 going in) and
Shannon Briggs (47-4-1 going in). Both defeated
Siarhei Liakhovich in 12 round fights - although these fights probably mark the last time when
Liakhovich was a live dog and seriously committed to the sport. Like with Malik Scott, perhaps
Liakhovich's opponent's records are not all the fault of
Siarhei Liakhovich himself. Perhaps
Siarhei Liakhovich's manager/promoter had no knowledge of his opponent's records and/or didn't chase guys that looked like that, and perhaps
Liakhovich (as Scott did) simply turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said and as with Malik Scott, the above provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Siarhei Liakhovich.


-King Beef :

No,no no, no. It's that wide. It's from where I'm sitting to where you are right now. The moment that Wilder realizes he's not in Kansas anymore it's going to become amateur hour. He's an arm puncher in spots, and will have zero gauge if thing starts to go any rounds. Can Wilder win? Sure, underdogs win fairly often enough. But Wilder is favored. Think about that for a minute. Doesn't possess one quality win and may close a two to one favorite. Told you all that God is a boxing fan. As for the guy that stopped Stiverne, it would have been nice to see what might of happened if a real referee was overseeing the bout. Stiverne, if nothing else, showed he could find his way past Arreolla twice. Malik Scott? Had Malik Scott showed up with a deep desire to win, it wouldn't have meant much, but that didn't happen either.
I agree Wilder should not be favored, and also if it goes some rounds he may be on the short end side of an @ss whuppin. To me if this fight gets into middle rounds, it means Stiverne has taken a few of his shots and is still there...throwing!, which will probably mean Wilder's confidence has taken a blow because he use to his previous "lesser opponents" being outta there. Stiverne seems to be more battle tested, but a on the down hill slide Areolla just doesn't spread that margin that wide to me. It would have been nice to see Wilder step in there with Chris to really get a guage. i guess we will find out Saturday if Wilder is ready or not....I still can't confidently make a pick..especially after watching the Firtha replay on Showtime last night. Wilder looked sloppy and very hittable by counters.


-Radam G :

I agree Wilder should not be favored, and also if it goes some rounds he may be on the short end side of an @ss whuppin. To me if this fight gets into middle rounds, it means Stiverne has taken a few of his shots and is still there...throwing!, which will probably mean Wilder's confidence has taken a blow because he use to his previous "lesser opponents" being outta there. Stiverne seems to be more battle tested, but a on the down hill slide Areolla just doesn't spread that margin that wide to me. It would have been nice to see Wilder step in there with Chris to really get a guage. i guess we will find out Saturday if Wilder is ready or not....I still can't confidently make a pick..especially after watching the Firtha replay on Showtime last night. Wilder looked sloppy and very hittable by counters.
Wow! Chris would also kayo D-Wild. He cannot handle that work. That he avoided it, even in sparring. Holla!


-deepwater2 :

The fact that DW is fighting for a title at this point shows me he has powerful forces moving him and backing him. I can't bet against that fact. Remember that movie where the lights went off during the fight between Lewis and Klit and the crooks robbed the casino?


-brownsugar :

And that would be (for Wilder) either Scott or Liakhovich. Going into his fight with Wilder;
A)
Malik Scott - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 1, drew 1, and * won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Deontay Wilder,
Malik Scott fought
Grover Young (7-12-1 going in) and
Dereck Chisora (16-4-0 going in).
Grover Young was dispatched by TKO in the second round of a 6 round fight, and
Dereck Chisora handed
Scott a TKO loss in the sixth round of a 10 round dance.
Grover Young - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 5 straight (mostly 6 and 4 round) fights in a row via every permutation that a loss can occupy.
Derek Chisora - before stepping in with
Malik Scott - had lost 4 fights out of his previous 6. Those
Chisora wins came against Hector Alfredo Avila (20-12-1 going in) and Remigijus Ziausys (18-43-3 going in) in what were, respectively,
Chisora's 1st and 5th fights before facing
Scott.
Chisora both; TKO'd Hector Alfredo Avila in the 9th round of a 10 round fight, whereas Remigijus Ziausys was defeated on points over 6 rounds The 4 losses
Derek Chisora encountered before facing
Malik Scott came against Tyson Fury (14-0-0 going in), Vitali Klitschko (43-2-0 going in), Robert Helenius (16-0-0 going in), and David Haye (25-2-0 going in). All these losses - except for David Haye - were points losses over 12 rounds. Haye stopped
Chisora in 5 rounds of a scheduled 10, in what was
Chisora's 2nd most previous fight before meeting
Malik Scott. Before
Derek Chisora, Malik Scott fought;
Vyacheslav Glazkov, Bowie Tupou, Alvaro Morales, and Kendrick Releford. Aside from
Vyacheslav Glazkov (14-0-0 going in) - whom
Scott fought a 10 round split decision draw with -
Scott defeated
Bowie Tupou (22-1-0 going in),
Alvaro Morales (6-10-6 going in), and
Kendrick Releford (22-15-2 going in) in either 6 or 8 round contests, and these wins account for the 4 *above-mentioned successful fights
Malik Scott had before meeting
Deontay Wilder.
Malik Scott dispatched both
Alvaro Morales and
Kendrick Releford via decision wins - whereas
Tupou was TKO'd in round 8 of a scheduled 8 round fight. Looking at the state of their records as they headed in with
Malik Scott,
Bowie Tupou's was approaching - but not quite - eyebrow raising; despite the fact there was only 1 loss on his ledger. As for both
Morales and
Releford's records as they headed in with
Malik Scott, well you can see for yourself from what I have pinned to this piece above. Their losses were not too far in the rear vision mirror of their careers, such that when they met
Scott they had no bearing on their threshold of performance, pain, and the fight in question. Perhaps this is not entirely
Malik Scott's fault though, as he turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said, it provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Malik Scott.
B)
Siarhei Liakhovich - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 4 and won 2. The 2 fights before Wilder, Liakhovich fought
Robert Helenius (15-0-0 going in) and then
Bryant Jennings (12-0-0 going in) just before stepping in with Deontay. Both those fights didn't go past 9 rounds, as
Bryant retired
Liakhovich in 9 rounds, and
Helenius TKO'd
Liakhovich in the same amount of rounds; 9. Before, the
Robert Helenius and
Bryant Jennings losses (for Liakhovich) came
Evans Quinn (18-3-1 going in) and
Jeremy Bates (22-16-1 going in); whom
Liakhovich beat both by stoppage -
Bates in 1 round, and
Quinn in round 9. Of those two
Liakhovich wins over Quinn and Bates the following information is associated; Before going in with
Liakhovich,
Quinn had drawn with Luis Andres Pineda (21-8-0 going in) over 8 rounds and dropped a 6 round decision to Harvey Jolly (8-10-1 going in). Prior to Pineda and Jolly Quinn had enjoyed some success with mediocre and varied opposition as (at least) his prior 10 fights were all wins. Before going in with
Siarhei Liakhovich, out of 7 fights
Bates had lost 6 fights. With the exception of Kevin Rainey (whom Bates actually beat); Ray Austin, Evander Holyfield, Guillermo Jones, Andrew Golota, Odlanier Solis, and Kali Mehan constituted the other 6 fight losses, and they had all stopped
Bates before 4 rounds; in either 8 or 10 round fights. However, as mentioned above,
Bates did manage to defeat Rainey via a unanimous decision over 4 rounds, in what was a 4 round fight somewhere in Kentucky - perhaps where fat men make Chevrolet corvettes. Unfortunately though, Kevin Rainey was (2-25-0) going into that fight with
Bates. Nuff said on that. Prior to
Bates and
Quinn for
Liakhovich was
Nikolay Valuev (47-1-0 going in) and
Shannon Briggs (47-4-1 going in). Both defeated
Siarhei Liakhovich in 12 round fights - although these fights probably mark the last time when
Liakhovich was a live dog and seriously committed to the sport. Like with Malik Scott, perhaps
Liakhovich's opponent's records are not all the fault of
Siarhei Liakhovich himself. Perhaps
Siarhei Liakhovich's manager/promoter had no knowledge of his opponent's records and/or didn't chase guys that looked like that, and perhaps
Liakhovich (as Scott did) simply turned up and did what he had to. Still, that said and as with Malik Scott, the above provides an insight into whom
Deontay Wilder faced when he fought
Siarhei Liakhovich.
Storm it would be fun if you could assign a value to Stivernes best two opponents vs Wilders best two opponents. Based on your research, what do you think those number would look like Hypothetically speaking I would say BS's best opponents would get a 72 (out of 100) and Wilders would get a 58. But your the man who created the tool so I'm curious to see how you would rate the opponents based on your evaluation?


-stormcentre :

I don't really care who wins the fight, but I just took some time to have a squiz at Firtha V Wilder.
->https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOSifbZWin0 Oh my god (assuming he has not greatly improved) if this is the next heavyweight champion it is a tad concerning. Rarely have I seen a supposedly championship fighter perform so embarrassingly in a winning context. Wilder - to me - was embarrassing in the way he show boated and in doing so exhibited so many fundamental mistakes; with someone (Firtha) that was basically at club-fighter level. Firtha should never have been in there with Deontay and Deontay should have asked for someone better when Firtha was originally gifted unto him. During the fight, at times, Wilder would nervously raise his hands when he thought (an already damaged) Firtha was about to release incoming fire. Firtha was too spent/slow to know it, but in just being there and appearing as if he was about to rush in, he was effectively spooking Deontay into a vulnerable position - one where a left hook and/or uppercut could have been landed. Other times during the fight Wilder had absolutely no idea whether his left jab had actually set up the right cross - but Wilder just threw it wildly anyway; to mostly miss - in the hope of creating a spectacular knockout. Deontay exhibited a wide range of issues, including those mentioned above in conjunction with balance and timing problems - and the list goes on. Believe it or not this is an objective assessment of Wilder - as I really don't prefer either guy (Stiverne or Wilder). And, all these symptoms of what could be greater problems (when faced with serious opposition) was against Firtha - who effectively had no defence or stamina. Aereolla, (the one Stiverne fought the second time) in my opinion would have knocked Wilder out (or seriously hurt/stunned him) if someone could snap their fingers and instantly substitute him for Firtha during the Firtha V Wilder fight. The slow motion replays - around the 24 min mark - show just how un-composed (decomposed?) Wilder on the attack really is, and quite frankly it's hard to see how he can beat a seasoned heavyweight unless he catches them by surprise and/or early - or they have no chin, experience, stamina, or skills. Based on that fight alone it's hard to prevent the view forming that Wilder will $hit himself if (a) his usual antics don't work, (b) his chin and stamina get checked, and (c) if Bermane can get close and start countering and throwing with him; which is what my plan would be to do - after round 5 - unless he put that head high and jawline on a silver platter for me earlier. On a perhaps more humorous note; in between rounds 3 and 4 Firtha's corner told him "the only mistake you're making is that you're lunging in". Hmmm - OK. Perhaps Wilder was deliberately reckless against Firtha. I hope so because that performance was concerning regardless of whether or not he beats Bermane this weekend - or ends up on the canvass and/or stopped.


-stormcentre :

Storm it would be fun if you could assign a value to Stivernes best two opponents vs Wilders best two opponents. Based on your research, what do you think those number would look like Hypothetically speaking I would say BS's best opponents would get a 72 (out of 100) and Wilders would get a 58. But your the man who created the tool so I'm curious to see how you would rate the opponents based on your evaluation?
I have already done the work - but not put the results into content for TSS yet. I will try and have a look at doing that before the fight; if I get time. I can say right now, just from where I am sitting, it doesn't look crash hot for Wilder. But hey, upsets (is that the right choice of word considering Wilder is deemed the favourite?) happen, and Wilder could catch Bermane. After all they're heavyweights. If Wilder wins (in my books) it will be far more sensational than if Bermane does. Not in the least as (due to Wilder's style) there are (or appears to be) multiple paths to a victory for Stiverne; whereas for Wilder I think he is cut fish if he can't keep the fight long (range) and short (distance), and think about where his hands are before/after he punches. I am really surprised Wilder is the betting favourite by so much - but then perhaps some bookies think the sting is in with the Haymon/King thing - who knows. Or, of course I could be wildly wrong - it happens regularly.


-oubobcat :

Bobcat, bobcat. bobcat. I can actually see your point of vies, as well as all the other 50% who are picking Stiverne. While I do agree that Wilder's opponents since he turned pro in 2008 have been less-than-world-class, I really don't see a world-class list on Stiverne's record, either. But I spelled this out on my post "Why Deontay Wilder Will Beat Bermane Stiverne." Cris Arreola was the one "name Stiverne fought. And beat. Twice. The first time, he pounded on, beat on, whupped on an out-of-shape Arreola. Knocked him down. Broke his nose. Battered him. Puffed him up. Yet, he couldn't stop him. Thehe faced Arreola in a rematch. Go figure. Arreola came into the fight in better shape and even rocked Stiverne a few times with right hands, some which weren't even flush, before Stiverne stopped him. Hey, these are the heavyweights and every one of them can punch. But Stiverne is going to quickly fight out the right hand which he just got hit with is not the right of Demetrius King, who landed one dozen rights before stopping Stiverne. Forget the fact that the stoppage was an awful one and one I now use in my Referees' Seminars. Can you see Wilder landing 12 right hands? Twelve?? Maybe one. Or a follow-up, tuck-him-in right. But 12? Uh-uh. Nor will Wilder's vastly-improved jab feel like a 17-17-1 Charles Davis' jab. Yes, the same Charles Davis who took Stiverne to an eight-round majority draw in 2009. Or will Wilder's left hook, which has been dropping sparring partners throughout training camp, feel like anything Stiverne has ever tasted. I have no question Wilder will be able to go the 12-round distance. I don't believe he wants to do that. I believe--check that, I KNOW--he wants to get this over with very fast, and is willing to trade shots if he has to. I think I'm correct in stating that neither man has been on the floor as a pro. That will change on Saturday. But I don't think Stiverne will be counted out. After he gets dropped a few times and realizes what Malik Scott, Sergei Liakhovich and 30 other opponents have realized--that Deontay Wilder's power is real, that it's bonafide, Grade A heavyweight championship power--the referee will mercifully move in and halt the contest. This will not be a stoppage like the Demetrius King stoppage, where fans screamed at the ref, "Why are you stopping it?" Instead, they'll be screaming for referee Tony Weeks to get in there and "Stop it before the guy gets killed!" "...and NEW..." -Randy G.
Stiverne has not fought a ton of credible opponents. But he has been in fights and been tested. He's been through adversity and overcome tough situations to win. And because of those experiences, he has improved and gained confidence. Ray Austin is by no means a top contender. But yet nearly four years ago an aging Austin was beating Stiverne. There is no mistake that Stiverne looked bad in that fight. He was losing to a faded non-contender. That is bad. But he found resolve late to rally and score a come from behind knockout. And you know what happened afterward? He took the criticism of that performance to heart. He watched tape and saw his flaws. He went to the gym and worked. He saw now that his talents alone could not get him through fights. He had to make improvements and put in heavy work to get somewhere in this sport. And something else happened in that Austin experience. Stiverne had to fight through adversity. He responded well in a tough situation behind in the fight and needing a knockout. The experience of having gone through a tough spot and getting pushed but yet prevailing cannot be understated. He beat Arreola twice and both times convincingly. He looked like a much better fighter than he did against Austin. He knew he could fight through adversity and he knew he overcame some things in that fight to win and became better because of that experience. It showed twice against Arreola. I like Wilder. He has talent, is very athletic and has serious power. But he has never faced anyone who could remotely compete with him inside the ring. He needed to be pushed some. He needed to face a threat. He needed to see some adversity and be able to respond. He needed to learn from that and become better through that experience. The sport is littered with a history of fighters who have been cuddled and then thrown getting exposed once going into the deep water. Its going to happen again here. Wilder may have his moments but when pushed for the first time against a world class fighter I don't see him responding well. This is not Ray Austin, this is the improved Bermaine Stiverne.


-The Commish :

Stiverne has not fought a ton of credible opponents. But he has been in fights and been tested. He's been through adversity and overcome tough situations to win. And because of those experiences, he has improved and gained confidence. Ray Austin is by no means a top contender. But yet nearly four years ago an aging Austin was beating Stiverne. There is no mistake that Stiverne looked bad in that fight. He was losing to a faded non-contender. That is bad. But he found resolve late to rally and score a come from behind knockout. And you know what happened afterward? He took the criticism of that performance to heart. He watched tape and saw his flaws. He went to the gym and worked. He saw now that his talents alone could not get him through fights. He had to make improvements and put in heavy work to get somewhere in this sport. And something else happened in that Austin experience. Stiverne had to fight through adversity. He responded well in a tough situation behind in the fight and needing a knockout. The experience of having gone through a tough spot and getting pushed but yet prevailing cannot be understated. He beat Arreola twice and both times convincingly. He looked like a much better fighter than he did against Austin. He knew he could fight through adversity and he knew he overcame some things in that fight to win and became better because of that experience. It showed twice against Arreola. I like Wilder. He has talent, is very athletic and has serious power. But he has never faced anyone who could remotely compete with him inside the ring. He needed to be pushed some. He needed to face a threat. He needed to see some adversity and be able to respond. He needed to learn from that and become better through that experience. The sport is littered with a history of fighters who have been cuddled and then thrown getting exposed once going into the deep water. Its going to happen again here. Wilder may have his moments but when pushed for the first time against a world class fighter I don't see him responding well. This is not Ray Austin, this is the improved Bermaine Stiverne.
I totally hear what you all are saying, but I realize this is one of those cases where my heart is overruling my head. There's just nothing I can do. My head and my heart have had a long talk about this, but neither will budge. It's like $$$May and Manny Pacquiao at the negotiating table--stalemate. So, I am going with my heart. Wilder by early KO. -Randy G.


-brownsugar :

I have already done the work - but not put the results into content for TSS yet. I will try and have a look at doing that before the fight; if I get time. I can say right now, just from where I am sitting, it doesn't look crash hot for Wilder. But hey, upsets (is that the right choice of word considering Wilder is deemed the favourite?) happen, and Wilder could catch Bermane. After all they're heavyweights. If Wilder wins (in my books) it will be far more sensational than if Bermane does. Not in the least as (due to Wilder's style) there are (or appears to be) multiple paths to a victory for Stiverne; whereas for Wilder I think he is cut fish if he can't keep the fight long (range) and short (distance), and think about where his hands are before/after he punches. I am really surprised Wilder is the betting favourite by so much - but then perhaps some bookies think the sting is in with the Haymon/King thing - who knows. Or, of course I could be wildly wrong - it happens regularly.
The Firtha fight is the one I like to refer to the most because he actually puts up a fight. Firtha literally gave his all and due to his limitations finally got rocked beyond his ability to recover. But Firtha was defiant all the way ...like a true die hard. His forward movement complicated things a bit and makes me wonder how Stiverne could benefit if he used an aggressive approach. Good stuff Still want Wilder to win for obvious and shamelessly political reasons....even though he's the underdog.


-stormcentre :

Let’s now look at Stiverne’s 2 best opponents. (Sorry, can't be bothered bolding out the opponent/fighter's that relate to the first and second level analysis with this one - to separate them from the other opponents). Arguably they must be; Cris Arreola and Ray Austin. Going into his fight with Stiverne; A) Ray Austin - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 2 and won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Bermane Stiverne, Ray Austin fought Odlanier Solis (16-0-0 going in) and DaVarryl Williamson (26-5-0 going in). Odlanier Solis – whom Ray Austin fought just prior to Arreola - was successful against Ray Austin due to the fact that Ray Austin was said to have punched Odlanier Solis after the bell in the tenth round of a 12 round fight. Nevertheless Austin lost that fight. DaVarryl Williamson (whom Ray Austin fought before Solis) was TKO’d by Ray Austin in the fourth round of a 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator contest. Odlanier Solis - before stepping in with Ray Austin - had won more than 10 straight (mostly 8 and above round) fights in a row via several different permutations that a win can occupy – with also a healthy dose of stoppage wins thrown in. Furthermore, at least 80% of the 5 previous fights Odlanier Solis had prior to Austin were for and/or related to a WBC and/or WBA heavyweight title. After Odlanier Solis beat Ray Austin on a disqualification Solis went on to fight Vitali Klitschko (41-2-0 going in) for the WBC heavyweight title, where he lost by KO in the first round. Still, Odlanier Solis picked himself up and won 3 more in a row, that were all related to a heavyweight title of some sort. In his most recent fight Odlanier Solis lost a 12 round decision to Tony Thompson (38-4-0 going in) for the WBC international heavyweight title; so the guy is still reasonably in form. DaVarryl Williamson - before stepping in with Ray Austin - had won 4 fights out of his previous 6, equating to 2 losses out of that group of 6 fights. Those DaVarryl Williamson wins came against Carl Davis (14-2-0 going in), Cerrone Fox (8-8-0 going in), Maurice Wheeler (10-9-1 going in), and Mike Mollo (15-0-0 going in) in what were, respectively, Williamson’s 1st, 2nd, 4th and 5th fights before he faced Ray Austin (27-4-4 going in); where he lost (by TKO) in the 4th round of a scheduled 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator fight. DaVarryl Williamson’s above-mentioned wins all came by way of stoppage where, Davis, Fox, Wheeler and Mollo, all did not see past the 5th round in what were mostly – save for the (then) unbeaten Mollo being stopped in round 4 of a scheduled 10 rounder - 8 round fights. (Note: Even just at this point of the comparison between Wilder and Stiverne’s opponents, and their opponents, it becomes abundantly clear that Stiverne’s opposition in Ray Austin (and Austin’s opponents also) clearly outshines either Malik Scott’s or Siarhei Liakhovich’s; which are arguably Wilder’s best 2 opponents. This consideration is possibly further augmented by the fact that; a) Ray Austin is probably not Stiverne’s most capable opponent; as that award probably goes to Cris Arreola (35-3-0 going into his last fight with Bermane, and 34-2-0 going into the one with Stiverne before that). b) Cris Arreola is someone that Stiverne has fought most recently – twice – as match practice going into Bermane’s upcoming fight with Wilder; whereas Wilder – for match practice going into his fight with Stiverne – has (only) fought Jason Galvern (25-16-4 going in)). Those 2 above-mentioned DaVarryl Williamson losses that were encountered before facing Ray Austin came against Kali Mehan (32-3-0 going in) – whom has recently beat Shane Cameron – and Chris Byrd (38-2-1 going in). And, of these 2 losses that DaVarryl Williamson experienced, all took place in 12 round fights. With the Mehan bout DaVarryl Williamson lost by TKO in round 6 of a fight that was for the vacant WBO NABO heavyweight title. With the Byrd bout DaVarryl Williamson lost by a unanimous decision in a fight that was for the IBF heavyweight title. Before DaVarryl Williamson, Ray Austin fought; Julius Long, Andrew Golota, Domonic Jenkins, and Wladimir Klitscho. Aside from Wladimir Klitscho (47-3-0 going in) - whom Austin fought and lost, by a 2nd round KO, when competing for the IBO heavyweight title – Ray Austin successfully banged it out with Julius Long (15-10-0 going in), Andrew Golota (41-6-1 going in), and Domonic Jenkins (13-9-1 going in); in either 8 or 12 round contests. And these 3 wins (combined with Ray Austin’s win in the fourth round of a 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator contest against DaVarryl Williamson) account for the 4 above-mentioned successful fights Ray Austin had before meeting Bermane Stiverne. So it seems Ray Austin was on a bit of a roll before he ran into Bermane Stiverne. Ray Austin dispatched both Julius Long and Domonic Jenkins via decision wins over 8 round fights - whereas Andrew Golota retired in the 1st round of a scheduled 12 round fight (courtesy of Austin) for something that was called the USA (USNBC) WBC heavyweight title. Looking at the state of Long, Golota, Jenkins, and Klitscho’s records as they headed in with Ray Austin; Julius Long's record was a bit eyebrow raising - as he had taken on 2 losses, a win, a no contest, and then 2 losses before that – prior to tangling with Austin and losing a unanimous decision over 8 rounds - in a fight where Austin was deducted 2 points for hitting Long whilst he was down. Of the 4 above-mentioned losses Julius Long wore before meeting Austin, 2 of them were by KO to reasonable guys like Samuel Peters (for the vacant NABF heavyweight title) and Alexander Ustinov; who were, respectively, 25-1-0 and 12-0-0 going in. The other 2 losses for Long where to Odlanier Solis (for the vacant WBC Latino heavyweight title) and Terry Smith who were, respectively, 5-0-0 and 24-1-1 going in at that time. Even Long’s above-mentioned no contest and win appears to have come against reasonable opposition in, respectively, Vinny Maddalone (27-3-0 going in) and Eli Dixon (22-8-1 going in). As for both Golota and Jenkins's records as they headed in with Ray Austin; Golota’s was (perhaps not unsurprisingly) inconsistent but acceptable as – from his 6 bouts before meeting Ray Austin - he had various results (3 wins, 2 losses and a draw; before facing Austin) with various levels of opposition ranging from very good to what I would call padding. The “better bouts” Golota had were probably against Chris Byrd (37-2-0 going in), John Ruiz (40-5-1 going in), and Lamon Brewster (31-2-0 going in); for what was, respectively, an IBF world heavyweight title shot, a WBA world heavyweight title shot, and a WBO world heavyweight title shot - where on all counts Golota, in some way, shape, or form, came up a little short – particularly against Brewster. And – from 6 his bouts before meeting Ray Austin - Golota’s “not so better bouts” were probably against Kevin McBride (34-5-1 going in) and Jeremy Bates (21-13-1 going in); whom he both beat by stoppage over either a scheduled 10 or 12 round fight. The McBride fight was for the vacant IBF North American heavyweight title – so many titles and so little time. Moving onto Jenkins; from his 6 bouts before meeting Ray Austin he had 3 wins and 3 losses against various levels of opposition ranging from unskilled/inexperienced to skilled/experienced; where he seemed to come up short when sharing the ring with the latter. Of that group, Jenkin’s more spectacular wins appears to have come from guys with high loss percentages. Perhaps notably he defeated Jason Gavern (13-3-2 going in) by decision over 6 rounds – the same guy Wilder has just fought as preparation for Stiverne. Jenkin’s losses in that 6-fight group mostly all come from contender level (or better) guys; some that were known to hit hard if you; stood in front of them, or got tired, or both. Unlike some of Ray Austin’s other above-mentioned opponents, there is not a great deal of title fights on Jenkin’s record. Of all that within the aforementioned group of opponents that Ray Austin faced before fighting Bermane Stiverne, that only leaves Wladimir Klitscho (who was 47-3-0 going in) to the Ray Austin IBO heavyweight title fight; that Klitscho himself won via a 2nd round KO of Austin. However, there probably is no need to dissect Klitscho’s record here. As most reading this breakdown know who he is, what he can do, what he has achieved, and where he sits in the realm of Austin’s, Arreola’s or anyone else’s record that has fought him. In closing this section and as an adjunct; before Ray Austin fought and lost to Wladimir Klitscho, Ray Austin also fought Sultan Ibragimov (19-0-0 going in) for an IBF heavyweight title eliminator; in what was Austin’s 7th fight before he faced Bermane Stiverne. Despite Sultan Ibragimov being down in round 10 and Ray Austin being down in round 4, the fight was declared a draw! So the question is, does Ray Austin’s above-mentioned accomplishments/achievements make him better opposition and preparation than, say, Wilder’s Malik Scott and/or Siarhei Liakhovich; enough to provide a theoretical advantage for Stiverne in this analysis? Personally, I think it’s difficult not to say “yes” to that question. B) Cris Arreola - out of his previous 6 fights (to the last Bermane Stiverne fight) - won 4, lost 1 (against Bermane Stiverne), and experienced 1 no contest. The 2 fights before (the last most recent bout with) Bermane Stiverne; Cris Arreola fought Bermane Stiverne for the 1st time (22-1-1 going in) and then after that came Seth Mitchell (26-1-1 going in) - these were the two fights just before Arreola stepped in with Bermane Stiverne (23-1-1 going in) for a second time in their most recent bout where Arreola was stopped in the 6th by Stiverne. Both those 2 previous fights were split for a loss and a win, in the following way; Against Bermane Stiverne the first time in a contest for the WBC silver heavyweight title, Cris Arreola dropped a 12 round decision - whilst both giving a good account of himself and also proving to be a reasonably difficult test for Stiverne. This was despite the fact that Arreola was down in the 3rd round and pretty busted up during/after the fight. Against Seth Mitchell, Cris Arreola - in a 12 round contest for the WBC international heavyweight title - blew Mitchell out in 1 round. Seth Mitchell, before facing Cris Arreola had tested himself with mediocre to slightly above average (for today’s heavyweight scene) fighters; with guys like, Chazz Witherspoon (30-2-0 going in), Jonathon Banks (28-1-1 and 29-1-1 going in) and Cris Arreloa (34-3-0 going in) being the better names on his resume. Before, the Seth Mitchell and Bermane Stiverne win/losses (for Arreloa) came; Eric Molina (18-1-0 going in), Raphael Butler (35-11-0 going in), Friday Ahunanya (24-7-3 going in) and Kendrick Releford (22-14-2 going in); whom - with the exception of Friday Ahunanya (whom constituted Cris’ above-mentioned no contest) - Cris Arreloa all beat by (as was the case with Seth Mitchell) stoppages in contests that were scheduled for either 10 or 12 rounds. Eric Molina was knocked out by Cris in 1 round, for the WBC USNBC heavyweight title. Butler went down in 3 – courtesy of Cris. The Ahunanya bout became a no contest, but from the scorecards at the time it appears Arreola was dominating. As for Kendrick Releford it appears that he was stopped in the 7th, by Arreola, of a 10 round non title contest. Of those four Cris Arreola wins the following information is associated; Before going in with Cris Arreola, Molina had won not just all 6 fights (as is the usual amount of previous fights these assessments span), but more than 10 in a row. Molina’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A TKO win in round 3 of a scheduled 12, for the vacant WBC USNBC heavyweight title, over Warren Browning (14-1-1 going in). 2) A TKO win, in round 6 of a scheduled 6, over Joseph Rabotte (9-15-1 going in). 3) A decision win, over a scheduled 6 round contest, over Rayford Johnson (6-5-0 going in). 4) A stoppage win (by way of retirement) in round 3, of a scheduled 6 round contest over Leo Bercier (8-14-1 going in). 5) A TKO win, in round 4 of a scheduled 10, for the vacant WBC Latino cruiserweight title, over Chris Thomas (17-11-12 going in). 6) A decision win over a scheduled 6 round contest over Andrew Greeley (14-30-2 going in). Before Molina, Arreola fought Raphael Butler. Butler, from his previous 6 fights before meeting Arreola, only won once; as the ledger reads 4 losses, 1 no contest, and 1 win. Butler’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A TKO loss, in round 6 of a scheduled 10, courtesy of Tye Fields (48-4-0 going in). 2) A TKO loss, in round 1 of a scheduled 8, courtesy of David Price (9-0-0 going in). 3) A decision loss, over a scheduled 10 round contest, courtesy of Neven Pajkic (13-0-0 going in). 4) A no contest decision within a scheduled 10 round contest over Joey Abell (25-4-0 going in). 5) A TKO win in round 2 of a scheduled 6 over Marcus Rhode (34-38-2 going in). 6) A decision loss, over a scheduled 8 round contest, courtesy of Malik Scott (31-0-0 going in). Before Butler, Arreola fought Friday Ahunanya. Since Friday Ahunanya constitutes Cris Arreola’s above-mentioned no contest I have not bothered to detail his 6 fight history before he went in with Arreola. Before Friday Ahunanya, Cris Arreola fought Kendrick Releford. Releford, from his previous 6 fights before meeting Arreola, won four times and lost twice. Releford’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A decision loss, in a scheduled 8 round fight for the WBC FECARBOX heavyweight title, courtesy of Luis Ortiz (2-0-0 going in). 2) A decision win, in a scheduled 10 round fight, over Fred Kassi (15-1-0 going in). 3) A decision win, in a scheduled 6 round fight, over Billy Willis (11-17-1 going in). 4) A stoppage loss, by way of a 3rd round retirement, within a scheduled 10 round contest courtesy of Alexander Alekseev (17-1-0 going in). 5) A TKO win, in round 1 of a scheduled 8, over Patrick Smith (15-10-2 going in). 6) A TKO win, in round 2 of a scheduled 6, over Dennis McKinney (28-46-1 going in). To me, it’s quite obvious that Arreola – after losing to Tomasz Adamek (40-1-0 going in for what was the IBF and also the vacant NABO and WBO heavyweight titles) and Vitali Klitscho (37-2-0 going in for what was the WBC heavyweight title) – decided that he had to make a living out of boxing, and as such lowered his sights a little for a few years until the WBC heavyweight title became available to him again. Still, he is an opponent that – by way of who, and how, he fights – stands above most of Wilder’s opponents. Not in the least as Wilder himself appears to have no immediate opponents on his record that match; Vitali Klitscho, Tomasz Adamek, or Cris Arreloa. So, with all that completed the following summary can be released about the guys – besides Seth Mitchell and Bermane Stiverne (as they’re covered above) – that Cris Arreloa faced before he last and most recently faced Bermane Stiverne - where/when he was stopped in the 6th round of a 12 round contest for the vacant WBC heavyweight title; Eric Molina’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks good but appears somewhat padded with opponents that have concerning win/loss ratios. Raphael Butler’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks better than Molina’s in terms of the absence of opponents that have concerning win/loss ratios. However, the price Butler appears to have paid for this is that his abilities have become somewhat exposed in equal proportions to the stunt that his win ratio experienced. Kendrick Releford’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks to be only marginally better (if at all) than Raphael Butler’s record. Based on this please refer to my above comments pertaining to Raphael Butler’s record. Clearly both Deontay Wilder and Bermane Stiverne’s personal sets of their best 2 opponents – or at least those used here in this assessment - have themselves both faced good and questionable opponents. I deliberately detailed more of Bermane Stiverne’s opponent’s history to stave off anyone claiming I was subjective and in favour of Bermane Stiverne. However, despite that, one thing that stands out quite clearly from this exercise is that Bermane Stiverne’s opponents (and their opponents) are usually both winning and also contesting at an observably higher level of competition (than Wilder’s); which is evidenced by several facts - including the much larger amount of legitimate or near legitimate title fights Bermane Stiverne’s opponents (and their opponents) are involved in. For instance, in Bermane Stiverne’s favor, when discussing his 2 best opponents Cris Arreloa and Ray Austin; even their own/immediate or extended (by way of their opponent’s own opponents) involvement with domestic and/or international title fights easily exceeds the involvement of (Deontay Wilder’s best 2 opponents) Malik Scott and Siarhei Liakhovich, and also their opponents. A similar observation also happens when you assess the quality of opposition between Wilder and Stiverne, and their best 2 opponents. Put it all together with the fact that; a) Going into the Stiverne V Wilder fight – out of Bermane Stiverne’s recent four fights there is really only one soft touch (Willie Herring; Bermane Stiverne’s 3rd most recent fight, and the one after Ray Austin). Even then it’s questionable that Herring is a soft touch, but since I was not sure either way I played him for one to make it fair and favor Wilder more. Therefore, as far as this assessment is concerned Willie Herring is – out of Bermane Stiverne’s recent 4 fights – both his only soft touch and also Stiverne’s 3rd most recent fight; due to the fact that Stiverne has (most recently) fought Arreloa twice, then Willie Herring before the 2 Arreloa fights, and then he fought Ray Austin before the Willie Herring fight. b) Whereas out of Deontay Wilder’s recent four fights it’s hard to find one opponent that was/is not shot and/or not a soft touch, and it’s hard to understand whether that’s a suitable way to prepare for a legitimate heavyweight world title. Perhaps a case can be made for Malik Scott not being soft or shot when Wilder got to him and KO’d him in 1 round - but looking at his (and his opponent’s recent) record – particularly as he went into the Wilder fight - I am not sure about that. That then leaves us with Siarhei Liakhovich, Jason Gavern, and of course dear old Nicolai Firtha whom I have discussed in the context of his fight with Wilder an above post. I challenge anyone to make a case for any of those 3 not being spent and/or soft by the time Wilder got to them. When completing this exercise – within reason - I used the same format for Stiverne’s opponents as I previously did for Wilders, and I can tell you with the text (when describing fight outcomes) there was a lot of replacing “lose” or “lost” (with Wilder’s opponents) for “win” or “won” when it came to Stiverne’s opponents, and their opponents. Stranger things have happened in boxing, but based on the above if Wilder beats Stiverne this weekend it will be both remarkable and sensational - as well as going against a pretty tried and true tradition in boxing that holds experience against quality opposition – particularly that recently and successfully acquired – as an accurate matchmaking and performance yardstick. Over to you TSS crew.


-Froggy :

You took the words out of my mouth Storm, Stiverne wins !


-The Good Doctor :

A lot of you guys have dissected this fights to a degree that I can't even imagine and that is why I love this site. When reading all of you guys thoughts, ideas, and predictions something dawned on me. We really are comparing two guys that we know very little about due to their opposition. Stiverne does have a better resume in my mind but to me comparing these two guys resumes is like asking which would you rather eat, cat food or dog food. Both suck and it's hard to justify choosing either one. There is something to be said for beating bad guys badly, but only so much can be garnered from that. I have still yet to render a prediction on this fight because of so many unknowns such as: Wilder: Does he have a beard? I can't recall seeing him ever take a clean shot Wilder: What if the fight goes past 4 rounds? Wilder has only fought 4 rounds 5 times in his pro career. Everything else has been under with a predominant part being under 2. Wilder: Does he have real power or is he hitting marshmallowy guys? I think he does have good power but I am not sold on it being thunderous power yet. Stiverne: Is he the guy that crushed Arreola or had to really fight to beat Willie Herring and a 42 year old journeymen in Ray Austin? Stiverne: Is he going to abandon a bit of his normal flat footed plodding style just a little? If you look at alot of his fights, he is completely flat footed and often plods with his hands down. I do think Wilder is fast enough to take advantage of that and that could spell something bad for him if he does not adjust. I guess I'll have my mind made up by this weekend. What I do want more than anything is a competitive fight.


-deepwater2 :

A lot of you guys have dissected this fights to a degree that I can't even imagine and that is why I love this site. When reading all of you guys thoughts, ideas, and predictions something dawned on me. We really are comparing two guys that we know very little about due to their opposition. Stiverne does have a better resume in my mind but to me comparing these two guys resumes is like asking which would you rather eat, cat food or dog food. Both suck and it's hard to justify choosing either one. There is something to be said for beating bad guys badly, but only so much can be garnered from that. I have still yet to render a prediction on this fight because of so many unknowns such as: Wilder: Does he have a beard? I can't recall seeing him ever take a clean shot Wilder: What if the fight goes past 4 rounds? Wilder has only fought 4 rounds 5 times in his pro career. Everything else has been under with a predominant part being under 2. Wilder: Does he have real power or is he hitting marshmallowy guys? I think he does have good power but I am not sold on it being thunderous power yet. Stiverne: Is he the guy that crushed Arreola or had to really fight to beat Willie Herring and a 42 year old journeymen in Ray Austin? Stiverne: Is he going to abandon a bit of his normal flat footed plodding style just a little? If you look at alot of his fights, he is completely flat footed and often plods with his hands down. I do think Wilder is fast enough to take advantage of that and that could spell something bad for him if he does not adjust. I guess I'll have my mind made up by this weekend. What I do want more than anything is a competitive fight.
I brought up that Firtha tagged Wilder a lot before the ending. Wilder reminds me so much of Michael Grant. Same height and build and I believe Grant had somewhat better skills. Domenick Quinn knocked out Grant after Lennox Lewis annihilated him. Before the annihilation, Grant faced much better competition than Wilder and went good rounds. That said I will not put money on this fight. I just have a funny feeling about this one.


-amayseng :

A lot of you guys have dissected this fights to a degree that I can't even imagine and that is why I love this site. When reading all of you guys thoughts, ideas, and predictions something dawned on me. We really are comparing two guys that we know very little about due to their opposition. Stiverne does have a better resume in my mind but to me comparing these two guys resumes is like asking which would you rather eat, cat food or dog food. Both suck and it's hard to justify choosing either one. There is something to be said for beating bad guys badly, but only so much can be garnered from that. I have still yet to render a prediction on this fight because of so many unknowns such as: Wilder: Does he have a beard? I can't recall seeing him ever take a clean shot Wilder: What if the fight goes past 4 rounds? Wilder has only fought 4 rounds 5 times in his pro career. Everything else has been under with a predominant part being under 2. Wilder: Does he have real power or is he hitting marshmallowy guys? I think he does have good power but I am not sold on it being thunderous power yet. Stiverne: Is he the guy that crushed Arreola or had to really fight to beat Willie Herring and a 42 year old journeymen in Ray Austin? Stiverne: Is he going to abandon a bit of his normal flat footed plodding style just a little? If you look at alot of his fights, he is completely flat footed and often plods with his hands down. I do think Wilder is fast enough to take advantage of that and that could spell something bad for him if he does not adjust. I guess I'll have my mind made up by this weekend. What I do want more than anything is a competitive fight.
Exactly my thoughts the last two weeks and because of so many unknowns I have stayed relatively confined to not analyze this fight like others. If I have to pick it would be BS just because of his quality win over Chris. Chris is a tough out for anyone and BS shows good skills and a slick style that can frustrate and fatigue Wilder. More than anything I am hoping for a fun and competitive fight.


-The Good Doctor :

I brought up that Firtha tagged Wilder a lot before the ending. Wilder reminds me so much of Michael Grant. Same height and build and I believe Grant had somewhat better skills. Domenick Quinn knocked out Grant after Lennox Lewis annihilated him. Before the annihilation, Grant faced much better competition than Wilder and went good rounds. That said I will not put money on this fight. I just have a funny feeling about this one.
Don't disagree that Firtha got a few shots in but in my mind, and maybe I'm wrong, Deontay knew the guy could not hurt him and he got very wild with loading punches, throwing blows off balance, and just trying to "Clubber Lang" him. In addition, a shot from Firtha is hardly a chin challenging blow by the time he started hitting Deontay. As for not betting, you are 1000% in the right about that. This is a hard fight to call and even Vegas is acknowledging that. The odds opened at -130 for Wilder in most casinos and there has been little movement since then. I have seen a few -160 calls for Wilder but no more than that. Hardly the odds of a perceived mismatch like Santa Cruz's fight (-3900)


-amayseng :

Let’s now look at Stiverne’s 2 best opponents. (Sorry, can't be bothered bolding out the opponent/fighter's that relate to the first and second level analysis with this one - to separate them from the other opponents). Arguably they must be; Cris Arreola and Ray Austin. Going into his fight with Stiverne; A) Ray Austin - out of his previous 6 fights - lost 2 and won 4. The 2 fights just before stepping in with Bermane Stiverne, Ray Austin fought Odlanier Solis (16-0-0 going in) and DaVarryl Williamson (26-5-0 going in). Odlanier Solis – whom Ray Austin fought just prior to Arreola - was successful against Ray Austin due to the fact that Ray Austin was said to have punched Odlanier Solis after the bell in the tenth round of a 12 round fight. Nevertheless Austin lost that fight. DaVarryl Williamson (whom Ray Austin fought before Solis) was TKO’d by Ray Austin in the fourth round of a 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator contest. Odlanier Solis - before stepping in with Ray Austin - had won more than 10 straight (mostly 8 and above round) fights in a row via several different permutations that a win can occupy – with also a healthy dose of stoppage wins thrown in. Furthermore, at least 80% of the 5 previous fights Odlanier Solis had prior to Austin were for and/or related to a WBC and/or WBA heavyweight title. After Odlanier Solis beat Ray Austin on a disqualification Solis went on to fight Vitali Klitschko (41-2-0 going in) for the WBC heavyweight title, where he lost by KO in the first round. Still, Odlanier Solis picked himself up and won 3 more in a row, that were all related to a heavyweight title of some sort. In his most recent fight Odlanier Solis lost a 12 round decision to Tony Thompson (38-4-0 going in) for the WBC international heavyweight title; so the guy is still reasonably in form. DaVarryl Williamson - before stepping in with Ray Austin - had won 4 fights out of his previous 6, equating to 2 losses out of that group of 6 fights. Those DaVarryl Williamson wins came against Carl Davis (14-2-0 going in), Cerrone Fox (8-8-0 going in), Maurice Wheeler (10-9-1 going in), and Mike Mollo (15-0-0 going in) in what were, respectively, Williamson’s 1st, 2nd, 4th and 5th fights before he faced Ray Austin (27-4-4 going in); where he lost (by TKO) in the 4th round of a scheduled 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator fight. DaVarryl Williamson’s above-mentioned wins all came by way of stoppage where, Davis, Fox, Wheeler and Mollo, all did not see past the 5th round in what were mostly – save for the (then) unbeaten Mollo being stopped in round 4 of a scheduled 10 rounder - 8 round fights. (Note: Even just at this point of the comparison between Wilder and Stiverne’s opponents, and their opponents, it becomes abundantly clear that Stiverne’s opposition in Ray Austin (and Austin’s opponents also) clearly outshines either Malik Scott’s or Siarhei Liakhovich’s; which are arguably Wilder’s best 2 opponents. This consideration is possibly further augmented by the fact that; a) Ray Austin is probably not Stiverne’s most capable opponent; as that award probably goes to Cris Arreola (35-3-0 going into his last fight with Bermane, and 34-2-0 going into the one with Stiverne before that). b) Cris Arreola is someone that Stiverne has fought most recently – twice – as match practice going into Bermane’s upcoming fight with Wilder; whereas Wilder – for match practice going into his fight with Stiverne – has (only) fought Jason Galvern (25-16-4 going in)). Those 2 above-mentioned DaVarryl Williamson losses that were encountered before facing Ray Austin came against Kali Mehan (32-3-0 going in) – whom has recently beat Shane Cameron – and Chris Byrd (38-2-1 going in). And, of these 2 losses that DaVarryl Williamson experienced, all took place in 12 round fights. With the Mehan bout DaVarryl Williamson lost by TKO in round 6 of a fight that was for the vacant WBO NABO heavyweight title. With the Byrd bout DaVarryl Williamson lost by a unanimous decision in a fight that was for the IBF heavyweight title. Before DaVarryl Williamson, Ray Austin fought; Julius Long, Andrew Golota, Domonic Jenkins, and Wladimir Klitscho. Aside from Wladimir Klitscho (47-3-0 going in) - whom Austin fought and lost, by a 2nd round KO, when competing for the IBO heavyweight title – Ray Austin successfully banged it out with Julius Long (15-10-0 going in), Andrew Golota (41-6-1 going in), and Domonic Jenkins (13-9-1 going in); in either 8 or 12 round contests. And these 3 wins (combined with Ray Austin’s win in the fourth round of a 12 round WBC heavyweight title eliminator contest against DaVarryl Williamson) account for the 4 above-mentioned successful fights Ray Austin had before meeting Bermane Stiverne. So it seems Ray Austin was on a bit of a roll before he ran into Bermane Stiverne. Ray Austin dispatched both Julius Long and Domonic Jenkins via decision wins over 8 round fights - whereas Andrew Golota retired in the 1st round of a scheduled 12 round fight (courtesy of Austin) for something that was called the USA (USNBC) WBC heavyweight title. Looking at the state of Long, Golota, Jenkins, and Klitscho’s records as they headed in with Ray Austin; Julius Long's record was a bit eyebrow raising - as he had taken on 2 losses, a win, a no contest, and then 2 losses before that – prior to tangling with Austin and losing a unanimous decision over 8 rounds - in a fight where Austin was deducted 2 points for hitting Long whilst he was down. Of the 4 above-mentioned losses Julius Long wore before meeting Austin, 2 of them were by KO to reasonable guys like Samuel Peters (for the vacant NABF heavyweight title) and Alexander Ustinov; who were, respectively, 25-1-0 and 12-0-0 going in. The other 2 losses for Long where to Odlanier Solis (for the vacant WBC Latino heavyweight title) and Terry Smith who were, respectively, 5-0-0 and 24-1-1 going in at that time. Even Long’s above-mentioned no contest and win appears to have come against reasonable opposition in, respectively, Vinny Maddalone (27-3-0 going in) and Eli Dixon (22-8-1 going in). As for both Golota and Jenkins's records as they headed in with Ray Austin; Golota’s was (perhaps not unsurprisingly) inconsistent but acceptable as – from his 6 bouts before meeting Ray Austin - he had various results (3 wins, 2 losses and a draw; before facing Austin) with various levels of opposition ranging from very good to what I would call padding. The “better bouts” Golota had were probably against Chris Byrd (37-2-0 going in), John Ruiz (40-5-1 going in), and Lamon Brewster (31-2-0 going in); for what was, respectively, an IBF world heavyweight title shot, a WBA world heavyweight title shot, and a WBO world heavyweight title shot - where on all counts Golota, in some way, shape, or form, came up a little short – particularly against Brewster. And – from 6 his bouts before meeting Ray Austin - Golota’s “not so better bouts” were probably against Kevin McBride (34-5-1 going in) and Jeremy Bates (21-13-1 going in); whom he both beat by stoppage over either a scheduled 10 or 12 round fight. The McBride fight was for the vacant IBF North American heavyweight title – so many titles and so little time. Moving onto Jenkins; from his 6 bouts before meeting Ray Austin he had 3 wins and 3 losses against various levels of opposition ranging from unskilled/inexperienced to skilled/experienced; where he seemed to come up short when sharing the ring with the latter. Of that group, Jenkin’s more spectacular wins appears to have come from guys with high loss percentages. Perhaps notably he defeated Jason Gavern (13-3-2 going in) by decision over 6 rounds – the same guy Wilder has just fought as preparation for Stiverne. Jenkin’s losses in that 6-fight group mostly all come from contender level (or better) guys; some that were known to hit hard if you; stood in front of them, or got tired, or both. Unlike some of Ray Austin’s other above-mentioned opponents, there is not a great deal of title fights on Jenkin’s record. Of all that within the aforementioned group of opponents that Ray Austin faced before fighting Bermane Stiverne, that only leaves Wladimir Klitscho (who was 47-3-0 going in) to the Ray Austin IBO heavyweight title fight; that Klitscho himself won via a 2nd round KO of Austin. However, there probably is no need to dissect Klitscho’s record here. As most reading this breakdown know who he is, what he can do, what he has achieved, and where he sits in the realm of Austin’s, Arreola’s or anyone else’s record that has fought him. In closing this section and as an adjunct; before Ray Austin fought and lost to Wladimir Klitscho, Ray Austin also fought Sultan Ibragimov (19-0-0 going in) for an IBF heavyweight title eliminator; in what was Austin’s 7th fight before he faced Bermane Stiverne. Despite Sultan Ibragimov being down in round 10 and Ray Austin being down in round 4, the fight was declared a draw! So the question is, does Ray Austin’s above-mentioned accomplishments/achievements make him better opposition and preparation than, say, Wilder’s Malik Scott and/or Siarhei Liakhovich; enough to provide a theoretical advantage for Stiverne in this analysis? Personally, I think it’s difficult not to say “yes” to that question. B) Cris Arreola - out of his previous 6 fights (to the last Bermane Stiverne fight) - won 4, lost 1 (against Bermane Stiverne), and experienced 1 no contest. The 2 fights before (the last most recent bout with) Bermane Stiverne; Cris Arreola fought Bermane Stiverne for the 1st time (22-1-1 going in) and then after that came Seth Mitchell (26-1-1 going in) - these were the two fights just before Arreola stepped in with Bermane Stiverne (23-1-1 going in) for a second time in their most recent bout where Arreola was stopped in the 6th by Stiverne. Both those 2 previous fights were split for a loss and a win, in the following way; Against Bermane Stiverne the first time in a contest for the WBC silver heavyweight title, Cris Arreola dropped a 12 round decision - whilst both giving a good account of himself and also proving to be a reasonably difficult test for Stiverne. This was despite the fact that Arreola was down in the 3rd round and pretty busted up during/after the fight. Against Seth Mitchell, Cris Arreola - in a 12 round contest for the WBC international heavyweight title - blew Mitchell out in 1 round. Seth Mitchell, before facing Cris Arreola had tested himself with mediocre to slightly above average (for today’s heavyweight scene) fighters; with guys like, Chazz Witherspoon (30-2-0 going in), Jonathon Banks (28-1-1 and 29-1-1 going in) and Cris Arreloa (34-3-0 going in) being the better names on his resume. Before, the Seth Mitchell and Bermane Stiverne win/losses (for Arreloa) came; Eric Molina (18-1-0 going in), Raphael Butler (35-11-0 going in), Friday Ahunanya (24-7-3 going in) and Kendrick Releford (22-14-2 going in); whom - with the exception of Friday Ahunanya (whom constituted Cris’ above-mentioned no contest) - Cris Arreloa all beat by (as was the case with Seth Mitchell) stoppages in contests that were scheduled for either 10 or 12 rounds. Eric Molina was knocked out by Cris in 1 round, for the WBC USNBC heavyweight title. Butler went down in 3 – courtesy of Cris. The Ahunanya bout became a no contest, but from the scorecards at the time it appears Arreola was dominating. As for Kendrick Releford it appears that he was stopped in the 7th, by Arreola, of a 10 round non title contest. Of those four Cris Arreola wins the following information is associated; Before going in with Cris Arreola, Molina had won not just all 6 fights (as is the usual amount of previous fights these assessments span), but more than 10 in a row. Molina’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A TKO win in round 3 of a scheduled 12, for the vacant WBC USNBC heavyweight title, over Warren Browning (14-1-1 going in). 2) A TKO win, in round 6 of a scheduled 6, over Joseph Rabotte (9-15-1 going in). 3) A decision win, over a scheduled 6 round contest, over Rayford Johnson (6-5-0 going in). 4) A stoppage win (by way of retirement) in round 3, of a scheduled 6 round contest over Leo Bercier (8-14-1 going in). 5) A TKO win, in round 4 of a scheduled 10, for the vacant WBC Latino cruiserweight title, over Chris Thomas (17-11-12 going in). 6) A decision win over a scheduled 6 round contest over Andrew Greeley (14-30-2 going in). Before Molina, Arreola fought Raphael Butler. Butler, from his previous 6 fights before meeting Arreola, only won once; as the ledger reads 4 losses, 1 no contest, and 1 win. Butler’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A TKO loss, in round 6 of a scheduled 10, courtesy of Tye Fields (48-4-0 going in). 2) A TKO loss, in round 1 of a scheduled 8, courtesy of David Price (9-0-0 going in). 3) A decision loss, over a scheduled 10 round contest, courtesy of Neven Pajkic (13-0-0 going in). 4) A no contest decision within a scheduled 10 round contest over Joey Abell (25-4-0 going in). 5) A TKO win in round 2 of a scheduled 6 over Marcus Rhode (34-38-2 going in). 6) A decision loss, over a scheduled 8 round contest, courtesy of Malik Scott (31-0-0 going in). Before Butler, Arreola fought Friday Ahunanya. Since Friday Ahunanya constitutes Cris Arreola’s above-mentioned no contest I have not bothered to detail his 6 fight history before he went in with Arreola. Before Friday Ahunanya, Cris Arreola fought Kendrick Releford. Releford, from his previous 6 fights before meeting Arreola, won four times and lost twice. Releford’s previous 6 fights before he meet Arreola – in descending order - looked like this; 1) A decision loss, in a scheduled 8 round fight for the WBC FECARBOX heavyweight title, courtesy of Luis Ortiz (2-0-0 going in). 2) A decision win, in a scheduled 10 round fight, over Fred Kassi (15-1-0 going in). 3) A decision win, in a scheduled 6 round fight, over Billy Willis (11-17-1 going in). 4) A stoppage loss, by way of a 3rd round retirement, within a scheduled 10 round contest courtesy of Alexander Alekseev (17-1-0 going in). 5) A TKO win, in round 1 of a scheduled 8, over Patrick Smith (15-10-2 going in). 6) A TKO win, in round 2 of a scheduled 6, over Dennis McKinney (28-46-1 going in). To me, it’s quite obvious that Arreola – after losing to Tomasz Adamek (40-1-0 going in for what was the IBF and also the vacant NABO and WBO heavyweight titles) and Vitali Klitscho (37-2-0 going in for what was the WBC heavyweight title) – decided that he had to make a living out of boxing, and as such lowered his sights a little for a few years until the WBC heavyweight title became available to him again. Still, he is an opponent that – by way of who, and how, he fights – stands above most of Wilder’s opponents. Not in the least as Wilder himself appears to have no immediate opponents on his record that match; Vitali Klitscho, Tomasz Adamek, or Cris Arreloa. So, with all that completed the following summary can be released about the guys – besides Seth Mitchell and Bermane Stiverne (as they’re covered above) – that Cris Arreloa faced before he last and most recently faced Bermane Stiverne - where/when he was stopped in the 6th round of a 12 round contest for the vacant WBC heavyweight title; Eric Molina’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks good but appears somewhat padded with opponents that have concerning win/loss ratios. Raphael Butler’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks better than Molina’s in terms of the absence of opponents that have concerning win/loss ratios. However, the price Butler appears to have paid for this is that his abilities have become somewhat exposed in equal proportions to the stunt that his win ratio experienced. Kendrick Releford’s record (in the context of 6 fights before he met Cris Arreloa) looks to be only marginally better (if at all) than Raphael Butler’s record. Based on this please refer to my above comments pertaining to Raphael Butler’s record. Clearly both Deontay Wilder and Bermane Stiverne’s personal sets of their best 2 opponents – or at least those used here in this assessment - have themselves both faced good and questionable opponents. I deliberately detailed more of Bermane Stiverne’s opponent’s history to stave off anyone claiming I was subjective and in favour of Bermane Stiverne. However, despite that, one thing that stands out quite clearly from this exercise is that Bermane Stiverne’s opponents (and their opponents) are usually both winning and also contesting at an observably higher level of competition (than Wilder’s); which is evidenced by several facts - including the much larger amount of legitimate or near legitimate title fights Bermane Stiverne’s opponents (and their opponents) are involved in. For instance, in Bermane Stiverne’s favor, when discussing his 2 best opponents Cris Arreloa and Ray Austin; even their own/immediate or extended (by way of their opponent’s own opponents) involvement with domestic and/or international title fights easily exceeds the involvement of (Deontay Wilder’s best 2 opponents) Malik Scott and Siarhei Liakhovich, and also their opponents. A similar observation also happens when you assess the quality of opposition between Wilder and Stiverne, and their best 2 opponents. Put it all together with the fact that; a) Going into the Stiverne V Wilder fight – out of Bermane Stiverne’s recent four fights there is really only one soft touch (Willie Herring; Bermane Stiverne’s 3rd most recent fight, and the one after Ray Austin). Even then it’s questionable that Herring is a soft touch, but since I was not sure either way I played him for one to make it fair and favor Wilder more. Therefore, as far as this assessment is concerned Willie Herring is – out of Bermane Stiverne’s recent 4 fights – both his only soft touch and also Stiverne’s 3rd most recent fight; due to the fact that Stiverne has (most recently) fought Arreloa twice, then Willie Herring before the 2 Arreloa fights, and then he fought Ray Austin before the Willie Herring fight. b) Whereas out of Deontay Wilder’s recent four fights it’s hard to find one opponent that was/is not shot and/or not a soft touch, and it’s hard to understand whether that’s a suitable way to prepare for a legitimate heavyweight world title. Perhaps a case can be made for Malik Scott not being soft or shot when Wilder got to him and KO’d him in 1 round - but looking at his (and his opponent’s recent) record – particularly as he went into the Wilder fight - I am not sure about that. That then leaves us with Siarhei Liakhovich, Jason Gavern, and of course dear old Nicolai Firtha whom I have discussed in the context of his fight with Wilder an above post. I challenge anyone to make a case for any of those 3 not being spent and/or soft by the time Wilder got to them. When completing this exercise – within reason - I used the same format for Stiverne’s opponents as I previously did for Wilders, and I can tell you with the text (when describing fight outcomes) there was a lot of replacing “lose” or “lost” (with Wilder’s opponents) for “win” or “won” when it came to Stiverne’s opponents, and their opponents. Stranger things have happened in boxing, but based on the above if Wilder beats Stiverne this weekend it will be both remarkable and sensational - as well as going against a pretty tried and true tradition in boxing that holds experience against quality opposition – particularly that recently and successfully acquired – as an accurate matchmaking and performance yardstick. Over to you TSS crew.
You should change your name to "The Professor"!!


-Froggy :

You should change your name to "The Professor"!!
Hear, hear !


-dino da vinci :

Yes, admittedly SC is special.


-Radam G :

The fact that DW is fighting for a title at this point shows me he has powerful forces moving him and backing him. I can't bet against that fact. Remember that movie where the lights went off during the fight between Lewis and Klit and the crooks robbed the casino?
Hehehe! You got a point -- a BIG point! Holla!


-The Commish :

The only lights that'll be going out are Stiverne's! -Randy G.