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Thursday Mar 4, 2010

Floyd and Shane in DC hyping their May 1 fight.

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Two Nice Consolation Prizes

By Bernard Fernandez

      It is the age-old question, one that has puzzled mankind for what seems like forever.


      All right, so maybe the foremost such puzzler is “Why did the chicken cross the road?,” but right behind it is the little matter of whether ’tis  better to have a bird in the hand or two in the bush.


      Boxers, their managers and promoters have contemplated that perplexing choice ever since men first determined that they could earn a living by tugging on padded gloves and punching one another for fame and profit. You’d think by now that some sort of pattern would have emerged, but every year someone in the pugilistic arts is required to determine a course of action that could severely affect their bottom line, in addition to satisfying or thwarting the cravings of a public that is notoriously impatient when its will is circumvented.


      Not so very long ago, fight fans had a bird in the hand, and it was ostrich-sized and as majestic as a bald eagle in flight. Welterweight superstars Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather Jr., generally acknowledged to be the top two pound-for-pound boxers on the planet, had agreed to a megabout that almost certainly would have been the sport’s highest-grossing showdown. Each combatant would have earned in excess of $25 million, with some estimates topping out in the $40 million range. Cleveland Cavaliers icon LeBron James would have to play back-to-back, 82-game NBA seasons to earn a comparable bonanza.


      With such a ridiculous amount money on the line, and with a rare opportunity to steer boxing back into the mainstream, it seemed impossible that the powers-that-be would do anything to unravel what initially appeared to be a done deal. But boxing being what it is, the opposing sides found a sticking point upon which they could agree to disagree, transforming the Fight of the Century into still another war or words, with each camp claiming to hold the moral high ground.


      In short order, the fight that would have had the whole world buzzing with anticipation had split into a couple of still-attractive but lesser events, with the headline attractions digging in for a possible court fight instead of the one we all wanted to see in the ring.


      When in doubt, call in the lawyers.


      “It causes chaos and it’s wrong for one fighter to try to impose his own rules and regulations on the sport and on another fighter,” Top Rank founder and CEO Bob Arum, who has paired Filipino national hero Pacquiao (50-3-2, 38 KOs), the WBO 147-pound champion, with Ghana’s Joshua Clottey (35-3, 20 KOs) on March 13 in Cowboys Stadium, said of Mayweather’s demands that “Pac-Man” consent to random, Olympic-style blood-testing as a prerequisite for their matchup to be made. “It’s as silly as, say, Alex Rodriguez getting struck out four times by a Boston Red Sox pitcher and saying he’s not going to face him again until the pitcher takes a blood test.


      “We have commissions to (make rules). You can make any request you want of a commission and if the commission feels there’s any validity to what’s being petitioned, it will then dictates what it feels is best. The proper procedure for Mayweather, if he wanted extra testing, was to go before the Nevada commission and request it. He didn’t do that.


      “For Mayweather to try to bully another fighter into additional testing simply because he demanded it is preposterous. The Nevada commission has in place random testing, and that’s urinalysis. Nobody (with Team Pacquiao) is against random testing. But urinalysis is not invasive; blood-testing is.


      “You don’t have to be a genius to figure out what (Mayweather) is trying to do. It’s an attempt to get into Manny’s head, to get him completely discombobulated so he would be easy pickings for Mayweather. But Manny didn’t put up with the bullying, so Mayweather is getting his wish to not have to fight him. Mayweather vs. Manny is a no-contest. Manny would wipe up the ring with Floyd Mayweather.”


      Arum’s indignant protestations represent one side of the dispute, and they are reasonably compelling when viewed a certain way. If Pacquiao-Mayweather was to take place in Nevada, as was originally scheduled, the NSAC’s current rules and regulations should be the standard, right?


      But Mayweather and Golden Boy Promotions, which is working in concert with Mayweather Promotions to stage the May 1 matchup of WBA welterweight champion “Sugar” Shane Mosley (46-5, 39 KOs) and Mayweather (40-0, 25 KOs) at Las Vegas’ MGM Grand, take the position that rules fraught with loopholes through which a drug cheat could wiggle is as bad as no rules at all, and that “Money” is a crusading knight whose noble quest for a more even playing field should be enacted forthwith.


      “Floyd feels very strongly about bringing Olympic-type testing to boxing,” said Richard Schaefer, Golden Boy CEO. “I don’t think Floyd’s position on this is to be belittled or criticized. To the contrary, I think it is something to be applauded.”


      Mayweather, at a Tuesday press conference at the Nokia Theater in New York to hype his scrap with Mosley, alternated between the roles of boxing’s would-be cleanup man and character assassin.


      “I want to show the world that my sport is clean,” Mayweather said with the earnestness of Jimmy Stewart’s Mr. Smith going to Washington. “I think we should take a stand in all sports to show that. We have to separate the average from the good from the great.”


      But although Mayweather said “I never said Pacquiao was on nothing,” he soon turned from the suggestion of impropriety to something that sounded more like outright accusations that Pacquiao’s rapid rise has been something less than all-natural.


      “I never seen a fighter go from ordinary once he reached, like, 25 to extraordinary,” Mayweather said in taking another verbal jab at Pacquiao. “It just don’t work like that. I don’t like to throw no nails, but they all cheaters.”


      Among the rules-benders and rules-breakers, Mayweather continued, is Mosley, who admitted to a grand jury that he had once taken performance-enhancing drugs on the suggestion of an employee, but that he did not know the substances were controlled and illegal.


      “Mayweather just blurts things out he really doesn’t know about,” Mosley said, seemingly bemused by his upcoming opponent’s latest tirade. “That can be dangerous. People have filed lawsuits over that kind of stuff.”


      Arum and Pacquiao, in fact, already have taken legal action against Mayweather, his father Floyd Sr., adviser Leonard Ellerbee, Schaefer and Golden Boy front man Oscar De La Hoya for defamation of Pacquiao’s character. Pacquiao has never failed a drug test, although those he has taken and passed are not as stringent as those preferred by Mayweather and insisted upon by the International Olympic Committee.


      When asked if he still thought his fighter would someday mix it up with Mayweather, Freddie Roach, Pacquiao’s trainer, said, “Manny really wants to fight Floyd in the future, and he will knock him out.” Arum, who also was participating in the conference court, immediately chimed in that “We’ll knock him out in the court, too.”


      Somewhat obfuscated amid the intrigue is the fact that the two consolation-prize bouts that arose from the ashes of Pacquiao-Mayweater are, upon closer inspection, fairly attractive as stand-alone events.


      Pacquaio is the crossover star and reason Cowboys Stadium, scaled to a capacity of nearly 42,000, should sell out before the opening bell. Clottey is simply the other guy, the opponent, and someone few believe has much chance of pulling off the upset, but insiders know that he is tough, resilient and the naturally larger man. No, Pacquiao-Clottey isn’t the “Super Bowl of boxing,” as Roach boldly stated, but it ain’t chopped liver, either.


      “People were looking forward to a Pacquiao-Mayweather fight, that’s clear,” Arum conceded. “But Manny Pacquiao has a huge, huge fan base now. He’s crossed over. Every sports fan knows Manny Pacquiao.


      “You cannot say there’s two household names fighting on March 13. That would be ridiculous. But there’s excitement in Dallas. It should be a great show.”


      Also lending substance to Pacquiao-Clottey is the fact that Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones, who offered a record $25 million site fee for Cowboys Stadium to host Pacquiao-Mayweather (which Schaefer rejected out of hand), has made it clear that he wants his new, $1.2 billion stadium to be the Southwest’s answer to Madison Square Garden, a Mecca for boxing with a Tex-Mex flavor. If the pay-per-view buy rate is anywhere near as impressive as what figures to be a sellout crowd at the live venue, Jones could emerge as a latter-day Donald J. Trump, reminiscent of a time when The Donald was pouring millions into his Atlantic City fight operation, with Pacquiao the sort of draw that Mike Tyson once was on the boardwalk.


      Schaefer, De La Hoya, Ellerbee and those involved in putting on Mayweather-Mosley figure their fight will do better than Pacquiao-Clottey, both aesthetically and financially, because it figures to be much more competitive. In The Ring magazine’s end-of-2009 issue, a panel of experts had Mayweather and Mosley at Nos. 2 and 3 in the pound-for-pound ratings, behind Pacquiao.


      “I have no doubt that our fight is going to do substantially better (than Pacquiao-Clottey),” said Schaefer, who boldly predicted a record 3 million PPV buys for Mayweather-Mosley.


      So the battle lines are drawn. Pacquiao-Clottey and Mayweather-Mosley are distinctly different, separate and perhaps unequal tests of obstinant men’s wills as well as of the fighters’ skills. By May 2, someone might have emerged as the possible claimant of the all-in pot in the fight game’s version of the World Series of Poker.


      It’s a major gamble for all involved. What happens if Clottey shocks Pacquiao? Or if Mosley gets past Mayweather in a fight that, on paper at least, figures to be more closely contested than the one that takes place 19 days earlier in Arlington, Texas? Does everyone’s dream of Pacquiao-Mayweather go by the boards in the same manner of other alluring bouts that never came off, like Riddick Bowe-Lennox Lewis and Tyson-George Foreman?


      The guy who has the best chance of holding a winning lottery ticket when all is said and done is Mosley, who has not fought since, as an underdog, he dominated and stopped Antonio Margarito in nine rounds on Jan. 24, 2008. Mosley had been preparing for a unification fight with WBC titlist Andre Berto when Mayweather-Pacquiao fell through, again thrusting him into the conversation regarding boxing’s No. 1 performer.


      “It’s been a long time since I had a chance to show the world that I’m the best fighter,” said the 38-year-old Mosley. “But then Mayweather’s fight with Pacquiao fell out and mine with Berto fell out (because Berto, who is of Haitian descent, was too emotionally spent to fight after the earthquake that devastated that country). God works in mysterious ways.


      “Really, this is the best fight that can be made, unless either one of us is fighting Pacquiao. We three are the best, and we have to figure out which one of us is the very best. But that will be revealed in due time. God has a plan.”


      Mosley, who has agreed to the Olympic-style blood-testing demanded by Mayweather, clearly is hoping that he can ride the momentum of a victory over his supremely confident and somewhat arrogant foe into a clear-the-decks throwdown with Pac-Man.


      But if the favorites clear their respective hurdles, what then? Can Pacquiao and Mayweather find enough common ground to resurrect the big fight that came tumbling down like a house of cards?


      Schaefer isn’t so sure. “I feel both sides are entrenched,” he said. “Floyd feels very strongly about bringing Olympic-style drug-testing to boxing. He’s at the forefront of that. There’s a lot of pressure on sports in the United States to rise to that standard.”


      You have to wonder, though, if Pacquiao and Mayweather will wake up one morning, after they’re retired, having never faced each other, and wonder how the hell they could have botched the multimillion-dollar equivalent of a two-inch putt or an uncontested layup. Standing on principle is one thing, but collecting principal on a $40 million payday is quite another.


      Other fighters regrettably have been down this what-if road before. In Four Kings,  author George Kimball notes that Sugar Ray Leonard and Thomas Hearns were nearly paired early in their professional careers, before Hearns had established himself as a legitimate threat to 1976 Olympic hero Leonard. Their first meeting years later was elevated to legendary status because the correct decision was made for them to develop into something much more than interesting prospects.


      But every two-birds-in-a-bush risk taken and rewarded is countered by the failure of someone to strike when the iron is hot. Ivan Robinson’s manager, Eddie Woods, once turned down a fight with De La Hoya because he determined his man “wasn’t ready for it just yet,” a decision that cost Robinson a handsome payday and needed exposure. In boxing, when the train leaves the station, there’s a good chance it’s never coming back. Just ask Mexican-American heavyweight Alex Garcia, whose management passed on a $1 million shot at second-time-around champ George Foreman in the mistaken belief that, by waiting, $5 million would be offered for Garcia to tangle with Big George later on. Garcia promptly went out and lost to journeyman Mike Dixon, a bout for which he was paid $15,000.

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G. Nance:  Fraud simply wants no part of Manny - never did. Now that he's found an issue he knows Manny wont give in to Fraud will continuously call out Manny to take the blood tests - which Manny wont and Fraud is safe knowing he doesn't have to tangle with Manny. What would be great is if Manny finally does concede to Fraud's demands to take the blood tests to make the fight, then see how Fraud figures out another way to get out of the fight. As we all know by now, Fraud's next excuse will be something like a 60-40 split of the pot since he sold more pay per view buys, he fought the bigger name opponent blah, blah, blah... Watch and see... Fraud wants no part of Manny - ever. Watch.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 03:35:25 PM
RIVERSIDE:  I'm pulling for mosley, we grew up 1 mile apart, can't go against him, pulling for the upset, I think mosley is got several good fights left, Mayweather is in a no win situation, By his choices he has put himself in that situation, if he wins he was suppose to win, if he looses, he will never hear that end of that
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 04:49:00 PM
msp69:  Floyd and Shane are building up the hype and excitement for this fight by creating major drama involving a near-brawl and a full verbal assault back and forth. Enjoy it while you can, folks because there won’t be that much enjoyment when the fight starts. My advice: Don’t throw away your $60 bucks because this fight will be boring. Has anybody ever seen Floyd involved in an exciting fight? Similar to his previous fights, Floyd will run, and in this fight, Mosley will ran out of gas chasing him. I respect Shane, but he is OLD (he is almost 39 years old), and contrary to what other people says, age matters. That and the fact that Shane has not fought for more than a year.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:03:40 PM
Porkupine:  Floyd should pick up a Chris Rock CD or two . Then he'd learn the difference between being rich and being wealthy if he's gonna pop off about money. Floyd is rich. The man who signs his check is wealthy and will still be wealthy long after Floyd's career is over.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:04:38 PM
SALT lover:  It's unclear why Pacquiao didn't simply accept the random blood tests. The stupid arguments of the "Manny-will-not-let-Floyd-dictate" not even Pacquiao's little girl believes that bull$^!t. The Nevada's urine testing have been cheated before and they haven't done anythin' to improve it, then what the hell will you do? Sit with your arms cross and hope that they are valid tests that are sayin' the Truth when at one time it didn't? Don't be stupid. Mosley easily cheated those incompetent tests, so it's obvious they're easily cheated, especially since you know when they are going to test you. Keith Kizer talked a lot of blah, blah, blah defendin' the Commission, but he never mentioned why, how, or even said the word "Mosley", when he also tested clean when he was indeed cheatin', didn't he? Frickin' slipped his damn mind. Sayin' blood tests are invasive and urines are not is another way of sayin' that blood tests go deeper and are more strict, which is perfect. Regardless of whether he started now or years ago, Floyd Mayweather Jr (40-0)'s position in such testin' is VALID and it's JUSTIFIED. Why? Because (AGAIN): Those urine tests have been CHEATED BEFORE!!!! That's the simple and obvious reason why. Those are plain facts. Screw what Pacquiao fans say; those facts are indeniable and they are present right in front of their noses. If the authorities don't protect you, and then buy a weapon and defend yourself. Maybe that's why Malcolm X and Dr. King came to Floyd's mind recently since, in the nature of the situation, they had pretty much the same problem. I really don't know if Pacquiao is usin' steroids or not. If he does, then the whole thing becomes clear why he refused and all the things he's done. If he's clean, then he should've taken the test and shut Mayweather clan's mouth off outside the ring, while tryin' to KO Floyd inside; inside the ring he was gonna fail miserably, but outside the ring he was gonna win.........................I agree there is a PPV battle of Pacquiao-Clottey vs Mayweather-Mosley. Pacquiao vs somebody, and Floyd vs the #1 Welterweight in the World. If Pacquiao does better PPV, then he's the biggest draw. If not then he simply isn't.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:05:47 PM
SALT lover:  And finally, I have to give mad props to Shane Mosley. He and Floyd are the only top boxers that have been on top of the sport, dominatin' since the 90's, and Mosley is still in the top spot, fightin' World class fighters, and still being a strong contender of the P4P #1 spot he was briefly before facin' Vernon Forrest. Now he has in front of him the man that he's never wanted to whoop badly from the rest of all the other fighters he's faced in his life; even more than Vargas. But unlike Vargas, is the most skilled, intelligent, and fluid. Still, I believe, of all the fighters in the sport of boxin' today, Shane Mosley holds the biggest threat to Floyd's unbeaten' streak and Mosley knows that. Like the writer very wells says, Mosley's got the most to win. Like RIVERSIDE says, Mosley's got nothin' to lose. If he loses, now all of a sudden he's old. If he wins, then he'll get the love and the support by beatin' the #1 hatest boxer of the decade, and #2 P4P spot. In Floyd's case a W will make Mosley suddenly old (Even when before signin' the contract it was "Floyd is scared of Mosley"), and if he loses then that will be youtube's most watched video in the year around. Whatever the case, we all have a great fight comin' May 1st, 2010. The fight is titled 'Who Are You Picking?'. I should've put it 'Unfinished Business', or 'Settling The Score', between these two P4P fighters since the 90's. This fight will have me pretty much worried in my crib, since Mosley's the one who can beat Floyd. Let's see what happens, and may the best man win. Checkezzzzz!!!
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:11:27 PM
The Warden:  I am not a believer in putting fights off to let them stew. It's a risky strategy that almost always backfires. More often than not, a guy is going to lose to a journeyman or underestimated one-hit wonder before the so-called megafight happens. Tommy Morrison lost to Michael Bentt. Judah to Baldomir. Mercer to Ferguson (a desperate Mercer was alleged to have begged "The Bogeyman" to take a dive in clinches). Eric Morales to Zahir Raheem. There are countless examples. Even a red-hot MAB lost to a then unknown Manny Pacquiao. If a fight is big, such as Lopez - Gamboa, make it happen! Don't plan for 2 or 3 years down the road. In the case of Lopez - Gamboa, they're featherweights that appeal to boxing's hard core base. It's a long shot to bank on these two guys becoming mainstream faces to American soccer moms. Won't happen. As for Richard Schaefer and GBP, is Olympic-style testing being employed across the board and without exception with regard to their stable of fighters? How about for the putrid and unnecessary Jones-Hopkins rematch? Nope. Haven't heard a peep. So much for being noble crusaders. I don't have a dog in the Pacquiao-Mayweather Cold War, but clearly it's a heaven and hell world for both camps and their fans. If you're a fan of one, you're not a fan of the other, and there's no gray area at all. Without exception, fans on both sides are almost Donald Rumsfeld-esque.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:16:29 PM
Robert Curtis:  I would say that both of these fights are better than consolation prizes. We know Clottey and Mosley will show up to fight. Also, I am so very happy that Shane is getting this much deserved chance to prove himself as a pound-for-pound great. Manny vs. Money might just have been a slick snoozefest. Maybe that just sounds completely cynical? But I'm just so sick of PBFs shenanigans outside the ring and all his excuses for not getting inside the ring with credible opponents. Unless Manny Pacquiao was able to completely outclass and steamroll Floyd Mayweather Jr., I can't see Floyd giving us a decent fight or playing it any other way but safe.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 05:23:55 PM
Lyd:  Mayweather has played the wrong tune for too long. Mosley will be given a gift. This will not be a classic, but a very boring fight. Mosley will not be able to catch Mayweather or make him fight. A younger Mosley could not catch Cotto and took a long time to catch Mayorga. This fight will be clearly boringly won by Mayweather but will be called a win or draw for Mosley to keep his title. He will then fight Pacquiao and get knocked out for the first time.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 06:36:58 PM
brownsugar:  another blatant finger pointing hate piece,.. designed to make Floyd seem like the culprit in the failed negotiations...of what could have been the biggest fight since Leonard vs Hearns,.. or Holyfield Tyson,. but the fault equally belongs to both fighters...and thier managment... Pac's team said the tattoo covered Pacman was scared of needles,.. then they said the "spiritual" fighter had some kind of Pagan culturally derived fear of giving blood (" it'll steal your soul,.or your power or something like that),.. before they finally decided apon,.. "who does Mayweather think he is to dictate to the great Pac?",.. so think what you want to,.. but it's looking fishier every day... especially when you drop $40 mill to take a $6million dollar fight,.. it has nothing to do with culture,..I've been to the Phillipines many times,.. and the corruption graft and greed there is every much apart of their culture as it is ours even more so in the government and police department...I know because I had to pay off the police just to leave the country after a false charge was placed against me,.. cost me all of $65 ,.. and a hundred dollars can get a man murdered over there,... believe me when I say that Money speaks all languages quite well....it makes me laugh when people say that Pac is just an Asian country boy and doesn't yet understand what money is..(in a country where you can get your throat slit for a $50 american dollar bill if your not careful) You can Blame Both Manny and Mayweather for this Fiasco,... this is probably the 10th story non-constructive story about the failed fight this week,... it's time to get over it and move on....
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 06:59:44 PM
Marco Polo:  Saw the youtube about FMJ and SSM Presscon.. Damn, how old is FMJ stil doin those kind of stuff. Talk here, Talk there, Insult here, Insult thre. WTF..It's not hyping if you call it that way, its a girl thing. REAL MEN DONT LOL! ! !
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 07:02:51 PM
The Warden:  It is time to move on from this topic. The fight failed and they've moved on. Period. We're single-digit days away from Pacquiao-Clottey and will have a result in the book. My guess is that BOTH Pacquiao and Mayweather will not win. One or both will lose and this will all be academic.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 07:15:50 PM
zapper69:  @SALT lover: The "Manny-will-not-let-Floyd-dictate" arguments ain't stupid bro...unlike Floyd, Manny has enough savings and assets to make even his great grandchildrens live in luxury. It's simply called "PRIDE"...and for us Filipinos, it is one of the most important thing we valued most.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 08:07:51 PM
Jocsy & Lyd @Mr. Brownsugar:  You saw corruption done on an American, not a Filipino. You just don't understand the psyche or culture of a Filipino. A Filipino in the very back of a bus or jeeney can have the many riders pass his money to the driver. An American GI Joe cannot. The very first Filipino will steal his money. You just have experience the Philippines in the tourist trap and probably a GI Joe zone and setting. Everything is legit for a native in all countries, including the United States, but the foreigner is always treated differently. Manny Pacquiao comes from the province. He is not a type of Filipino who would ripped you off like at Olongapo CIty or Angeles City during the days of the unwelcomed American GI Joes. You have never put your eyes on the real Philippines. Just those who learned the American ways around those military bases and tourist areas.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 08:38:56 PM
Real Talk is being 100% honest:  I just don't see what Freddie Roach is saying. I got respect for Roach as a person an as a trainer, but I just don't see him(Pac) KO'ing Floyd. I also don't think Freddie is as confident as he's leaking it. I see the mind game chest match of sowing seeds of doubt. It's like they know what's coming, Floyd will obliterate Shane, masterfully with squared jungle battlefeild tact!!! Picture my mans in a hard hat with stars on it like Patton!!! or McAuthur!!! Ring General. Floyd is in fight mode already!!! The zone!!! RedZone.....exactly where he suppose to be. Shane is going to get Floyd in rare form. This is what I've been waiting to see, I'm reclining in my chair typing this. See the thing is...what a lot of folks aint pick upon is Floyd aint have to fight hard cuz the dues in front of'em...it wasn't required. They didn't push'em enough...Shane will....an unleash the floodgates. It's been real Shane. This doesn't diminish what you've done for the fightgame one bit. I tip my hat to you, but on fightnight, when you duck between them ropes and that bell sounds. You gon find out what only those who walked through that door know. You in the ring with a creature ........with skills that something else......given to him by the creator to make a beautiful....violent......masterpeice!!! PURE SHARPNESS and FEROCITY!!! Is this man a Alien LOL.......WHO KNOWS LOL Dueces
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 09:26:07 PM
ali @ Bernard:  Manny didn’t put up with the bullying, so Mayweather is getting his wish to not have to fight him. Mayweather vs. Manny is a no-contest. Manny would wipe up the ring with Floyd Mayweather.” You hear this sh*it Bernard don't know what the hell he is talking about u can keep on hating and Floyed will keep on wining. If he is so scared to fight the best guys out there then why is he fighting Mosley a guy who I think will give him more problems then Pac. I mean he could have fought somebody on a Clottey level like Cintron but no he didn't give the Floyed credit for taking on the next best guy.... DAMN HOMIE STOP BEING SUCH A MOTHERF*CKING HATER
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 09:36:42 PM
donputo69:  Come on... Everybody knows Scareweather is ducking Mosley...if he really want to fight Mosley before, In Floyd's recent fight with Marquez, Mosley is challenging scareweather but scareweather keep sayingto talk to Mark Haymon...and now that his fight with Pacquaio didnt materialize because of his demanding too much blood withdrawn, he is force to fight Mosley now...he have no choice or else people will call him the best ducker ever in history of boxing Pacman agreed to 3 times blood test and random urine test....Damn the truth hurts right scareweather nutthuggers?...lol...Cant wait for mosley to knock this fraud out on may 1st...holla back!!!
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 09:36:43 PM
ali @ donput 69:  No he could have fought somebody on a B-level and still made alot of money like Manny is Mar 13. Cintron lost to Margocheato and so did Clottey they both have two loses and Cinton has look good lately. Now if he would have took that fight yall would have jumped down his thoat but all he would have been doing is fighting the same level fighter as Pac. Double Standard as normal when it comes to Mayweather so he wasn't force into nothing.... TRUST THAT
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 09:45:12 PM
Yes Yo!:  Shane would beat the crap out of Floyd. After that, we don't have to deal with Floyd ever again. After that, it's gonna be Manny vs. Shane that boxing fans would be pining for. What is Floyd without that "0" in his record? That's his greatest asset and the well-spring of his baragadoccio. And if Shane manages to embarrass Floyd and KO him, then it's the end of the road for Floyd! He'll be exposed as just a good fighter, not a great one, who faltered when he faced stiff competition.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 10:03:24 PM
Ezz@mr. ali:  Mayweather said that he doesn't fight for belts, because they collect dust and that he is about getting the pay checks. Interesting! Mayweather should have fought the young Goliath Paul Williams. That would have been much more money. I doubt that many come to see him fight a cherry-picked, way passed his prime Methueselah Shane Mosley. Mayweather is very cagey to pick the weakest opponent.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 10:08:11 PM
Fe'Roz :  I like losses! You heard that right. I like losses. Losses mean you've tried. Yes, and sometimes even failed. But Muhammed Ali, SRL, Duran; every true all time great (and personal favorite) throughout history failed at one time. They failed because they dared to be great. They faced the greatest challenges. Sure, they lost battles but, hell, they won the most of the wars. Without losses there would never be such thing as a rematch. Or a Trilogy. Greatness has never been determined only by the battles won. It is a quality measured by how one rises from defeat as well. How one copes with reversals of fortune.This is true in any field.... throughout history. Shane Mosely comes to this fight as a great warrior. He has the scars...and the losses ...to show for it. Look at him against prime Oscar de la Hoya. That young man come to fight, win or lose. And God bless him, he still does. Sure, Clottey has losses. So does Manny. They are still elite fighters; one arguably the greatest alive. Floyd will be meeting a man who, by his losses losses alone, should disqualify him from the self-proclaimed Money sweepstakes. Thankfully, Shane represents good if not great money.... and more importantly, the best money available besides fighting Pacquiao. So let's get it on and may the better man win. The other will still have my respect. pc
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 10:22:15 PM
the Roast@ MisterLee:  Hey Caveman! Did you go? What did you think?
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 10:26:17 PM
Real Talk @ donputo69 :  How he ducking Mosley when he's about to rumble Mosley?!?! You lost me cuz. Floyd iz gon put the beaters on Mosley....too sharp....and got a chin.....and smart. You got to come better my dude. Is this the real donputo69??? Hmmmm...... Dueces
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 10:26:33 PM
#1 PacFan "Pac by TKO in 8":  This site is really getting some ideas from my recent post. I totally agree with you when you say that Floyd says one thing and totally different to another. Floyd Jr. is so inconsistent when making comments about Pacquiao that it seems obvious he don't know what he's talking about. I seriously believe that Floyd Jr. is scared to death to fight Manny. Who makes comments like that saying a man can't be that good. Uses PED's as an escape goat for a way out of a fight. Didn't he used to say he would whoop MP with or without steriods? THAT WAS FOR YOU FLOYD FANS. I thought he was so damn eager to fight him. I guess the Cotto fight really gave him nightmares. FOR A MAN TO SAY THAT HE IS AS GOOD AS HE PUTS HIMSELF OUT TO BE IS REALLY SHOWING SOME FEAR TO THE FEARLESS. Floyd is as blind as his insecure fan base.
Thursday Mar 4, 2010 11:32:32 PM
ICE PICK SLIM 17:  I know what U R alluding to Mr Fernandez. Let's "will" that it doesn't happen. The sport of the Sweet Science needs for both, Money & Pac Man, to win their individual bouts & eventually meet. The attention & economics generated by such a match-up will truly benefit not only the the pugilist in the ring & their formidable camps, as well as the boxing public @ large, but also the casual sporting fans who will B treated to the best display of 'skill & will' the Sweet Science currently has to offer.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:24:29 AM
#1 PacFan "Pac by TKO in 8":  They say PED's helped him climb the weights in dominant passion. PED's don't help you become more of an accurate puncher who has been averaging 40+ percent of landed punches a fight. PED's don't help you develop a great foot lateral movement. PED's don't help you make defense into offense. PED's don't help your defense. PED's don't help you become a patient fighter. PED's don't help you learn to set up your punches. PED's don't help you dodge a punch after throwing one or two. PED's don't help you take a punch(he has always had great whiskers). PED's don't help you learn to use great ring generalship. MANNY HAS BECOME OF A COMPLETE FIGHTER, MANY JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT. PED's do help you with POWER(he shows descent power just places them on the button). PED's do help with your stamina(he trains like no other in our time which is your explaination). I went on my MP collections and I don't know how a boxing fan who has witnessed him fight from say Morales 1 thru David Diaz and see no difference. The only similarities I see from Manny from the old the to the new is that he is still hungry, willingness to learn, and his phenomonal training habits. Let's not forget his humble personality.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:27:05 AM
Isaiah:  Look at that picture you all! Floyd is like the smart mouth punk who's posing, acting tough, and putting on a show with putting a hand on Mosley and Shane is just like, "Son I'm about to beat the brakes off of you." If you notice, Floyd is just looking down because you know that's how those "tough guys" like him do while Shane is just staring him down like the Terminator going in for the kill. In fact, Mosley reminds me a lot of the actor Terrance Howard, ladies man, kind of looks like him and a bad dude. Chicken Floyd is all an act. He really doesn't want any. It's all an act that will be exposed real soon. Cowards stay undefeated because chickens run. Chicken s##t, Xylocaine abusing, Scooby Doo imitating, (Roh No! Racquiao! Rosley!), marathon running, no proof PED accusing, no honor having, decieving stupid fans, woman abusing, steet posing, all our chickens are Xylocaine injected and randomly Olympic style blood tested, son of a drugged out loser Mayweather! Sugar Shane needs to do us all a favor and send this fool back into retirement for good! More bull feces? No thanks. I've had enough.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:33:37 AM
Isaiah@donputo69:  Only thing I want to say... We ALL saw Floyd's face when Mosley entered the ring after the Marquez fight. Can we say, cleanup on aisle 12?!
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:37:30 AM
Fe'Roz :  I still have Floyd winning a decision regardless. The only real question is which Shane Mosely shows up. The one (with four losses) who fought closely with a 30-0 Miguel Cotto. Or the one (with five losses) who fought closely to the end with the 28-6 Ricardo Mayorga. My guess is the former ... but who the hell knows. We shall see.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:51:02 AM
Isaiah:  I once again predict a toenail injury on little girly man Floyd in late April. Look at sissy boy looking down! That tells you all you need to know right there! Mr, "I'll fight Ricky Hatton again in the U.K. right now! Legacy don't pay the bills!" I wonder which fighting style Floyd will use, original or extra crispy? Which name did he use in signing the contract? Was it Trickweather, bi##hweather, scareweather, cowardweather, chickenfeather, strayweather, duckfeather, sissy boy, pretty girl, Mayrunner, money is Mayweather's god, Honey instead of money, or did he just use his normal name which is Alice? I hear Shane Mosley gave him an exerpt of a Dr. Suess book imitation he was writing. Here goes part of it. "I'll beat your face into a bloody paste. I'll fight you on a boat. I'll fight you in a moat. I'll outbox you in a car. I'll outbox you from far. I'll bust you up from inside. I'll bust you up until you have no more pride. I'll beat you senseless in the ring. I'll smack you around with some bling. You'll be falling to the ground crying and my fists will still be flying. I do not like green eggs and ham, but I'll beat you worse then Uncle Sam. Poectic justice is nice and on your face, you better put some ice. Pacquiao/Mosley is next and a million blood tests I will not need to use like you to try and molest." Thank you and good night.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 02:35:23 AM
"Honey" Sissyboy Fraud Mayrunner:  Why yes. I do agree. I am a fraud, fake, phony, sissy, wimpy, chicken, coward, no good, lying, scared to death of Manny Pacquiao, insanely greedy, woman abusing, Xylocaine using, think I'm the Comminsioner of boxing, public gouging, cheating, lying, piece of crap and I just want to say I think all my fans are pieces of crap too. Oooh! Pacquiao's so awesome, so fast, so strong and better with the ladies then me. I'm so jealous I could throw my purse at him!
Friday Mar 5, 2010 05:33:49 AM
MisterLee @ the Roast:  hey roast! Read my comments on the "Press Conference" article a few days a ago. It was fun, but i had to leave early fo' sho! @ ali, hbo rejected malignaggi, cintron, and campbell, so floyd was FORCED to fight someone good. Not by choice, holler! then hemakes it seem like he meant it all along. there's an immediate rematch clause iffloyd wants to get knocked out twice! holler!
Friday Mar 5, 2010 08:52:38 AM
Anony:  ON THE PICTURE AT THE TOP WE HAVE ----------- "UGLY BOY FLOYD" VS. "SONY" - THE GUY OF MIAMI VICE ORIGINAL SERIES.... lol.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 09:37:20 AM
@ zapper69:  god luck with your pride bro..pride aint gonna prove you did not take roids..
Friday Mar 5, 2010 11:14:41 AM
Eastar:  Who does Retard Roach think he is, trying to dictate how much a fighter pays for coming in over the weight limit? Who does Bum Arum think he is, demanding his own fighter Coocho to drain himself to defend his own title??? Everybody knows Pacroid is afraid of Mayweather. He is running scared and will not face Mayweather anytime soon maybe he will wait till Floyd is old but until then he will fight Margarito, Yuri Foreman, and whoever else works for Bum Arum under Top Rank. Peace out.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 12:55:06 PM
mortcola@eastar:  Man, you love obedience, don't you? Bet you can't wait to fly so those nice officers with the rubber gloves can PROVE you're not carrying weapons. You know, there are people you can pay to do that in the comfort of your home - you don't have to go to the airport. But, for me, Pac and all the rest of the champs out there are fine abiding by the standards of the commission, and not bending over and saying "please sir! May I have another" just because some little diva named Floyd tells them to. Now don't forget to lube!
Friday Mar 5, 2010 01:35:08 PM
mortcola@eastar, SALT, and u no hu:  That was meant for all you guilty-till-proven-innocent doofuses.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 01:36:50 PM
SALT lover@mortcola:  Nah man, you're too smart for that. Come up with a better "innocent -till-proven-guilty" argument. It's just like waitin' to be caught soon or later. And besides I already wrote it: NSAC has been cheated before. That by itself (And by LOGIC) tells you about the standards of that Commission. And that "little diva" knows what's goin' on in the sport more than all of us together.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 03:36:18 PM
The Saint:  If the U.S. had a "guilty until proven innocent" policy, 99% of Mayweather's fanbase would be locked up in prison dropping soap. LOL
Friday Mar 5, 2010 03:42:29 PM
RIVERSIDE:  what pacman has done in moving up in weight and dominating that way he has done is beyond this world, by him knocking out full pledge welterweight like cotto is unrealistic and if he ko's iron chin clottey. big strong welterweight, questions will be asked, innocent until proven guilty, when someone turns into superhuman, the burden is on him, unfair but realistic, guilty until proven innocent, I agree with SALT, SAINT liitle bit too rough
Friday Mar 5, 2010 04:08:32 PM
The Saint:  @Riverside: Pacquiao did not knock Cotto out. Cotto could've lasted the full twelve rounds. The stoppage was justifiable, but Cotto was nowhere close to being separated from his senses. There's nothing "superhuman" about what Pacquiao did. He beat up Cotto and the punishment accumulated. Hatton, well, if Floyd Mayweather could knock Hatton out, my grandmother could knock Hatton out, most definitely Pacquiao. Plus, it was one of those once in a lifetime shots ala Michael Nunn vs Sumbu Kalambay. De La Hoya took several flush shots from Pacquiao but never went down. It took Pacquiao 9 rounds or so to finally drop David Diaz, a lightweight, and landed clean shot after clean shot for the entire fight. It's the same as what Pacquiao has always done. With the exception of the rubbermatch against a shot Erik Morales and the 2nd round KO of Hatton, Pacquiao stops his opponents through the accumulation of punches and not "superhuman" punches. Even De La Hoya claimed that Pacquiao did not hit hard. What now, huh?
Friday Mar 5, 2010 05:22:46 PM
The Saint:  @Riverside: The biggest factors in Pacquiao's success, besides the fact that he works harder than any fighter today, are first, he no longer has to drain himself to make 130. Floyd Mayweather knows better than anyone that even having to lose two extra pounds could have serious consequences on your overall performance. Imagine having to lose close to 10 extra pounds than what Pacquiao was comfortable with two to three years ago. The second reason is that the welters today simply aren't as good as the smaller fighters that Pacquiao had to shrink himself down to size in order to fight. Cotto, De La Hoya and Hatton do not have the quickness, resiliency, toughness, flexibility as Marquez, Morales and Barrera. Sure, they're bigger and stronger but are not the warriors that those three Mexicans are, and their bodies' architecture simply isn't configured to deal with Pacquiao's speed and movement the way smaller fighters were able to.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 05:37:36 PM
brownsugar@Jocsy & Lyd :  I've had some very good experiences in the Phillipines and made some good friends that I will always treasure until this very day,.. even spoke some Tagalog for a while..... and I've been quite a few more places than just around military bases,..like Cebu and Manilla,... but there is widespread corruption and greed everywhere,.. the Phillipines is no Shangrila or land of happiness and peace,.. you have terrorists,.. cheats,..con-men,.. murderers and widespread poverty,..I've seen a gang of Filipino's pull down the fence around a garbage dump,.. just to steal the trash,.. doesn't mean that Filipino's are bad people,.. just means that they face the same conditions that breeds crime, and poverty as anywhere else,.. look how long it took to get rid of president(Dictator) Marcos,.. and the corruption still lingers,..I've also heard some pretty spicy storys from Filipino sources about some of the things that Pac used to get into between fights,.. but I don't really care about his personal life...I just watch the fights, and I like watching Pac too,.....just saying,.. coming from the province is no pass to sainthood........lets just hope he can get past Clottey so the welterweight drama can stay alive...
Friday Mar 5, 2010 06:27:49 PM
mortcola@SALT:  At least you didn't dive for that lube and rubber glove comment. Fact is, I'm not too smart at all for the guilty till proven innocent thing. Not me. I see very little indication that Pac could be juiced. Doesn't add up. Too many good reasons to believe he's not. I agree that the standard in the sport should be raised. But not as a unilateral negotiating tactic. And, while I believe Floyd is savvy enough to F with Pac's head by making hoops to jump through, he's a child in other ways, such as his clutzy way with public perception. Preponderance of the evidence says that Pac's clean, and you good people nuts. But that's just me - and mostly everyone else.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 08:05:00 PM
SALT lover@mortcola:  True, True........nice comment, dude...
Friday Mar 5, 2010 08:11:29 PM
Jocsy & Lyd@brownsugar:  Welcome to paradise and hell at the same time, as is always the case. We agree that you saw and know what you saw and know. But we are saying that you are posting exceptions to the rules, aberrations and selected seeing of what is bad. The devil was an evil angel that fought and was naughty in heaven, so you could say that hell is everywhere, since the wicked one was causing hell in heaven. Jesus marched into hell to fight the devil, so you can say that there is heaven everywhere, since The Good Son was there in hell causing heaven. Hell in heaven is an aberration. Heaven in hell is aberration. Both are exceptions to the rule. Filipinos don't see through Americans' eyes. You cannot judges us by your Western standards. We got rid of Marcos as quick as we wanted to. A long time is an American opinion. Marcos was a great president who did so much for Filipinos before he became corrupted and the Americans help him escape to Hawaii to avoid a blood bath. It would be our waste to try to explain anything to you. You are American, and Americans always believe that they are always right when they are angry and that the world wants to be as they are. Coming from the province is also no Big City life of corruption, even in the United States. Big city people are very different from those in the small cities and country side. That is the case in every country of the world. Your semantics are showing that you are in self-denial. Angry Americans are professionals at using semantics and alibis. We've known Americans in the Philippines, and we have spent many years in the USA as a nurse and school teacher. It is a hard fact, that people from Malibu are different from the ones from Compton. The ones from Manhattan are different from the ones who are from Brooklyn or Harlem. The ones from Dallas are different from the ones from Denver. We like what you wrote, but not the semantics and self-denial that Cebu and Manila would be like any province. That is the same as saying that New York City would be the same as Mayberry, North Carolina. Any way thanks for your reply to us.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 08:51:17 PM
the Roast@ MisterLee:  I read the other article posts. Nice reporting. You da (cave)man!!!
Friday Mar 5, 2010 09:03:33 PM
Fe'Roz @ mortcola:  Mortcola, nice shots; a little low but very nicely placed. Don't let the referee see them again. This is a long fight. you don't need points deducted.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 09:13:14 PM
Fe'Roz:  Mortcola brings up a solid point and has tried to make it as understandable as possible with over-lawyering it. But let me take a stab. We thankfully live in a innocent until proven guilty society. We have laws that protect us from invasions by the state. They aren't perfect but the beat by far almost any other democratic state. We have protections against the authorities operating as rogues. But yes we all know that the police, IRS and others often behave unjustly and illegally. Hopefully those exceptions are kept to a minimum. We revile racial profiling yet it happens. We know that the police in many municipalities still do it every day and we are right to despise and oppose it. I know ... as I am sure you all do... that if the police stopped everyone they wanted and searched them there would be prisons beyond prisons.....but we don't allow that kind of rogue behavior. Nor should we. Nor should we allow it in any arena. The commission has rules. For the most part they are abided by and upheld. Those rules are made and changed progressively over time in consideration of changes in boxing culture. I don't believe and/or want any one fighter to single handedly making up new rules for one occasion... any more than I want one mayor and/or cop (in a given municipality) to stop any one of us tonight and search us. Guilty or not. That is the American way.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 09:25:24 PM
The Warden:  Innocent until proven guilty applies ONLY to the courtroom, and it ends there. If one chooses, based upon the prevailing evidence, that a person is guilty, then he/she has every right to form that conclusion, irrespective of whether a jury has formally deemed guilt. It's called an opinion. Again, one is "innocent until proven guilty" in a courtroom only, and the man on the street is NOT bound to it. When OJ Simpson committed those homicides, I didn't need a rendered verdict to conclude that he was guilty.
Friday Mar 5, 2010 11:56:15 PM
SALT lover@The Warden:  Two thumbs up!! Exactly! That's what's goin' on here.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 12:04:13 AM
Texas T:  I agree with the Filipinos or Filipinas, whatever they are. The Philippines is lovely, great and wonderful, 50 times more than it is corrupted, hatred, dangerous or terrible. Like they say, if hell was in heaven, why would it not be a little of it everywhere else on earth where there is good? Poverty and crime exist in Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Japan, where these people are particularly well off and well behave. There is more crime and proverty in the birth places of Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Buddha and Muhammad than anywhere on earth. This site is pretty cool. You learn alot about more than boxing. That is nice. Keep up the great copy and posting, guys.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 12:44:02 AM
Fe'Roz @ Salt/The Warden:  Let me know if you want to re-consider that premise the next time a cop pulls you over and throws you up against the wall 'just because'. If he tells you it's just the 'opinion' of the powers that be that illegal searches are useful (there is plenty of evidence to support it), remember your words.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 01:17:38 AM
Isaiah:  This world was given over to evil a long time ago and for good reason since many of us want ot think we can do whatever we want all of our lives, never pray to turn away from sin and we'll be just fine. I slip up many times, but repentance is the key. To the believers, don't get stressed out too much about what's going on in the world. Yeshua, a.k.a. Jesus Christ, the only begotten son of the one and only living GOD is coming back soon after the midnight cry to kick lucifer's butt again. It's 11:59 p.m. on GOD's clock and the midnight cry is going to be awesome for those who TRY to walk with GOD. Time is NEARLY up. The signs are all around us, but go ahead and back to boxing talk...
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 01:23:31 AM
mortcola@warden:  The opinion of the man on the street is interesting information. But if that man doesn't understand the reasoning behind the scientific method, the law, and the psychology of persuasion and fear, then that man is ignorant and incapable of representing justice within his own thoughts. The man on the street is capable of being smarter, less judgmental, less gullible and cruel. Less easily moved by illusions and false reasoning.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 08:06:03 AM
MisterLee:  The whole innocent til' proven guilty thing is just an empty formality! street justice, witch hunts, mob mentality, diffusion of responsibility, and riots fo' sho! Vigilantes, mercenaries, crooked cops, racial profiling fo' sho! Thank god this country and our laws weren't founded by you guys. We'd take a big step back... like say... China. In beijing, when you wanted to protest the Olympics, you had to register to do so, when you registered, they threw you in prison. Makes sense fo' sho! anyway, mosley is gonna KNOCK OUT pink floyd fo' sho! @ The Roast, I met PW and saw Mosley in person! SOOOO F"n awesome! PW is a cool cat! I yelled "Cintron is a btich!" Hahah... fo' sho!
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 09:04:40 AM
mortcola@mrlee:  Nice, fo sho. If you crashed us all down on an empty planet with almost - almost - enough for everyone, we'd divide up into "men on the street", people who make a new system of order, outlaws with justice and clarity in their hearts, and men of order who grow corrupt and abuse the law to their own advantage. But without being able to tell true from false AT ALL, you're just a beast. And without feeling that sense of justice in your own imperfect heart, it doesn't matter whether you're in the street or the palace, or the 'roid lab doin' tests. Be clear. No pun intended. Which group do you all belong to?
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 09:22:26 AM
SALT lover@Fe'ROZ:  Well, if I didn't do anythin' at all, they can search me all they want; I got no problem with that. A clean man doesn't have anythin' to hide.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 10:10:13 AM
mortcola@SALT:  A clean man has to hide his ^#===. They can find stuff they can use, if you let 'em feel around. Don't matter if you're clean.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 10:43:59 AM
SALT lover@mortcola:  Hehehehehehe, please what is that, man? Now you're going to the extreme. You know exactly what I meant.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 10:48:42 AM
mortcola@SALT:  I aim to entertain as well as enlighten.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 11:05:25 AM
The Warden:  "Innocent until proven guilty" is a concept that exists ONLY in the courtroom. In an American court of law, the burden of proof is placed on the prosecution to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, as the defendant is afforded the presumption of innocence. "Innocent until proven guilty" applies to an empanelled jury, and it stops there. If the man on the street is watching a Court TV trial from his home, he is NOT bound by "innocent until proven guilty." If I witness a man steal my car, and he's later apprehended, charged, pleads not guilty, and requests a trial by jury, only those on that jury are required to withhold judgment until all the facts are in. But I know the man is guilty, and my opinion is unequivocal. It's a complete non sequitur to believe that the absence of the "innocent until proven guilty" notion by the man on the street leads to bedlam, anarchy, and vigilantism. You know why? Because that's exactly what exists today. Sure, cops make arrests all the time, that's their job, and those that have been arrested are afforded the presumption of innocence in a court of law. But that doesn't mean I don't think he's guilty. Manny Pacquiao may have never used steroids. I don't know, and nor do you. Some have the opinion that he did/does, and others have the opinion that he didn't/doesn't. But the absence of a positive test does not afford him the presumption of innocence outside of a courtroom. People are free to form opinions based on the evidence that exists. Period. As far as I know, Evander Holyfield never tested positive for PED's either.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 11:53:22 AM
mortcola@warden:  Strive for a higher standard of evidence before you tolerate an "opinion". There is not and has never been evidence of Pac using steroids. Not even circumstantial. Holyfield has always been questionable. But that's not the point. People's freedom to think ineffectively and form baseless opinions is not in question. It is an unfortunate but unavoidable downside to a free-as-possible society. But the "opinion" about Pac in this case involves the imagining of another's state of mind based on an ambiguous event - his refusal to be tested under Floyd's conditions. It amounts to reading into the beliefs and thoughts of someone you only know through media reports. NO other facts. That imaginary action on the part of the observer, fed by public emotions and rhetoric, amount to nothing but a reflection of the mind of the person who is doing the judging. Free to do it? Sure. But don't put it up on the same level of legitimacy as careful, skeptical judgment. Pac refused an extraordinary demand made by an adversary. That is the ONLY fact. The rest is the little drama inside each of our own little heads, some more legitimate and carefully thought out than others.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 12:30:27 PM
Fe'Roz @ the Warden:  In Louis Farakan's 'opinion' that refers to 6,000,000 documented dead as "the so-called Holocaust of the so-called Jew, the imposter Jew". He further states that "you can't even engage in constructive argument over the veracity of the figures of the Holocaust." Well sorry Louis, but yes you can. there is factual evidence to the contrary. It is equally unfortunate that many White people actually still believe "in their opinion' that you have to be a smart white man to play quarterback in football. When Doug Williams valiantly led his Redskins over John Elway's Broncos in a rout, you would have hoped that 'opinion' would be buried. It wasn't. Both opinions are full of the same thing. Bull !!! Now one is entitled to them of course. And we should all appreciate that freedom; even and/or especially when we look at the image of our current president ... regardless of your opinion of him.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 02:14:04 PM
Fe'Roz typo:  It is In Louis Farakan's 'opinion'....
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 02:36:50 PM
The Warden :  Mortcola - "But the "opinion" about Pac in this case involves the imagining of another's state of mind based on an ambiguous event - his refusal to be tested under Floyd's conditions." There's nothing ambiguous about the event at all; Pacquiao refused to be tested. It was abundantly clear. That's why the fight didn't happen. Clearly Mortcola you don't believe that Mr. Pacquiao's refusal amounts to much, but others do, and they are entitled to believe as they wish. You are not skeptical about the modern athlete and PED's, and that's wonderful. Perhaps you're a better man than most. But some people are very skeptical about the modern athlete and PED's. And given that climate, coupled with Pacquiao's refusal, it is not a leap of Olympic proportions for some to conclude that he's dirty. The day that Pacquiao and Clottey signed on the dotted line, he could have said that he was voluntarily subjecting himself to Olympic-style testing, if only to quell the naysayers, and undermine his accusers. He didn't. Is it a big deal? No, not really, but with a caveat: As long as he's content that many men on the street will continue to believe he's dirty.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 02:47:50 PM
mortcola@warden:  I am skeptical about PEDs in modern athletics. Its an issue. Others are entitled to believe as they wish. No dispute, as I've made clear. But all opinions aren't equal. This is about the value of opinions masquerading as judgments, and the problem of disseminating those opinions based on an absence of evidence. Bad judgment is an epidemic, and it takes less effort, and often is more fun, because it allows more exaggerated beliefs. I may be no better than most, except I hold myself to a standard of thinking and judging. Which I seldom entirely live up to. But its a good standard, and it keeps me honest. BTW, you repeat a falsehood, over and over. Pac refused to be tested? No, he agreed to be tested, and offered a more stringent schedule than required by any pro boxing association in the world. Just not what Floyd demanded. Read and re-read, because that fact demonstrates how the desire to believe in something EXCITING leads people to ignore or re-write facts that get in the way of that fun, imaginary belief. Pac never refused to be tested, and never either resisted nor failed to meet the standards of the sport. Since a higher standard is asked for by many, address the governing body. Otherwise, all boxers who meet the current standard are suspect - more than Pac, who agreed to more stringent testing than any others. Otherwise permissible sloppy and invalid opinions aside, there is no case against Pacquiao, except one based on paranoia, lack of evidence, logical fallacy, and troubled imagination. Now CURIOSITY is another matter. Stay curious if you wish. But the opinion is as worthless as my opinion as to whether there's life on other planets.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 03:22:09 PM
mortcola@warden:  ...Pac agreed to a stringent testing schedule, and Mayweather rejected it. So, the fight didn't happen because of Mayweather's refusal to withdraw an extraordinary demand, and accept a counter-offer. Again, whatever you think about the validity of different testing methods- about which there are varying "expert" opinions, and a standard accepted by the governing bodies - that is the logic of the fight. Your underlying assumptions that Pac refused to be tested and that's why they're not fighting is false. It not only misrepresents the facts, but places authority on the fighter (PBF) who went outside then rules and standards of the sport, casting aspersions on a fighter who has always been clean. This is clear as can be, unless you value all opinions equally.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 03:26:35 PM
The Warden:  Yes, Mr. Pacquiao did agree to the prevailing testing set forth by the NSAC, and even beyond that (the 14-day issue, etc). Absolutely correct. I don't dispute that at all and should have more clearly stated that the test he refused to take was the one that most experts believe to be iron-clad and foolproof, Olympic-style testing. That's the test he wanted no part of. As I stated above, Manny Pacquiao may have never used steroids. I don't know, and nor do you. But like it or not, fairly or unfairly, a cloud of suspicion now exists in the eyes of some. And like I said earlier, outside of a courtroom, the presumption of innocence doesn't apply. People form opinions based on what's transpired. On the one hand, his supporters argue that he agreed to the NSAC testing (and beyond), and as a matter of principle refused to be bullied at the point of a bayonet; conversely, his detractors argue that no man is beyond suspicion in the PED-laden age in which we live, and when you juxtapose this era with his refusal to submit to Olympic-style testing, suspicion abounds.
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 04:04:03 PM
brownsugar@Jocsy & Lyd :  no self denial here,.. and there's nothing worthy to be angry about Jocsy,.. just recalling some of my observations of a country that I have both fond memories of,.. intermingled with the painful reality that people everywhere (in all of the 20 something countries that I've visited) will do anything to survive,.. climb out of poverty,..or get money,... so don't feel like I'm judging your country,.. I remember being broke and walking back to the base once on foot... and some of the same local begger kids that I absent mindedly tossed a peso to once in a while,. saw me walking and bought me a Jeepnee ride back to the base,.And I'm aware that some areas in your country abide by very strict codes or morality,.. in some places woman are expected to be virgins when they get maried and so forth,...Even now I talk to your countrymen and women every day(at least untill you guys eventually get our jobs... and I'm not mad about that)... sometimes we joke and make small talk about Pacioau on my phone/ job,.. I answer questions for some of your less experienced employees and take some of the escalated calls...(about 20% of our phone business goes to a Filipino call Center)... If your in the same line of work,.. wouldn't be surprised if I talked to you too,.. small world,.. anyway thanks for the comments..enjoy the fight..... peace...
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 06:27:32 PM
Real Talk:  LMAO @ Anony!!!
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 07:36:37 PM
TSS reader:  Pac-roid does has something to hide.it has nothing to do with Floyds demands its that we all now he is Juicing..first off pac is not the #1 world rated welterweight thats SSM. Was is it Olympians take random blood testing almost everyday and go on to win the GOLD.. In Tour de france cyclist are tested after every stage before the race... Pac is a fraud and he is hiding his shit,hes a lying little turd...and don't give me the "Well he has Pride' excuse or he does not need Mayweather..true he does not but if he has nothing to hide take the damn Test
Saturday Mar 6, 2010 07:49:26 PM

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