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| Pacman would be favored going into a bout with Foreman, here with Arum in NYC Thursday, but c'mon, anyone fighting in between 106 and 200 pounds would happily give Manny a go. |
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Yuri Foreman Would Be Happy To Give Pacquiao Crack At Title No. 8
By Michael Woods
Americans aren't a culture known for their proficiency at smelling the roses. We are a forward looking bunch, barely able to exult for a nominal length of time before we are proceeding to formulations for what comes next. Perhaps it is our system of capitalism which solidifies this tendency.
Great, Mr CEO, you made oodles of money this quarter. What about the next quarter? You have to top it!
We've all seen where that mindset has gotten us. That doesn't mean we will change our habits, though.
In sports, we tend to act in the same fashion. The confetti was still dandruff in Jeter's hair as reporters asked him about who the Yanks should re-sign next year.
But Yuri Foreman seemed to be doing a fine job of living in the moment, exulting in the aroma of his championship effort which came on Saturday night in Las Vegas. The Belarussian/Israeli/Brooklyner wore the mark of a man who'd engaged in combat, as 18 stitches on his left eye and a black mark on his right told anyone who saw the beaming pugilist at Prime Grill in New York City on Thursday that he earned his right to smile from ear to ear.
Foreman, who is studying to be a rabbi, sat with rabbi DovBer Pinson and spiritual advisor Joel Lion at the restaurant, but right next to Foreman was the man he referred to as "my second rabbi," promoter Bob Arum. The promoter broke into a grin about as often as Foreman as he chatted with reporters with fierce pride about the 29-year-old Foreman's unanimous decision win over WBA junior middleweight titlist Daniel Santos on the Pacman-Cotto undercard. Clearly, this win was just as sweet, maybe sweeter for Arum, than Pacquiao's mixed blessing win against Cotto. Both of those men are contracted to Top Rank, so one's victory means a tumble in stature for the other. But really, the Foreman win was a bit more than business for Arum, I believe. For the 77-year-old dealmaker, a Jewish American, Foreman's win had to strike him from a different angle.
Jews have to do a lot of counterpunching in many parts of the world, our own melting pot included, and so over the years Arum has had to combat anti-semitic volleys from haters. One can infer that he feels an immense personal pride as one from his tribe overcame a pronounced lack of pop and sniping from critics who called him "Yuri Boreman" and recommended him as a cure for insomnia to become the first Israeli to win a world title.
"I'm carrying the flag right now for Israel," said Foreman before he tucked into a plate at the restaurant. "It's been a dream of mine since I was ten to win a world title."
The kid has to get props for his perseverance, if nothing else. He started training in an Arab gym in Israel--talk about throwing yourself into a lion's den. No, there was no shortage of willing sparring partners looking to "help" Foreman learn the finer points of pugilism. He turned pro in January 2002, and was brought along skillfully, but slowly, to the point where critics started to multiply. They'd grouse that he was more story than anything, that he built a glossy record on a weak foundation of journeymen. The critics had a point; his stiffest test before Santos was Andrey Tsurkan, and that was a split decision victory. But the turtle-paced buildup and sniping is old news now. Foreman can point to the belt at the "Boreman" brigade, and inform them, if he chooses to score a verbal counter, that a fight with Manny Pacquiao might be in the cards for 2010.
"I would love to fight Manny Pacquiao," Foreman told TSS. "I would give Pacman the opportunity to fight for his eighth title. I have mad respect for Pacquiao and think he's one of the best fighters ever. I haven't had a chance to talk to Bob Arum about it, but I will."
In fact, half an hour later, Arum talked about the potential for a Foreman-Pacquiao scrap. The promoter said he'd like Foreman to defend his crown a couple times, and then maybe entice Pacman to look for that eighth crown.
Arum blessed the meal before everyone tucked into steak, chicken and salmon. No word on whether he said a silent prayer that the numbers rolling in from Saturday's PPV would be adding to his glow. The promoter would be heading over to HBO's office a few blocks away after the meal to get some returns on PPV numbers. He'll hope that the numbers bolster leverage for he and Pacquiao, as the dance to make Pacquiao-Mayweather kicks off in earnest. If Pacquiao-Cotto does better business than Mayweather-Marquez, which did one million buys after expectations were in the 600-700,000 range, Arum and Pacquaio are in that much better shape. That tally came after an immense ad blitz, something in the neighborhood of $10 million, which is believed to be far in excess of money spent to plug Pacman-Cotto. There have been phone calls between the expected players, Arum, Richard Schaefer, Al Hayman and Leonard Ellerbe, but everyone's waiting to see the numbers before they start posturing. And, there will be posturing on both sides. Everyone talks about Mayweather's, but Pacman has his own pride and ego which will have to be attended to. Also, Freddie Roach has grown into a skilled negotiator, and will put his stamp on the formulation of terms. Will he be willing to accept even a 50-50 deal now that Pacquiao is armed with more leverage than Mayweather?
Back to Foreman, in the vein of what we touched on before, savoring the moment. Much credit for the Santos win has to be attributed to the behind the scenes work of the Top Rank staff. They lobbied hard for Foreman to rise in the WBA's ranks, so Foreman could emerge as a mandatory challenger for Santos. They realized that Santos would be not a soft touch, but certainly in a less than ideal place mentally and physically come fight time. Now 34, the Don King fighter had been on a one-fight-per-year run since 2005. He hadn't gloved up since July 2008, and rust, one imagined, could lessen his chances against the sweet science student with the above-average chin, Foreman. A few months back, Top Ranks' Carl Moretti went to Panama with two envelopes to enter a purse bid for Santos-Foreman.
"I had two envelopes in case someone else showed up," Moretti told TSS at the restaurant. "No one did."
The winning envelope contained a check for $162,500. Not a grandiose sum, but one that reflected the marketplace. Santos was a part-time fighter with a minimal fanbase, and Foreman had a compelling, novel back-story, but he needed to offer a showing which would appeal to more hardcore fight fans, not the casual sports fan intrigued by his "Lion of Zion" persona. Arum placated anyone referring to the writers who dismissed the sleep-inducing potential of the matchup by assuring that the human interest stories on Foreman would help the overall promotion.
The reviews weren't across the board raves, but to me, Foreman fought smartly and with enough aggression to win a healthy bunch of the unconvinced. Scuttlebutt has said that we'll see him tangle with another King fighter, Cory Spinks, who holds the IBF junior middleweight strap. Nope-- Moretti shot that down, saying another negotiation with King isn't a welcome prospect. So, Spinks is out, who then? Kermit Cintron is a possible, as is WBO champ Sergei Dzinziruk, or Pole Pawel Wolak. Moretti said he wouldn't hesitate to make Paul Williams-Foreman, either. Moretti said that he think Foreman might become even more of a fan-friendly hitter, as a 25% uptick in confidence could make the New York resident more willing to sit down on punches.
SPEEDBAG Puerto Rican fight fans are somewhat adrift with Cotto's demise at the hands of the typhoonesque Pacquaio. Miguel said he'd be back, but there are no guarantees, so more eyes will be trained on next gen hitter Juan Manuel Lopez, the WBO featherweight titlist. He was life and death with Rogers Mtagwa on Oct. 10, and left Madison Sguare Garden Theater with a win, just barely. Next up for 27-0 JuanMa is a Jan. 23 date, again at the Theater. He'll defend his crown against the former WBO featherweight champ Steven Luevano, a fellow lefty and a 37-1 slickee with minimal pop (15 KOs). Yuriorkis Gamboa (16-0) will again share the bill with JuanMa, as they did in October. The Cuban will take on Mtagwa (26-13), and look to blow him out, to provide a stark contrast to JuanMa, who needed luck and prayers to stave off an upset loss.
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deepwater:
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LOL. wOOH hold your horses yuri. Bob arum gave yuri a nice washed up inactive gift in santos. yuri foreman that was your best ever fight and it was still kinda boring. it would seem arum could let you beat john duddy at the garden. yuri+ pacman = no way. other then that nice win for ny.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 02:54:09 PM
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deepwater:
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Since Foreman will be a rabbi one day and he trained along side the palestinians maybe he could visit jeruselum and help bring peace through sport. an american/isreali training in with israelis and palestinians would be even bigger then boxing. Bring peace to the middle east with boxing .tear down that wall.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 03:03:06 PM
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Radam G -- it never stops:
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Heck! Everybody wants a piece of the Pac. They are all stepping up on deck. But they will not be able to handle his Pinoy Power Attack. Wow! This bad-leg, pillow-punching Foreman will go to sleep. And Long Tall Paul is now saying that he will come down and take Manny on. WOW! Maybe something is in the air getting these dudes delusional. The Punisher Paul may be the most avoided boxing aliveaccording to HBO, but pugilistic experts and even cats who have been around the curve in the hurt biz know better. Missing-punch Paul will get tore up by Manny. Holla!
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 03:13:38 PM
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Paul:
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8th divisional belt is not a bad RESUME for an already SOLID All Time Great Boxer. If Floyd still think he is the bigger money maker than Pacman..May be Manny might go for 8 belt in his carreer. Manny is a legendary status who still wants to solidify his LEGENDARY REPUTATION IN BOXING HISTORY.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 03:50:30 PM
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Sifufor:
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I saw Foreman in the preliminary when he won his title. That must have been the lamest title fight ever in any division. The so-called champion, Santos, was out of shape and couldn't keep his balance. Both punched like mosquitoes! Foreman boxes so so and his speed is above average. I was thinking that if Pacquiao calls out him for his 8th title, he'd be criticized for cherry picking. But now that Foreman is the one who is doing the calling out. Clearly, Pacquiao's 8th title is within reach. I don't think Foreman really think he can beat Pacquiao. If he does think so, then wresting the title from out-of-shape Santos must have gone through his head. I would get in the ring with Pacquiao too for $6-12,000,000. I know when I get hurt and leaning on the ropes, Pacquiao's going to back off.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 03:50:55 PM
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Hapa:
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Foreman is one smart fella. He knows he won't beat Pacquiao but is willing to risk his life for the kind of money Cotto made. Foreman has no intention of remaining in boxing as he wants to be a rabii. He can go out of boxing a rich man- a double whammy!.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 03:58:26 PM
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VegasReb:
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I'd like The Pacman to go for his 8th title then the winner of Mosley/Berto. I don't think the Pacman/Mayweather fight will happen soon, as Mayweather is looking at other fights.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 04:28:27 PM
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BisDak:
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why wait for Foreman to defend for 2 more fights when Pacman is ready to retire. The Pacman has probably 1 or 2 more fights and then hang his gloves. Pacman wants to be a Congressman, Actor, and Singer. And he's got load of $$$$ already. This is an opportunity for Pacman for 8th title. No one will ever surpass that.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 04:31:37 PM
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scrapman:
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The Foreman Santos fight was joke. You had an overweight, out of shape average fighter, Santos, fighting Foreman who looked technically sound against the pathetic Santos but would be killed by most in the division. I was in Puerto Rico and saw Santos call out Kermit Cintron. He can be lucky that fight didn't take place. Cintron may have actually killed him. Why "anyone" would talk about a PacMan/Foreman fight is beyond me. To get an 8th division title in one thing but against someone we know, flat-out know, PacMan would kill. What's the point? A guy like Kermit Cintron would demolish either Foreman or Santos. If PacMan fights Yuri Foreman that would be a joke. There are a lot of good fighters out there who would actually present an interesting match-up for Manny. Foreman is NOT one of them.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 05:40:50 PM
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MikRino:
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Nice idea deepwater, find alternative for peace aside from guns and bullets. If boxing brings two divided people into one why not. Peace be upon the HolyLand.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 05:51:51 PM
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Castro:
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Forget about Foreman! That dude is gonna crack on his first defense. Have Martinez or LTP step up. He'll lose.
Hey, I have 2 fighters in mind we should throw at manny instead of Foreman. (Forget about the 8th belt for manny. Cuz that isn't gonna happen.)
How bout Alfredo"El Perro" Angulo or Margarito? At their weight....no catchweight crap. Those are some real bangers with REAL chins that would love to test manny's MAN HOOD & give the lil dude a rude awakening - MEXICANO STYLE!! haha!! I would pay $100.00 PPV just to see them gobble the pacman up & show em what it's really like to fight some REAL HARD HITTING BIG MEN!!! lol
After that (if he's still able to walk) you can throw any of the K brothers at em & while your at it - have manny fight Andre the Giant & the Iron Sheik too! Cuz last I heard nutthuggin pacfans THINK their boy can fight anyone at any weight.....as long as it's on their terms. Right?
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 06:34:59 PM
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Sifufor:
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It really boils down to Forman being an opportunist- selling the title to Pacquiao for a only $10,000,000.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 07:05:07 PM
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dkd:
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LOLOLOL who the hell does Yuri think he is?
I must've been one of the 4 saps who actually watched the undercard and I can honestly say it was the most boring couple hours of the last few years of my life!
There is no way in hell Arum would disrespect Pacquiao by making him fight this guy.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 07:45:13 PM
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packy:
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I think Shawn Porter (Pacquiao's light middle-weight sparring mate) will KO Porter.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 08:49:20 PM
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bchacks:
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i'll go for the punisher instead its the real test for manny a win win situation..
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 09:14:17 PM
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jmann:
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haha castro u think manny woulld get a beating mexicano style. didnt the 3 hall of famers he fight end up working at taco bell? mexicutioner for a reason and if he is to fight margarito keep a close eye on his gloves cuz he'll need it against against a chin like that.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 09:17:46 PM
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Fe'Roz @ Radam :
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Manny and Long Tall Paul, eh? That would be a fight to behold.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 09:32:58 PM
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kyoss:
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PAC SONG TO FLOYD
They asked you if you’ll fight me
And you choked on your reply
I’d rather Arum deal with you
Than mislead you with a lie
And who am I to judge you,
On what you say or do
The fans are now beginning
To see the real you..
And someday when we tats
My LEFT will be too much
That you have to close your eyes
Where do you hide?
I wanna pound you til you’re white
‘Til your face breaks down and cry
I wanna beat you
‘Til you dream and say, goodnight.
You think you are a strategist
That you can insult my pride
But through your insecurities
You’re ZERO loss seemed right
You’re just another fighter
So far from what is true
An overrated boxer
Who never gives his due
And someday when we tats
My RIGHT will be too much
That you have to close your eyes
Where do you hide?
I wanna pound you til you’re white
‘Til your face breaks down and cry
I wanna beat you
‘Til you dream and say, goodnight.
At times I’d like to break you
And drive you to your knees
The fans would like to watch you
And see your first defeat
Your huggers understand you
And we know how hard they try
I’ve watched your Dad protect you
And your Uncle loves to smile :biglaugh:
My coach thinks your a loser
Still searching for a break
You think your odds are better
But then the public bets AGAINST!
And someday when we tats
My SPEED will be too much
That you have to close your eyes
Where can you hide?
I wanna pound you til you’re white
‘Til your face breaks down and cry
I wanna beat you
‘Til you dream and say, goodnight!
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 10:43:27 PM
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Isaiah:
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I saw Foreman on the undercard myself. The guy can box, but I hope he doesn't really think he's going to beat Pacquaio. I think it's just what some people are implying and Foreman just wants a huge payday to go out on. In that case, I'd say he's crazy like a fox...
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 11:24:57 PM
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Radam G @ Fe'Roz:
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It would be the best short bout since David slingshot Goliath. Long Tall Paul will fall. But this bout will never happen. LTP and HBO are just throwing out some jabberwocky. Holla!
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 11:38:05 PM
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entradero:
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Manny deserves to have easy fight to have a little break. Floyd had all his fights cherry picked. Besides, Yuri has a belt, 8 8 8.
Thursday Nov 19, 2009 11:53:18 PM
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loreto maka:
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I like Yuri Foreman and think he has good skills BUT unfortunately for him, he has NO power.
Friday Nov 20, 2009 12:37:49 AM
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MisterLee:
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If pacquiao fighter LTP, he will disgrace both Mayweather and Mosley, b/c you know they both avoided LTP like leonard avoided pryor. Holler!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 01:22:48 AM
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ABU BURRAT TITI:
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Well Yuri foreman has yet lack off boxing experience and now he hold a title. On the other side, if mayweather vs pacquiao does not materialize, Foreman vs pacquiao will be manny's option to go for an 8th Tltle in different division. Boxing fans will be curious how far Manny invade much taller boxer wich no one has done in history of boxing.Forget about mayweather, Lets dumb it He only cares for himself He beleive too much importance to himself. We want Manny vs Foreman fight
Let's bring it on.........................................BOXING MATCHES ARE THE PEOPLE WHO DECIDE WHAT THE FANS WANTS TO SEE
AND NOT ONLY THE BOXER WANTS FOR MONEY............
Friday Nov 20, 2009 01:44:25 AM
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Nugget:
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To : Castro
Alfredo Angulo has already been a sparring partner of the Pacman and was badly beaten up.
Friday Nov 20, 2009 02:40:45 AM
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Donnie @ CASTRO:
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ur mexican? before PAC fights margarito lets be clear.....no hand wraps ok?! dont put hand wraps MARGO maybe put in in CASTROs mouth much better! HOLLER!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 04:09:40 AM
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Donnie:
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if YURI loses PAC HATERS will say "he is an over rated fighter" excuses what more do we expect!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 04:12:06 AM
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GOAT:
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Hypercrites!!! If PBF talked about fighting Yuri Foreman instead of Pac ya'll would kill him by saying he is scarred of Pac etc.... BUT if Pac's people talk about Foreman instead of PBF or Shane no one says anything. THAT'S HYPOCRISY! Pac should only be talking about PBF or Shane, no one else. Pathetic!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 06:29:58 AM
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Master Snake:
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Would Pac and Roach force Yuri to defend his belt two pounds below the jr. middleweight limit? I love reading a rabbi-in-training say, "I have mad respect for Pacquiao." Too bad he doesn't have mad punching power.
Friday Nov 20, 2009 10:18:08 AM
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Castro:
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@jmann....YES MEXICANO style beatdown! What's wrong buddy? Never seen one before? Angulo just gave one to some poor dude & Margarito will be back to give someone some more REAL SOON! Chalupas rock though, don't they? Continue being a typical nutthuggin hater! You'll go REAL far in life. Oh & by the way - I don't think....I know! Marg & EL PERRO would KILL Manny's chin & EAR for that matter if he'd ever step in the ring with them.@nugget....manny has never sparred with Angulo! However - If they wanted to have Pacquiao spar with a REAL fighter with power and skills, Roach should have had Alfredo come spar with Pacquiao during the camp. That would be hilarious. Roach would probably need a stretcher on hand to pick Pacquiao up off the canvas for every sparring session that takes place with Angulo.@Donnie.....(Yo! where are the NEW KIDS?lmfao) yeah I'm half MEXICAN(mama's side) & half NICARAGUEN(daddy's side) - born in AMERICA & PURO LATINO!! You got a problem with people from LATIN AMERICA? Don't be jealous homie....just cuz we ARE THE FACE of BOXING! Always have been & always will be! The only thing goin in THIS mouth is a nice cold TECATE as soon as I get outta here at 5 & after that me & my MOUTH are gonna party with some Honeys! Can't say the same for you, sucka! Keep on hatin...cuz it suits you just fine! Along with those pom-poms by your side! TSS U es el NUMERO UNO!!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 01:48:52 PM
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Castro@GOAT:
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Couldn't agree with you more! Right on!
Keep speaking the truth, my man!
Friday Nov 20, 2009 01:50:11 PM
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VegasReb:
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You Floyd fans are delusional. Manny and Freddie called out Floyd. And all I hear out of Floyd is shit talk. Pacquiao doesn't need the fight more than Floyd does. Pacquiao doesn't need to wait no one, he should go after his 8th title and further establish himself as an all-tme great. While Floyd just talks and talks.
Friday Nov 20, 2009 07:42:57 PM
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chris jackson:
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One thing i cannot stand is this--two great fighters who are in their prime either never meet or omeet only after their skills have deteriorated.Im afraid this may be the case with Mayweather and Pac.
Tuesday Dec 1, 2009 08:03:48 PM
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Angie And Goody...23 Years Later
Twenty three years later after they seconded Marvin Hagler and Ray Leonard in Las Vegas, Goody Petronelli and Angelo Dundee crossed paths again. This time, it was at Foxwoods. Photo/friend of TSS "The Iceman" John Scully reports there were only pleasantries exchanged. Goody didn't debate the split decision victory enjoyed by Leonard, which to this day Hagler disputes.
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