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chambers


Sunday Jul 5, 2009

Maybe Paul Thomas had a real bad night, maybe he wants that card back, desperately. Maybe his contacts, if he wears them, were dirty. But crazy cards will always be part of the game.

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A Boxing Fixture: That One Crazy Scorecard

By Frank Lotierzo

Congratulations to heavyweight contender Eddie Chambers 35-1 (18 KOs) for the boxing clinic he administered to Alexander Dimitrenko 29-1 (19 KOs) this past weekend in Altona, Hamburg, Germany. Chambers' impressive showing versus Dimitrenko may be just enough to inject the heavyweight division with a needed infusion of excitement. As mentioned here before, outside of theKlitschko brothers, the Eastern bloc heavyweights are not special fighters, just disciplined and focused as they usually exhibit good fundamentals and boxing basics.

In a pre-fight column I suggested that the best scenario for boxing's glamour division would be if Chambers won. The interest in a title bout featuring either Wladimir or Vitali Klitschko against another Eastern born heavyweight is minuscule world-wide, as illustrated by HBO's decision not to televise Klitschko-Chagaev last month. Now Eddie can rightfully claim he's the top American heavyweight in the world, and that he's willing to go on the road and fight in hostile territory to prove it.

The hostile territory is something that struck me when I heard the judges' scorecards read. Two of the judges had the fight 117-109 and 116-111 for Chambers, which reflected the fight that unfolded in the ring. Judge Paul Thomas scored it 113-113 which is absurd. The first reaction after hearing how Thomas scored the fight is to go crazy and rip him and accuse him of being incompetent and/or crooked.

Although both may be true,  I can't say that's the case here. In watching the fight it's impossible to fathom that anyone who isn't a complete nit-wit could see the fight differently than it was. The Chambers-Dimitrenko bout was not a hard fight to score. Again, if you had your eyes open and were watching it objectively, it's impossible to come away thinking anything other than it was anoverwhelming victory for Chambers.

When all is said and done, I don't buy that judge Paul Thomas is inept and really watched the Chambers-Dimitrenko fight and came away after seeing Chambers completely outbox and fight Dimitrenko along with scoring two knockdowns, (a standing eight count in round seven and dropping him in round ten) that there was no clear winner of the fight, thus turning in a card reflecting that 113-113. If I'm wrong and Paul Thomas really couldn't decide who had the better of it during the 12 rounds fought between Eddie Chambers and Alexander Dimitrenko, then he shouldn't be allowed in any venue to watch another professional fight, let alone score it.

Instead of admonishing Paul Thomas for being an imbecile who hasn't a clue that he doesn't have a clue in regards to scoring a fight, I'll give him a pass for perhaps (subconsciously) playing the game and doing what is the right thing for the boxing establishment business-wise as they see it, and that's keeping Dimitrenko alive as a viable contender for his next fight. Over the past decade we've seen scorecards handed in by boxing judges where two of them reflected what transpired during the fight, along with the one that makes you scratch your head and think to yourself what was he/she watching. It's so common today that you can just about predict it, and it doesn't matter where the fight takes place or if it's a high profile PPV bout or one between two main event fighters on ESPN2.

The bottom line is don't go crazy over it as long as the right fighter, in this case Chambers, wins. Accept the fact that it's going to continue to happen because it's best for business. With the thought being the career of the losing fighter remains intact and makes him easier to promote. WithDimitrenko losing by a majority decision instead of the unanimous decision it should've been, the card handed in by Thomas will be mentioned with the idea behind it being to plant the thought that maybe he didn't lose and is almost as marketable as an undefeated fighter. Therefore it can be suggested that at least in the ring there's a case for him still being unbeaten, which will help sell and promote his next fight. This scenario, as put forth here in ahypothetical, doesn't begin or end with Alexander Dimitrenko nor is it exclusive to bouts held in Germany.

By the time Dimitrenko fights again it shouldn't come as a shock if something will have been released to the press on the order of 'he had an elevated temperature' or something happened behind the scenes that diverted him and hindered his performance the night he fought Eddie Chambers. And even at that one judge wasn't convinced that he lost. A recent example of this was the De LaHoya-Mayweather bout back in 2007. Mayweather clearly won the fight, but the split decision verdict made it easier to sell Oscar's next big fight versus Manny Pacquiao.

The "crazy judge's card" handed in by some judges is just part and parcel of how business is done in professional boxing. So you can frequently expect one of the three judges to submit a card out of line with what transpired in the ring. There is a strong possibility not that he doesn't know what he's watching or doing, a cynic/realist would say, more the case of him knowing exactly what he's doing and wanting to continue to get future work. There exists the chance that Thomas had a really off night of course, but watch in the future for that "crazy card," and think about what I laid out for you.

Frank Lotierzo can be contacted at GlovedFist@Gmail.com

 

 

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Isaiah:  Hey, I'm the first one to comment on this, alright. Anyway, didn't see this fight, but it sounds like Eddie clearly won it.
Monday Jul 6, 2009 08:56:00 AM
Hit Dog:  Choosing to accept scorecards like Paul Thomas' just because there happened to not be two Paul Thomases at the desk this fight seems naive at best, dangerous at worst. I don't care if Thomas is corrupt or just stupid. I just think that, if he can really twist a two knockdown fight into a draw, he doesn't have a right to his profession.
Monday Jul 6, 2009 09:12:42 AM
brownsugar:  Paul has been involved in many scoring fiasco's,.. if you google his history,.. he's been involved so often in bad scoring,... it makes you think his vote is for hire....which is probably why he gets so many assignments,...(hey can we Paul to be a judge on this one??,..is probably a question that's asked by every insecure manager)
Monday Jul 6, 2009 11:51:28 PM
Fistic Fury:  It surprises me aswell because Paul Thomas is British and we seem to be very fair when a foreign fighter comes to fight here. There is little to no home cooking on our shores, especially compared to the US and in particular Germany...
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 02:54:37 AM
Impregnable1:  Frank, you make a lot of sense. I've had the same suspicions before. However, fight fans and writers need to be honest in their assessments of these situations. For example, Mayweather vs De La Hoya. Like it or not, Mayweather very clearly won that fight. Maybe you give him 7 rounds, maybe you give him 9, but he won the fight. In the immediate aftermath nobody without serious bias argued differently. Yet, when writers gushed about Manny Pacquiao's greatness this year, they often compared Manny's and Floyd's performances against Oscar by saying, "Manny destroyed Oscar, Floyd barely beat him/won a controversial decision." Because of one judge potentially protecting De la Hoya's legacy and ego, a clear win has turned into a close fight. Judges are writing history. If judges had been a little more fair to Oscar in the Trinidad and Mosley II fights, he wouldn't have the rep of losing in his biggest fights. They need to respect the sport and the fighters and turn in honest scorecards. Any motivation for doing otherwise, even if it might theoretically be "good for boxing," should be outweighed by the judges responsibility. I will continue to say shame on Paul Thomas and all the other judges who get clear fights wrong.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 09:13:39 AM
Ray:  Fights scored like Paul Thomas did this one, needs to be reviewed by an authoritative body. And if the body finds the scoring to be so far off the mark that it seems ridiculous, then the judge should be given a warning. If he/she continues to turn in questionable score cards, the judge should be banned . It is awful, that for whatever reason, a judge decides to record a fraudalent score card. Boxers are risking their lives everytime they step into the ring. The last thing they need is a bogus judge.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 09:21:09 AM
#1 Pacfan "KO's Cotto in 7":  There has to be an end to this, it is unprofessional to a sport so popular that there's little margin of error when it comes to judging. I remember the bout between Pacquiao and Marquez back in 03 when judge "BURT CLEMENTS" scored the first round a 10-7 instead of the correct 10-6. Rule says that when three knockdowns occur in a round it must be scored a 10-6 round. Now, I don't know what was in Clements' brain at the time but that was a careless error on his part. What would have happen if Manny was granted the victory on that night? Would JMM would still ask for a rematch? I don't think so, facts shows that JMM didn't want any more of the Pacman. He would have prolly been crying for a draw, but thanks to Clements we got to see the rematch four years later... Fortunately for Chambers there were two other judges that had the right glasses on.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 11:18:37 AM
AFN squinting:  Agreed, these way off decisions need to be revieved by an independent body, warning, then suspension if it happens again. Who trains these tossers? I was watching on a pirating web site with pixels so big it was like lego boxing, and even I got it right. Paul Thomas is either retarded, crooked, or both. TOONOY YA BAS
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 03:01:10 PM
dr3r42:  There is no rule that says "if three knockdowns occur you have to score it 10-6" . Socring is subjective. Hell, the judge could have legally given the round to Marquez. Not disagreeing whether Paul Thomas is or isn't corrupt, but scoring's subjective they're not obligated to deduct a point for a knockdown(s). It is just commen practice.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 03:57:30 PM
#1 Pacfan "KO's Cotto in 7":  It was a decisive first round in favor of Pacquiao with three knockdowns! You telling me that was the right way to score that round? Have you seen the fight? Hell I would have made it a 10-5 round, Marquez didn't land a single punch in that round!
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 04:27:48 PM
#1 Pacfan "KO's Cotto in 7":  They aren't to deduct a point if the opposing fighter who was knocked down was to get back up and win by outpointing and landing big shots(9-9 round) in the last minutes of the round.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 04:37:17 PM
dr3r42:  I never said anything about how decisive the round was for Pacquiao or how I would have scored it (which would have been 10-6 Pacquuiao). My point was your statement " RULE says when three knockdowns occur in a round the round MUST be scored 10-6"; was wrong. You did say that didn't you ? (unless someone else wrote the post under your handle). There is no rule telling judges how to score a fight (unless the ref deducts points, then they have to subtract points) and legally they can score the round anyway they want, they can even legally give the round to Marquez if the judge wants to
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 05:35:18 PM
DaveB:  Very interesting concept here and it makes complete sense. It has happened more times than I care to remember, so there could be a method to the madness. I think it stinks that someone shouldn't be rewarded for what they rightfully earned but this does make me somewhat cynical because this type of business goes on all the time. It is only when it is brought out for what it is that you realize that something is rotten in Denmark or where ever. I can't believe I've been so naive. I guess we all can learn.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 08:29:00 PM
sonny:  You didn't go far enough. Was the judge protecting the interests of the Puerto Rican - based WBO? Has the judged been hired by the WBO in the past and be rewarded?
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 09:15:19 PM
Real Talk:  Paul Thomas is funny as Paul Mooney with this one . Dueces
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 09:26:36 PM
the Roast:  Scoring fights is a very subjective thing. Judges can see or miss a lot depending on where they are seated. Our own Editor Mike had Cotto-Clottey 116-111 from where he sat that night. Mike aint a crook. How bout the guy who had SRL over Hagler 118 to 110? What was his name, Jo Jo Gerra? I dont remember. Or back in the day, watching a fight on NBC Sportsworld, Tony Sibson vs somebody in the UK. The final bell rings, the Ref walks over, raises a fighters hand, fight over! No scores at all. I say go for the KO, take it out of the judges hands.
Tuesday Jul 7, 2009 10:32:44 PM
has been:  Bad decisions and poor match making are a big part of what is wrong with the sport of boxing today.
Wednesday Jul 8, 2009 03:29:29 AM

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