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haye


Wednesday May 28, 2008

Here is Haye launching a gutbuster on Mormeck. Will his power move up with him to heavy? More crucially, will his chin hold up?

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Can Haye Make Heavyweight Division Exciting?

By Ron Borges

The heavyweight division needs a lift. The heavyweight division also needs a star. Whether it needs Oscar De La Hoya to provide both remains to be seen but it got them and him anyway Monday when De La Hoya’s powerful promotional company climbed into the heavyweight division by signing undisputed cruiserweight champion David Haye to a five-year deal to exclusively promote him in the United States and co-promote him alongside Haye’s newly created company in England.

      De La Hoya’s uncanny ability to land dates from U.S. cable giant HBO, which many of his competitors feel is suspect at best and restraint of trade at the worst, played an instrumental role in making that deal, but De La Hoya’s dominance of the marketplace cannot provide Haye with what he will need most to compete successfully among boxing’s biggest practitioners – a reinforced mandible.

      Haye is many things, including charismatic, fit and handsome, all of which separate him from nearly every other heavyweight in the world but Wladimir Klitschko. He can also punch with mind-numbing authority, especially with the right hand, as his 21-1 record with 20 knockouts makes clear. But whether his chin is up to the task of standing up to a heavyweight’s assault remains a question yet to be fully answered.

      Can a man knocked to the floor by an African super middleweight of little note named Lolenga Mack stand up to the punches of the powerful Nigerian Samuel Peter, who presently holds the WBC version of the heavyweight title?

      Can a fighter stopped by a well-faded Carl Thompson inside five rounds four years ago take the kind of wallop that comes from someone like Klitschko, who holds the IBF and WBO versions of the title and has stopped 44 of his 50 victims inside the distance?

      Those are questions even the head of De La Hoya’s Golden Boy Promotions conceded remain unanswered, thus creating a mystery and an intrigue around Haye that few other heavyweights can claim.

      “That is the question,’’ Golden Boy CEO Richard Schaefer said in London when asked about the sturdiness of Haye’s chin after signing him to a multi-fight deal. “This guy has the opportunity to step up and make an impact.’’

      That assumes his chin, which let Haye down in his only loss four years ago against Thompson and has left him in trouble against other cruiserweights, can handle the sudden impact of someone like Klitschko or any of the other top heavyweights, whoever those people may be.

      That question will take time to sort itself out but when Haye was in Las Vegas for the Joe Calzaghe-Bernard Hopkins fight he told two acquaintances at Calzaghe’s post-fight victory party, “I’m what this division needs. I’m a breath of fresh air.

      “It’s disgraceful the state of the heavyweights. I don’t see anyone to be worried about. Can I take their punch? Maybe the question is can they take my punch? I’ll make some noise.’’

      Haye has already begun doing the latter after doing quite a bit of the former on his way to unifying the cruiserweight titles. Twice he’s called out Klitschko, the first time even before officially relinquishing the WBC, WBA and WBO cruiserweight championships he briefly held after knocking out Enzo Maccarinelli in less than two rounds a few months back.

      While conceding he will fight two top 10 rated heavyweights before going after Klitschko in earnest, Haye insisted there is no other heavyweight he’s truly interested in facing because while the titles may be fractured universally Klitschko is seen as the best heavyweight of a bad bunch. There’s also no other opponent with whom Klitschko can make real money beside himself. Certainly with the added power of both De La Hoya and HBO behind him as well as Setanta Sports, the British cable company with whom Haye also signed a long-term deal to televise his fights exclusively throughout the UK, Haye has a point there.

      De La Hoya left no loose ends during this negotiation, first selling a minority interest in his promotional company to Anschutz Entertainment Group (AEG), which owns the O2 Arena in London, before closing the deal with Haye. That is significant because Haye had previously signed a deal to fight his next four heavyweight fights at the O2 Arena.

      Obviously, HBO and De La Hoya will want to see Haye fighting in the U.S. sooner rather than later and certainly would balk at a Klitschko-Haye fight landing anywhere but in Las Vegas, with its lucrative site fees and the logistical advantages in terms of hotel space and hype that a casino setting provides the promoter.

      Although Haye’s deal with AEG specifies his next four fights are to be at O2, De La Hoya’s new partnership with AEG all but assures that can be avoided, although perhaps not until Haye twice tests himself in the division while Klitschko takes care of the two mandatory title defenses he must make before the year is out.

      Haye’s only fight at heavyweight thus far was a first round stoppage of Poland’s Tomasz Bonin last year prior to returning to 200 pounds and unifying the cruiserweight championship in emphatic fashion by knocking out first WBC and WBA champion Jean Marc Mormeck in seven and then WBO title holder Maccarinelli in two. Although British promoter Frank Warren has already offered Haye $1.2 million to fight Commonwealth heavyweight champion Matt Skelton in the fall at O2 Arena in his first heavyweight fight since relinquishing the cruiserweight titles, De La Hoya is leaning toward someone more familiar to the American public, like former heavyweight champion and Lennox Lewis conqueror Hasim Rahman.

      Regardless of whom it ends up being, Haye is confident it won’t matter.

      “I’ll fight two top 10 heavyweights and obliterate them,’’ Haye promised. “If I didn’t believe I could meet my own expectations I wouldn’t be doing this. I’ll show the world what heavyweight boxing can be. The division is a disgrace. I’ll bring the excitement.’’

      What Haye also promised was that he would unify the heavyweight title despite the fact he has seen that poor Klitschko is already burdened with mandatory requirements that preclude more lucrative fights while holding only half of the four major title belts.

      To do any of that however, first Haye’s chin must prove to be more resilient than it has been in the past. Of course, that’s part of his appeal. Either he gets you or you get him, so mystery and edginess abound whenever he gets into the ring.

      Haye’s punching power was legendary among cruiserweights and seems likely to be carried with him when he moves up. But being chin challenged in the opinion of many makes Haye even more intriguing because every time he enters the ring against boxing’s heaviest hands no one will be quite sure who will survive. Does his superior speed compared with most of today’s heavyweights, combined with his crushing power with the straight right hand make him unbeatable, as for a long time Evader Holyfield was after he became the first cruiserweight champion to successfully pursue the heavyweight title? Or does a mandible made of mush doom his efforts despite having the promotional power of De La Hoya behind him?

      Haye, for one, believes speed is power and he’s the heavyweight who has the most of both. Hence, how can he go wrong?

      “I don’t want to lose my speed (by getting too heavy or going up in weight too quickly) because I believe speed is the key to becoming heavyweight champion,’’ Haye told the BBC.

      That and the promotional power of Oscar De La Hoya, whose decision to finally venture into boxing’s most important weight class seems to signal the division’s possible revival. That assumes, of course, that no one has to revive David Haye before he ever gets to Wladimir Klitschko.



Madison:  I think David Hayes mouth flaps about as much as Mr. Naseem Hameds or maybe even more. I've never been too fond of guys like that because when they do eventually lose we all see the crack in the armor. So the next time they're building up to fight and the start running their mouths again, its hard to swallow up the hype. Heavyweights? Bigger bangers? If David Haye steps up to Klitschko he might just get a mouthful of leather, a back full of canvas and a one-way ticket back to cruiserweight.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
rudy:  He can def make some noise, especially considering the opposition. The marquee fight is Wlad vs Haye. GBP can feed him McCline, Barrett, or someother sorry ass HW to introduce Haye into the HW class and then set up the fight with Wlad. Can even fight Povetkin and crush that sorry prospect
Wednesday May 28, 2008
rudy:  Another thing - why question Haye's chin? Consider he hasnt been KO'd since '04, is at a more comfortable weight, and the current bunch of HW's have worse chins than him. Peter decked 3 times by McCline, Wlad probably the worst chin by HW champ ever, Valuev is just a circus act, Chagaev LOL hepatitis, Barney Rubble seems to be extinct now, and who else is there.....NOBODY.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Donald:  It's Lolenga Mock, not Lolenga Mack. Still, I guess that highlights the point. Even so, if you'd seen the fight you'd know that it WASN'T Haye's chin that let him down against Thompson - as you suggested - it was his stamina and foolish gameplan. Haye threw nearly 120 punches in the first round alone. For a cruiserweight facing someone like Thompson that was career suicide. As for his chin, the guy took some massive and flush shots from Thompson and, despite being in a state of exhaustion, was stopped on his feet.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Lee Courtney:  I agree that Haye has in the past had more of a stamina problem than a chin problem, maybe this was to do with weight making problems. Also Mock hit him on the temple.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Radam G:  People make to much to do about nothing about getting knocked down or knocked out. A lot of great boxers were knocked down or knocked out. It not totally about that. It is about beating the top guns and winning in rematches. Name one of the great heavys who haven't been down or out? No one can. I think that Haye will do well, if he just learn to move his head an iota more. Cruiserweights are heavy any way. The alphabet-soup organizations made up this division to collect more sanction fees from this pseudodivisions' champions. These guys are just in-shape heavys. The nowadays heavys are fatties and/or overgrown giants who probably cannot beat the cruisers. Before this division, the typical weight of heavy beltholders was between 195 and 212. Matter of fact, in the history of the game, 20 of the legit heavyweight universal champions would not have been heavys. They would have all been cruisers. Holla!
Wednesday May 28, 2008
AG:  All physical and cosmetic attributes aside, Haye is the best h-weight option out there since Lennox Lewis. He will plow thru the likes of Povetkin and the rest of the eastern bloc h-weights and end up in a showdown with Vlad that may really leave us all pleasantly surprised.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Bulldog:  It would be great if Haye backs himself up with class performances in the HW division, can remember Thompson clubbing him into submission, who had harder fights against an end of career Eubank. Mormeck flooring him whilst only brief does raise doubts, Haye could have avoided both knockdowns if tightening his defence but when hes hit hard seems quite quickly to get out of sorts. On the other hand he is brilliantly fast and appears so far to have the strength, if and when a big hitting heavyweight clubs him is when we'll find out if he has the chin for it or the stomach to dig in for a toe to toe battle ( we all know that wont happen with Klitchko ). Either way on the excitement front Haye cant fail to lift the division, credit to the East European champs for holding their titles but they just dont create any buzz, its a long time since ive looked forward to seeing a HW fight. Good luck to Haye, but he wont ever be a Holyfield.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Bulldog:  Couldnt agree more Radam, looking back through HW boxing 16 1/2 st used to be very heavy, many boxers in the division were fighting round 15st, lol but it would be amusing to see Valuev aka King kong getting down to 15st, his head would look even more elephant man like.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
The Watcher:  Before everyone gets on the Haye ban-waggon remember he fought only twice early on in his career in the US. All of his other fights are on the other side & everyone knows that with the exception of Calzage they aren't the same fighters when they fight our guys here in the states. & Even Calzage fought a should have been retired Hopkins. This guy exposes his chin way to much & he will get cracked by much better fighters. Remember my words when he flops. Also GBP is going to put him in the wrong fights & put another loss on his record like they have done with all of there other fighters. Bad Matchmaking.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
dan:  i think you can make the argument that Floyd Patterson had the worst chin of any HW champ ever. Wlad has a lousy chin, but two of his KO losses were more due to fatigue than his chin. And he's never been down for the 10 count. He always gets up. Also, regarding Haye, his KO loss was more due to fatigue than anything else. Don't know if anyone mentioned that already.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
andy from newcastle:  I haven't seen enough of Haye to really comment. He looked powerful enough against Enzo, and Mormeck isn't easily stopped, yet was. So he's certainly strong at cruiser. I hope he does well cos the heavies need this shot in the arm. But the ladies had better enjoy those abs while they can, once he puts on 20lbs they may not see them again. Remember to show some support for the new Savage Science site, pass the word around any MMA friends you may know. And Madison, check out The Best of Hamed Getting Hammered on You Tube, you'll enjoy it by the sound of things.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
jon b:  I like David Haye, hes young exciting, & actually in shape. He has talent unlike every other boring fat heavyweight. Ill take Haye vs any heavy & that includes an overgrown floyd mayweather jr. in Wladimir Glassjaw. At least Haye has the balls to want to face the best unlike the fatweights & almost all european fighters.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Really:  Yes Haye will bring excitement to the heavyweight division, but if anyone invisions Klitschko decked like Maccerinelli by a Hayemaker, then they should know that Klitschko is a killing machine in the ring. He executes and punches harder than Haye and he has superior boxing skills to Haye. Klitschko takes him out with a brutal K.O.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Adrian:  People do read too much into knockout losses. Wlad came back from devastating losses and looks pretty good now. Maybe Haye's loss is also a thing of the past. That being said, I'd rather he accomplish something than just prattle on like a damned fool. You never hear Wlad making such nonsensical noises and he honestly has a lost more to brag about now. At some point it does not matter how good you say you are, you need proof of the fact. And it never hurts to show some class once in a while.
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Radam G:  The following heavyweight champions would not have been heavys, nowadays, because of the pseudodivision of cruiserweight. As I said earlier, this division is bunk! A creation just to make more bucks by these corrupted alphabet-soup organizations -- WBA, WBC, WBO, WBU, WBF,IBF, IBO, IBA, etc., etc. Just imagine 197-pound Joe Louis -- the greatest heavy ever -- would've been a cruiser when he first won the title. So would have 184-pound, undefeated Rocky Marciano, 187-pound Jack Demsey, 192-pound -- first black man to win the world heavyweight title -- Jack Johnson, 181-pound Ezzard Charles, 194-pound Jersey Joe Walcott, 189-pound Gene Tunney, 188-pound Max Schmeling, 189-pound James J. Corbett, 194-pound Jim B. Braddock, 180 Tommy Burns, 165-pound Bob Fitzsimmons, 196-pound Ingemar Johansson, 197-pound Leon Spinks and 182-pound (first person to regain the heavyweight title after losing it) Floyd Patterson -- who was knocked down so many times from bad balance, leaping and wearing lifts in the shoes than from being punched on a weak chin, though he had one. This British "Haymaker" David Haye will have a nice slingshot and plenty of stones to beatdown all these present-day Goliath-style of heavyweight weaklings. Holla!
Wednesday May 28, 2008
donputo69:  most definetly he can make some noice in this weak heavy weight division..and who cares about his chin..his chin hasnt been tested since 2004..plus he has all the right tools to become a champion..haye vs wlad..make it happen..holla back..
Wednesday May 28, 2008
Really:  Weaklings doesn't apply to Klitschko or the many other greatly talented Eastern European talents and champions my friend. You know boxing, but should overcome your biased ways.
Thursday May 29, 2008
VKT:  David Haye is not a Cruiserweight moving to Heavy. He is a heavyweight who has been boiling his body down to Cruiserweight for his whole professional career (he fought in the Heavyweights as an amateur). There is a big difference: when your body is excessively dehydrated, it affects primarily 2 things: stamina, and equillibrium (hence his apparent inability to take a punch). Power and speed, however, would be mostly unaffected. Hayes camp would have known this when they made the decision to start at Crusierweight, but obviously decided it was worth the risk. If you want to know why Haye seems so confident of his chances at Heavyweight, its because he, and his camp, are well aware that he has been fighting at a disadvantage his whole career. On a purely physical level, they know he is likely be much stronger at the natural weight. When Haye moves up to Heavy, his speed will be even more effective, though he WILL loose some power (relative to the guys hes fighting). His punch resistance and stamina, however, will most likely improve (contrary to what most believe), or at the very least will be no worse than it was at Cruiserweight, again relative to his opposition. Interestingly, Haye's camp are not making too much of this. Quite the opposite, they are actually playing up his "weak chin". If Haye doesnt have some kind of percieved weakness, no'one will want to fight him. Outside of having a "weak chin", its fairly obvious he's very fast, his movement is very good, and its a fair bet his power will be much better than average for a heavyweight. But without having a name at Heavyweight, he would be far too high risk/low gain for most top level contenders if he didnt look beatable. One thing is for sure, his first contest against a real Heavyweight contender will be very interesting and compelling viewing...
Thursday May 29, 2008
Radam G:  It is what it is. The heavyweight division is full of weaklings because it has been depleted of the best by the pseudodivision of cruiserweight. If it were no cruiserweight division, Klitschko and all the other giants and fatties would not be champions. Just as in yesteryears, boxers between 190 and 212 would knock these heavyweight champions of today dizzy. Klitschko is remindful of Jess Willard, Primo Carnera and Ernie Terrell. The minute that Klit fights a true heavy between 190 and 210, he would be chop the fudge up. Holla!
Thursday May 29, 2008
Nico FAN:  Valuev will knock him out on his a$$.
Thursday May 29, 2008
Yuvie:  I'm a fan of David Haye. I like his attitude, he knows what he's talking about but I just worry the cockiness will get the better of him in the end. I hope not. Dude could seriously cause a storm in the HW division, he's the only heavyweight I'll look out for. For now, the question about his chin will remain unanswered. He needs to starch a couple of heavyweight first. Then I'd put him in with Peter. Then the winner gets Vlad. The great thing with Haye is that he has the power and the speed, so hopefully he should be able to cope with the slugweights of today without getting hit too much anyway.
Friday May 30, 2008

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