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The Shadow:

"If you were impressed with MM's endurance against little Floyd, then the first Castillo fight will have you awed. Castillo took Floyd's best jabs and swept the later rounds in their first fight. That's why HBO's Harold L scored it 115-111 for Castillo. If you thought Lara lost to Canelo then the result of this fight would of had you yelling fix. The compubox numbers help tell the story : 173 power punches landed compared to 66.

203 total punches compared to 157. 8th grade Cuban school was in session.



Jabs Castillo Mayweather

Landed 30 91

Thrown 129 297

Percent 23% 31%

Power Punches Castillo Mayweather

Landed 173 66

Thrown 377 151

Percent 46% 44%

Total Punches Castillo Mayweather

Landed 203 157

Thrown 506 448

Percent 40% 35%"




I never personally saw the controversy with that fight. Floyd swept the first six rounds.



This fight also perfectly shows the problem with CompuBox. There's no distinction between quality and quantity. (Example: Roy Jones and Montell Griffin having similar punch stats in their rematch.)



Many of those shots Compubox counted were illegal blows in the clinch. It wasn't clean punches.



Here's a video that breaks down the clean punches:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mya73B5xzsw



People always say he came back in the second fight and won easily. I don't think there was that much of a difference.



If I'm not mistaken, I think the scores were wider the first time out.

Reply

Skibbz:

"I honestly don't see what Mayweather can do to greatly improve upon his last performance. Mayweather cannot truly improve due to his age.... He can only attempt to ressurect his once incomparable skill......to somehow retrieve the slowly fading abilities he used to have.

He's training harder and incorporating more strength training along with more rigorous speed drills but his battle is against age. The best he can hope for is an extra 2% or 3% improvement over his last effort.

Maidana has the invulnerability of youth. ...along with the wreckless Kamikaze faith of a warrior who truly believes he won the first war.

He will not yield ...he will not back down unless its for strategic purposes only.

Maidana has the far greater potential to improve from a physicality standpoint and is the first boxer since Del LA Hoya.

In the first fight Maidana effectively crouched and jabbed while moving in reverse to elude Mayweather whenever it appeared Floyd was beginning to exploit the crazed Argentenians chaotic offence.

Despite his crude technique Maidana is not quite the mindless automaton he appears to be.
He's boxing's version of a remorseless psychopath, who wears the festering Hockeymask of resentment and disrespect while he dispenses his brand of terror upon his unsuspecting opponents

Mayweather's struggle will be to take advantage during the lulls and gaps between Maidana's offence. One miscalculation could be his last.
If Floyd suffers a knockdown or gets pummled to frequently trying to use the ropes...he may find himself facing a deficit on the scorecards that could posdibly be too deep to overcome."


I accept what you're saying but what of the idea of fighting fire with fire? We have seen Chino go down on many occasions in the past, both from blows to the body and head. Sure he's gotten back up and usually won the fight (if not always) but Mayweather used to be one of the best offensive fighters in the sport. Can he keep up an offense for 12 rounds against the pressure of Maidana? I doubt it.. But Maidana will surely have greater endurance going into this fight so it may get too close for comfort if he attempts to sit back and let the steam cool off before he notches up rounds.

Check Maidana with the left hook and if that doesn't drop him spear the right behind for good measure, if anything it will remind the brute that he's in there with a boxer..

Reply

Skibbz:

The difference between Rigondeaux and Algieri is hard to quantify, the number required is simply too large and bordering on the abstract and imaginary. Where Rigondeaux uses his smarts, Algieri uses his legs. Where Rigondeaux uses a vast arsenal of punches, Algieri shows off a few, albeit 'well' practiced, combinations that most fighters can use after several years in good gyms - ultimately, where Rigondeaux decides to fight, Algieri decides to take flight.



It's easy for him to squeeze into a 140 frame at 5'10 because he loves to run. I wouldn't be surprised if he managed to make 135 or even 130, just stick him on a treadmill and watch him run to his heart's content. I think it can be argued that as much as Rios loves treacle in his brain, Algieri loves the feeling of running.



But, against foes without the ability to cut off the ring effectively, against foes who are experienced against fast moving negative runners, he will fall. He can not take a championship punch, that much we know and are sure of. When Pacquiao's gloves are firing toward his face and vital organs in 8-10 punch combinations, those earmuffs won't be able to save him. His legs will provide relief for a few steps but the master of the dance will be one of the greatest pugilists of our generation and in the sport's history.



If you are so confident in Algieri's victory over Pacquiao, surely it's time to bet the house and get minted? I'm not aware of the odds on Algieri... But I am sure you will make a sizable return.. I wouldn't do it, I don't believe Algieri has the minerals to compete with Manny Pacquiao, but if you are so certain then it's time to win with your man.

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Skibbz:

Will Redkach now be known as the Ukranian Mexican? I like Robert Garcia as a trainer, I think he can improve most fighters that come to him so it will be interesting to see where this new road takes Redkach. A tall southpaw fighting lightweight with good power and good durability.. It should be good things. Hopefully they squeeze another fight for him in 2014, allow us fans a closer look at the work being done by Robert Garcia!

Reply

oubobcat:

Personally, I see Algieri putting up a better effort than most people think and this fight being more entertaining than most believe it will be as well. Pacquiao is a much different fighter than Provodnikov and Algieiri will not fight in that exact same manner he did against Provodnikov as he will against Pacquiao.

All that said, its very hard for me to envision Algieiri getting his hand raised here. Pacquiao is just too skilled and too quick for him. He will beat Algieiri to the punch frequently and easily counter the slower Algieiri as well. But Algieiri will have his moments as Pacquaio is not the fighter he once was in this sport.

I think this will be one of those fights where Algieiri loses but ultimately gains in the loss. He performs better than expected and is more entertaining that most predicted in this fight. He raises his credentials in the sport and his ranking in the division in spite of losing the fight.

Reply

The Commish:

"I will say this. Though it probably won't happen say in the next few months, I am very confident we will see Kelly Pavlik in a boxing ring again.

At some point in time, he is going to miss the spotlight and more importantly the money. Regardless of what anyone may think of what his skills will be, he is marketable. He gets a couple gimme wins and bam proclaims himself ready for the big time. His phone will be ringing off the hook then from many opponents looking to fight someone who brings drawing power to the table, eyeballs to the tv sets and frankly would probably look to be a very beatable fighter.

Think about it...though he may not be coming back today or tomorrow he will at some point. We have not seen the last of Kelly Pavlik."


Sadly, you are probably right. He will get in the gym, take a few fights, flatten each guy, then proclaim he is "ready for a title shot." Most recently, we have Shannon Briggs running around, challenging Wladimir Klitschko, who would love an opportunity to pound Briggs the way his brother did.

Yeh, Pavlik will be back. He may even get that title shot.

When he does, it won't be pretty!

-Randy G.

Reply

oubobcat:

I will say this. Though it probably won't happen say in the next few months, I am very confident we will see Kelly Pavlik in a boxing ring again.

At some point in time, he is going to miss the spotlight and more importantly the money. Regardless of what anyone may think of what his skills will be, he is marketable. He gets a couple gimme wins and bam proclaims himself ready for the big time. His phone will be ringing off the hook then from many opponents looking to fight someone who brings drawing power to the table, eyeballs to the tv sets and frankly would probably look to be a very beatable fighter.

Think about it...though he may not be coming back today or tomorrow he will at some point. We have not seen the last of Kelly Pavlik.

Reply

The Commish:

After a few phone calls, it doesn't look like there's anything to this story. Apparently, Pavlik is in no shape--physically or mentally--to launch a comeback.

It's too bad, because if he could come back--all the way back--it would make quite a compelling story. In reality, though, these type of stories rarely have a happy ending.

-Randy G.

Reply

Radam G:

The PPV is indeed a ripoff for the U.S. mainlanders. C-Al is very confused. What Algieri speed is he talking about that is going to surprise Da Manny? C-Al is dealing with a true speed merchant that is quite uncanny. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqGRIT8WV7o



Sorry C-Al! There will be no surprises about you. Your arse is the one who is "hecky-jecky." And you are speaking very murky. You are going to turn out to be one-easy-to-beat turkey.



You talk about your RANGE. WOW! You're quite strange! You are easy to reach. "Imma beat Manny! Imma beat Manny!" That is all you preach. The PacMan's shots are to be biting bunny-hopping, jittering C-Al like a shark attack near the beach. Holla!

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Froggy:

I will drink to that !

Reply

brownsugar:

This thread ......although a very good one...is already 4 months old ....during the past 4 months the only thing my fellow Ohioan has ordered..... Is another shot.....not a shot at the title...another shot of the sauce.

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brownsugar:

Moral of the story.... Never sign with another Advisor/manager when you already have one (James Prince) and then try to force the original manager with the other guy. Especially after spending a $500,000 plus another $100,000 advance.



If Ward wants to dump a manager he should start with Prince. Too many cooks in the kitchen

Reply

brownsugar:

I honestly don't see what Mayweather can do to greatly improve upon his last performance. Mayweather cannot truly improve due to his age.... He can only attempt to ressurect his once incomparable skill......to somehow retrieve the slowly fading abilities he used to have.

He's training harder and incorporating more strength training along with more rigorous speed drills but his battle is against age. The best he can hope for is an extra 2% or 3% improvement over his last effort.

Maidana has the invulnerability of youth. ...along with the wreckless Kamikaze faith of a warrior who truly believes he won the first war.

He will not yield ...he will not back down unless its for strategic purposes only.

Maidana has the far greater potential to improve from a physicality standpoint and is the first boxer since Del LA Hoya.

In the first fight Maidana effectively crouched and jabbed while moving in reverse to elude Mayweather whenever it appeared Floyd was beginning to exploit the crazed Argentenians chaotic offence.

Despite his crude technique Maidana is not quite the mindless automaton he appears to be.
He's boxing's version of a remorseless psychopath, who wears the festering Hockeymask of resentment and disrespect while he dispenses his brand of terror upon his unsuspecting opponents

Mayweather's struggle will be to take advantage during the lulls and gaps between Maidana's offence. One miscalculation could be his last.
If Floyd suffers a knockdown or gets pummled to frequently trying to use the ropes...he may find himself facing a deficit on the scorecards that could posdibly be too deep to overcome.

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The Commish:

"Boom.



Andre ,train hard, get into the ring,keep winning ,finish the contract and take it from there. Hopefully GTP will drop the defamation suit and everyone will get down to business. Please fire and disassociate yourself from the people that gave you the advice to sue."




For Andre Ward, there is no other answer. Get in the gym, let Dan Goossen get you some fights, do some announcing, relax a little, get back in the gym and repeat the process. You'll earn big buckeroos and you'll have less headaches from boxing than you get from being in the courtroom!



It's his only real, viable option.



-Randy G.

Reply

stormcentre:

"QUOTE=stormcentre;61931]Randy, in your opinion does John have the gumption to pull Mayweather up (and penalize him) for using the elbow, in a big fight like this?"

John will be one of the judges. A boxing judge cannot randomly deduct a point from his/her scorecard unless instructed by the referee that he/she is deducting a point for an infraction. Judges are there to score the round. The referee is there to more or less be the traffic cop and enforce the rules.

John knows how to watch a fight and I consider him one of the best around. I commend NSAC Executive Director Bob Bennett for making John McKaie as one of his choices to judge the $$$May-Maidana rematch.

-Randy G."

Oh, thanks for that.

I actually didn't read the title of this thread properly and somehow mistook it for John being the referee of the upcoming Mayweather V Maidana fight.

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The Commish:

"I think the lamp post he punched out ,punched him back too hard. Boxing is always a place to redeem oneself but he is out of it talking about fighting ggg at this point. The plan could be this:

1 quit drinking and no pills

2 get out of Ohio and move into a studio by Robert Garcia's gym

3 run and spar against all comers

4 line up a fight against a can

5 evaluate performance against the can

6 do it again

7 do not visit Ohio

8 stay off the bottle

9 fight a fringe contender and look good

10 spar top guys

11 keep going to support meetings

12 call out ggg and good luck

The deepwater 12 step program."




I love your program. Unfortunately, I am not sure, from all I have heard from those who really know Pavlik and have been around him, if he can past stage one of your program!



-Randy G.

Reply

The Commish:

QUOTE=stormcentre;61931]Randy, in your opinion does John have the gumption to pull Mayweather up (and penalize him) for using the elbow, in a big fight like this?"

John will be one of the judges. A boxing judge cannot randomly deduct a point from his/her scorecard unless instructed by the referee that he/she is deducting a point for an infraction. Judges are there to score the round. The referee is there to more or less be the traffic cop and enforce the rules.

John knows how to watch a fight and I consider him one of the best around. I commend NSAC Executive Director Bob Bennett for making John McKaie as one of his choices to judge the $$$May-Maidana rematch.

-Randy G.

Reply

Radam G:

No! It will be another razor-close win for Money May, who will never match up well against this type of pug. Money May dancing with Chino is like wrestling with a grizzly bear in a bathtub.

This will be another ugly fight, with Money May doing enough to get through the night. Holla!

Reply

stormcentre:

"They're 1-1, although Dirrell's defeat is somewhat disputed (by the US camp, of course lol). Happened during the Olympics, semifinal I believe.

GGG has said himself that Dirrell is one of the best, if not the best, that he ever fought. Which I guess is pretty obvious when you look at his record.

Dirrell is much better than Bute, by the way."


(Andre) Dirrell has mad skills but is yet to put them together under pressure and on the seriously big stage.

He did give 3G serious problems and laid somewhat of a blueprint in how to at least befuddle him - but then as you say 3G has beaten him (in the amateurs) and vice-versa.

A prime Kelly Pavlik would - for a while at least - give 3G something to think about.

Golovkin certainly wouldn't wade in without regard for his face the way he currently does; if Kelly used those long arms, distance and his leverage properly.

I just hope we get to see Dirrell take some serious steps towards contention and a title soon.

And I hope Golovkin fights someone that presents a serious challenge soon as well, as there are plenty out there for him.

Reply

Radam G:

"That loss in kickboxing was years ago. Chris Algieri did not have anywhere near the training, conditioning, skill or knowledge that he has now.



KTFO'd? He sure did get KRFO'd. But that was nothing compared to the face-down nap Da' Manny took just two years ago.



I recognize Pacquiao as an all-time great, a lock to make the Hall-of-Fame on his first year of eligibility. However, he's not getting any younger...or faster...or more skillful...or better...or stronger. He will be outreached in this fight by a quick and skillful boxer.



Pacquiao is a great fighter. On November 22, there may still be plenty of greatness left inside of him. If that's the case, he'll beat Algieri and just about anybody on the other side of the ring from him.



But ifr he's slipping, we'll know it early in the fight. In that case, it will be a long night.



A long one for Manny Pacquiao.



-Randy G."




That "KTFO'd" was C-Al fibbing and hiding his. Ev'ybodee and dey momma know Da Manny has been KTFO face down TWICE and once to the belly. It comes with the territory. But C-Al and his supporters, protectors and bodyguards surrounding the lies and myths of C-Al being a clearcut undefeated kickboxer/boxer have been trying to hide and push reality of the actuality to the side.



And if they keep fibbing, I can come up with a double "face down nap" of C-Al "just two years ago." Dude should know that cameras have been on him in every gym that he has been in in the last 10 years.



Wow! You really love your homeboy. I can respect that. And I will not be the one releasing footage -- anymore -- of him stumbling, tumbling or super napping. No jive! I can come up with the reel of the real. But Imma stand back and hide in plain sight and let promotion does what it does -- hide damaging stuff. And let the damaged come up with bluff after bluff how he's going to be so tough and rough. And is gonna upset the world twice. And next year take down Money May. Okay!



But this is what Da Manny is planning in Macau http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90y8vSjQNNI. Translation = sleep face down not, but to assure that will likely be the position of C-Al -- a now rich C-Al. Holla!

Reply

stormcentre:

"John is a good guy and an equally good judge. I am thrilled the assignment was given to him.

I am sure, if it goes to the cards, even in a lose fight, Johnny Mac will have the right man winning!

-Randy G."


Randy, in your opinion does John have the gumption to pull Mayweather up (and penalize him) for using the elbow, in a big fight like this?

Reply

UrSuperHero:

why does chris deserve this ? why isnt he rematching pod? why he thinks he can punch an bs the public is shamefull.. he cant punch. why is this ppv ? thers no way in hell this fight is going to be exciting.. chris couldnt tie the shoes of any pac oponent cept rios.. clottey smashes this dude worse than manny will..

Reply

kenhissner:

Are you out of your mind? To come back after being off for 2 years against the most feared fighter in all of boxing? Pavlik was my favorite fighter when he retired and today its GGG. No way would I want to see that fight.

Reply

stormcentre:

I personally can't see anything but a mire clear cut win for Floyd this time round.

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The Commish:

"along with referee Kenny Bayless. Good for John. I remember John Mckaie and Tony Paolillo when they were trainers at the Lost Battalion Hall boxing club in Queens Ny. Bayless is a solid referee. No complaints about any of the officials for this card."

John is a good guy and an equally good judge. I am thrilled the assignment was given to him.

I am sure, if it goes to the cards, even in a lose fight, Johnny Mac will have the right man winning!

-Randy G.

Reply

amayseng:

"I don't get why they don't do something like that. 1 on 1. Do THAT for charity. Don't know who would win.

Someone should bring that to their attention!"


Pac would whoop Floyd in basketball.

I would destroy Floyd in basketball. He does not have basketball coordination and skills.

Reply

The Commish:

That loss in kickboxing was years ago. Chris Algieri did not have anywhere near the training, conditioning, skill or knowledge that he has now.

KTFO'd? He sure did get KRFO'd. But that was nothing compared to the face-down nap Da' Manny took just two years ago.

I recognize Pacquiao as an all-time great, a lock to make the Hall-of-Fame on his first year of eligibility. However, he's not getting any younger...or faster...or more skillful...or better...or stronger. He will be outreached in this fight by a quick and skillful boxer.

Pacquiao is a great fighter. On November 22, there may still be plenty of greatness left inside of him. If that's the case, he'll beat Algieri and just about anybody on the other side of the ring from him.

But ifr he's slipping, we'll know it early in the fight. In that case, it will be a long night.

A long one for Manny Pacquiao.

-Randy G.

Reply

deepwater2:

Hector Camacho Jr had bought a annuity when he was fighting. He got $12000 a month every month I think.

Reply

Radam G:

"Nice post! Thanks.



Yes, broadcasters always front the guarantee and recoup on the back-end.



As I explained in another post, Showtime just committed to doing it six times -- hence the "endorsement" nature of the deal.



And hence why it is IMPOSSIBLE for Showtime and CBS to lose money on that deal.



Puck what motherpuckers tell you -- they already recouped their investment and then some!



They can't lose money. Impossible. Can't happen. Fact. (I'll break it down in a piece very soon.)



But there's a big difference between a broadcaster's advance to the promotion/promoter and a promoter's advance to a fighter.



One is bound to the event, another locks you up to your employer.



Gigantic difference!



(Especially when dude shouldn't even be paying back those advances in the first place; they're back-end monies from satellite.)



Other than that, nice info about Ali's retirent. It's OK but far from the heights a guy like Ali should've been to financially.



Where did you get those figures and how was that retirement set up?



Man, if Magic can beat AIDS, they should be able to cure my man Ali!!



Does he still sign autographs nowadays?"




It a nice, true story about the GOAT nowadays and how he is really doing in a May or June issues of the AARP magazine/newsletter/website.



I know the figures and retirement sets up about the GOAT from being in the loop with the same business and estate lawyers myself. Also many boxers get the hook up of a retirement (investment) policies that will pay them a certain amount of money starting at a certain age -- usually 35-years old -- for life.



The Louisville 10 Group guaranteed by investing in young Cassius Clay that the GOAT would get a lifetime retirement paid to him in after-boxing years. A Philadelphia Group did the same thing for the late, great Smokin' Joe Frazier. A group of business men did it for Sugar Ray Leonard and a lot ofother fighters. A lot of these fighters, who get set up with after-boxing years retirement policies, hardly ever make mid-life comebacks.



Some commissions -- California -- even give pugs some retirement money after a certain age. "The Sweet $cience" has even written a story to alert retired Cali pugs and those pugs who had fought in Cali numerous times to holla at retirement moolah waiting on them. Holla!

Reply

deepwater2:

If you were impressed with MM's endurance against little Floyd, then the first Castillo fight will have you awed. Castillo took Floyd's best jabs and swept the later rounds in their first fight. That's why HBO's Harold L scored it 115-111 for Castillo. If you thought Lara lost to Canelo then the result of this fight would of had you yelling fix. The compubox numbers help tell the story : 173 power punches landed compared to 66.

203 total punches compared to 157. 8th grade Cuban school was in session.



Jabs Castillo Mayweather

Landed 30 91

Thrown 129 297

Percent 23% 31%

Power Punches Castillo Mayweather

Landed 173 66

Thrown 377 151

Percent 46% 44%

Total Punches Castillo Mayweather

Landed 203 157

Thrown 506 448

Percent 40% 35%

Reply

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